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Main Forums => Child Support Issues => Topic started by: stwbshort on Jan 16, 2004, 08:36:38 PM

Title: child support - back owed
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 16, 2004, 08:36:38 PM
2 1/2 yrs ago, I left MO, an abusive ex-boyfriend, and moved my daughter and myself back home to OH.  He filed for custody and child support through MO and won due to financial reasons.  This past July, my daughter told me her dad was sexually abusing her (in 5 yr old terms)  and we reported it.  MO did an investigation and he is now sitting in jail awaiting trial for 13 charges, 8 statutory sodomy 1st digree, 4 statutory rape 1st digree, 1 explotin of a minor felony A  (he could take a plea but either way they have enough evidence on him that he will never get out).  I tried to file with legal aid in MO to modify the custody order, but was denied (odly enough by the attorney I had 2 1/2 yrs ago when I fought my ex-boyfriend  for custody) due to the fact "the limited resources of our agency make it impossible for us to accept many applications for services."    So, after long investigation on my part, I found out I could file in the county I live in for custody and they would possibly take jurisdiction over MO.  I was told I would have to wait for a trial date and the case would be heard infront of a madjestrate or a judge and they would decide if OH would hear the case or if I would have to go through MO to handle this matter.  (thats not for another 3 to 6 months)  

  I owe back support. OH is now coming after me for MO in the amount of  $3333.76.  I am trying to find out what is owed to the state (because of him being on medicade and food stamps) and what is supposed to go to him.  I don't believe that the whole amount is owed the state.  I also don't believe that I should have to pay any part of the money back that is owed, since he obviously will not be able to pay me child support for the rest of his life. He has already taken enough from me and my daughter and this would be taking more. I just can't see paying a couple thousand dollars to a man that will be sitting in jail for the rest of his life. Is there something I can file or some other place I can look for a pro-bono attorney in MO to handle this?  I just don't know what to do anymore.  I've had about enough of the run-around from all of these legal people.  If anyone can help I would really appreciate it.

Frustrated Struggling Mother
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 17, 2004, 07:24:29 PM
  HMMM, Sounds like you need to get a job. Your not helpless, there are a ton of jobs out there. You just have to get one. If you have one, get another one. Support your child yourself, By living off the states you are living off of us.

   IF your ex did what you say he did then D**N him.  If you have manipulated all this yourself, then D**N you.  

   If he went so far out of his way to get custody, then it would seem to me that he just wanted to do what alot of REAL men want to do and that is to be a father to their child, not to go out of their way to get custody to molest them.  

Sorry for the Blunt response, but I don't believe hardly anything people say about their ex anymore.  I believe it's over dramatized and destroys innocent peoples lives.  Before you follow through with trying to send this man away for the rest of his life, remember only you and your daughter know the truth.  If he did not do what you say he did and you are doing this to dodge the child support or to win custody back, then you should be the one in jail for the rest of your life!  If it is true, then D**N him! I know how the courts like to add and multiply charges to the insane from personal experience. They will lock up 9 innocent men just to make sure they get 1 that is actually guilty.

P.S Refer to my post "MY 2 Cents"

Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 17, 2004, 09:16:22 PM
ok, i never said i didn't have a job.  my daughter is being very well taken care of.  she has everything she needs and most of what she wants.   my family and i give her all the love and attention that we possibly can.  

as for the charges, here is a way that i can prove that this is true.  go to    http://casenet.osca.state.mo.us/casenet/                                  select under circuit courts    24th judicial circuit     then choose   case number   under search method.  type in    03cr615247.  then click the case number that is underlined.  then  click on the                                 charges/jdmt/sentence   button.  that will bring up all the charges on him.  the prosecuting attorney has video tape of these disgusting things that he did to her as evidence found in his home. Yes the sick SOB taped himself raping his little 4 year old little girl, not only on one occassion. The investigator thinks it has been going on for an extensive period of time.

here is a link to the article written in his local newspaper about it.
http://www.mydjconnection.com/?search=go&o=0&l=20&s=recent&r=&d1=8-1-03&d2=today&q=corssen

my ex filed for custody because he is a control freak.  always has been.  i understand your feelings about bashing ex's, but this unfortunately is one of the cases where what i have told you is all very sickeningly real.

my daughter wakes up at night screaming for him to stop.  sometimes she cries for an hour or more even though she is not awake, and there is nothing that i've tried that can calms her down.  she is being put in counseling very soon.  hopefully that will help.

i'm just looking for some advice and a little bit of help. I wont be able to support her, myself, counseling, and the attorny fees to handel all of this. Let alone pay him back from past child support
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 18, 2004, 12:06:45 PM
    Okay, unfortunately none of that shows any PROOF and I already found a major flaw in the story with the little bit of info you have given me.  That tics me off!

     As for the money, you owe it you pay it. Be done with it, or YOU go to jail. If I could get away with only 3,333.00 I would be extatic. Mind you though even though I feel that the main custodial parent is the one who should provide the major financial support.  

     You had a relationship with this guy at one point. You did the deed just as much as he did.  It doesn't surprise me to hear you say he was abusive.  My ex said the same thing and guess what, I have never laid a hand on her out of anger in anyway.  She is ticked off at me because I told her I was going to go for custody of our daughter.  In my situation I see it as she is trying to KILL me by trying to send me to jail for the rest of my life.  It's disgusting and I now in my own mind classify her as a murderer.  The fact that she is so selfish, irresponsible, and vindictive enough because she is afraid of losing custody that she would attempt to have me locked up for life, tells me exactly where she needs to be.  People like HER should be locked up for life, they are the most dangerous people next to serial killers.  
 
     A man spent 10 yrs. of his life in prison for a child molestion case.  Only after that time did his children finally set their father free because the mother had told them to tell the lies.  Guess what, she's in jail now right where SHE should have been in the first place.

     Let me ask you this.  I don't want to know anymore details, and again only you know the truth. This is no longer about you dodging what you owe. Jail is just a living death.  Do you think he should die for what you SAY happened?
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 18, 2004, 01:34:49 PM
ok, i am not your ex.  i am not a vindictive little b****.  i am a very loveing honest christian woman who loves her daughter very much.  I don't know where this flaw could be because this whole thing is completely true.  and no, i DON'T think he should die.  i think he will pay for what he did here on earth and when he does die.  

i think you sir need some serious counseling.  you have some major issues with woman.  not all women lie.  not all woman cheat.  not all woman turn their kids against their fathers.  i never did.  i got messed up with the wrong person.  i payed for it.  

i read your post, and i am very sorry for what you have been and are still going through, if YOU are telling the truth, only YOU know.  my situation was caught on video tape.

 i don't have to prove myself to you. apparently in your eyes i am a lier.  i am very sorry you see me like that.  i am posting my story to try to get some help, not to get harrassed and be called a lier.  
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: momof5 on Jan 18, 2004, 01:39:48 PM
Hi, I'm previously lisamnrix - i liked this new userid better!!  :))))

here's my 2 cents!!

It is a terrible situation however, it sounds to me like you are only concerned about the $$.

It's like someone talking about their parents assets at their funeral.  It's not appropriate.

Maybe you aren't only concerned about the $$ but you sure do give that impression.

Good luck to you.  My prayers go out to you and your daughter.  May justice be done!!

Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 18, 2004, 01:46:06 PM
i'm not just concerned about the money.  but when paying back over $3000 would be taking away from my daughter, yes i am concerned.  this man will be sitting in jail for the rest of his life, why should he receive money that is ment for support of my daughter after he did what he did to her?  i don't mean to sound hostile, but i just don't get it.   and thank you for your prayers, we can definetly use them.
Title: Ok...
Post by: sweetnsad on Jan 18, 2004, 02:22:59 PM
I read your post a day or so ago and thought about how to respond...I didn't know what to say that would be any help at all...

The feeling I got from it, is that you are more concerned about the money you owe rather than the hell your daughter has gone through...I know that if it were me, the money would be the last of my worries and I would concentrate on making sure that this man pays for what he did, if he did it.   Then, and only then, would I try to rectify the whole arrears matter if you feel it isn't justified....but, I'm pretty sure that if you owe it, you pay it, no matter what....

Now, don't get me wrong..I'm not saying that you don't love and care for your daughter...I'm sure you do...but your initial post gave a different impression.  I'm sure it wasn't intentional.

As for the responses from Mustang...I think you owe this lady an apology...maybe you don't like what she had to say and you think she is "making it all up"...well that's not for anyone of us to decide and a benefit of the doubt would have come in handy here.  Your own personal experiences have spilled out as anger towards this woman and THAT, my friend, is entirely UNFAIR....

Good luck to you hon, and I hope you and your daughter get the help you will need to get through this.
Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 18, 2004, 03:01:29 PM
i didn't mean to come accross as caring only about money issues.  my daughter superseeds anything in this world.  but when i am a single mom taking care of my daughter and trying to survive,   it is about the money .  i don't make $60,000 or $90,000 a year.  I make between $20,000 and $40,000.  what it boils down to is the fact that my daughter will have to deal with this for the rest of her life.  she will probably have to have counseling for the rest of her life, and if that is what she needs, i will make sure she gets it.  but why should my daughter have to suffer having TO deal with this for the rest of her life, while he sits back getting something good out of it.  ie.  money while he is sitting in jail.

i have worked with the dfs, police departments and prosecuting attorney from day one.  i made sure i gave them ALL the information i had, to help them as best as i could.  i am still working with them and will continue to.  

not too many people do know what to say, but  i appreciate any help,  support, (and if you believe in God) prayers.
Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 18, 2004, 05:37:42 PM
As far as the arrearages and what the state paid for your daughter,, I dont think there is any way to erase that. It's levied against you and Im afraid you will either be forced to pay it or serve time. Regardless of your ex molesting your daughter. That has no bearing on what you owe.

It's a problem too many parents face. pay up or go to jail,, and trust me, they WILL incarcerate you.

As far as your ex....if he did this, he will definately have a pleasant time in prison. Videotaped evidense? Of him sexually molesting his daughter??? If that truly exists, then its a slamdunk case.

Your daughter ,,no words will ever do there. Get her the help she needs.
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 18, 2004, 05:44:19 PM
I went and read the documents that are on file at the provided court addy,, what major flaw are you talking about?
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 18, 2004, 05:55:22 PM
>    Okay, unfortunately none of that shows any PROOF and I
>already found a major flaw in the story with the little bit of
>info you have given me.  That tics me off!

Kindly enlighten us. What I've seen from the newspaper article and court documents TICS ME off, but NOT at this mother.
>
>     As for the money, you owe it you pay it. Be done with it,
>or YOU go to jail. If I could get away with only 3,333.00 I
>would be extatic. Mind you though even though I feel that the
>main custodial parent is the one who should provide the major
>financial support.  

Mustang, we ALL have our personal axes to grind. She owes the money, despite what her ex was doing.
>
>     You had a relationship with this guy at one point. You
>did the deed just as much as he did.  It doesn't surprise me
>to hear you say he was abusive.  My ex said the same thing and
>guess what, I have never laid a hand on her out of anger in
>anyway.  She is ticked off at me because I told her I was
>going to go for custody of our daughter.  In my situation I
>see it as she is trying to KILL me by trying to send me to
>jail for the rest of my life.  It's disgusting and I now in my
>own mind classify her as a murderer.  The fact that she is so
>selfish, irresponsible, and vindictive enough because she is
>afraid of losing custody that she would attempt to have me
>locked up for life, tells me exactly where she needs to be.
>People like HER should be locked up for life, they are the
>most dangerous people next to serial killers.  

No arguement that false accusations occur, the EVIDENSE collected on THIS case has resulted in bond being set at MILLIONS withOUT option of posting 10%. Once again, you are grinding on your own ax. I'm sorry you are getting a bumrush, just as I am for all parents suffering from this. Do you really look at this case as a wild dreamed up fabrication????
>
>     A man spent 10 yrs. of his life in prison for a child
>molestion case.  Only after that time did his children finally
>set their father free because the mother had told them to tell
>the lies.  Guess what, she's in jail now right where SHE
>should have been in the first place.

Good, fine. Bully for lockin up a lyin assed parent. Needs to happen in everycase. Let me guess, the poster here cooked up a CGI tape showing the abuse, drove from another state, planted the computer generated tape of him raping his daughter, then called the cops. Now, she cant pay 3k in back support, BUT she can cook up a multimillion dollar CGI tape. Riiiight.
>
>     Let me ask you this.  I don't want to know anymore
>details, and again only you know the truth. This is no longer
>about you dodging what you owe. Jail is just a living death.
>Do you think he should die for what you SAY happened?

If he did it,, damn right he should die for it. But then, Im funny that way,, hurt my child, I'll hunt you to the ends of the earth.
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 18, 2004, 06:09:08 PM
>2 1/2 yrs ago, I left MO, an abusive ex-boyfriend, and moved
>my daughter and myself back home to OH.  He filed for custody
>and child support through MO and won due to financial reasons.
> This past July, my daughter told me her dad was sexually
>abusing her (in 5 yr old terms)  and we reported it.  MO did
>an investigation and he is now sitting in jail awaiting trial
>for 13 charges, 8 statutory sodomy 1st digree, 4 statutory
>rape 1st digree, 1 explotin of a minor felony A  (he could
>take a plea but either way they have enough evidence on him
>that he will never get out).  I tried to file with legal aid
>in MO to modify the custody order, but was denied (odly enough
>by the attorney I had 2 1/2 yrs ago when I fought my
>ex-boyfriend  for custody) due to the fact "the limited
>resources of our agency make it impossible for us to accept
>many applications for services."    So, after long
>investigation on my part, I found out I could file in the
>county I live in for custody and they would possibly take
>jurisdiction over MO.  I was told I would have to wait for a
>trial date and the case would be heard infront of a
>madjestrate or a judge and they would decide if OH would hear
>the case or if I would have to go through MO to handle this
>matter.  (thats not for another 3 to 6 months)  

Its terrible to be where you are. You can, with a little self education, file on your own for a custody mod and jurisdiction change. Him being locked up will help that along.
>
>  I owe back support. OH is now coming after me for MO in the
>amount of  $3333.76.  I am trying to find out what is owed to
>the state (because of him being on medicade and food stamps)
>and what is supposed to go to him.  I don't believe that the
>whole amount is owed the state.  I also don't believe that I
>should have to pay any part of the money back that is owed,
>since he obviously will not be able to pay me child support
>for the rest of his life. He has already taken enough from me
>and my daughter and this would be taking more. I just can't
>see paying a couple thousand dollars to a man that will be
>sitting in jail for the rest of his life. Is there something I
>can file or some other place I can look for a pro-bono
>attorney in MO to handle this?  I just don't know what to do
>anymore.  I've had about enough of the run-around from all of
>these legal people.  If anyone can help I would really
>appreciate it.

Unfortunately, despite what has occured, and the fact you will more than likely never see a dime, you do owe the back money and they will either collect it, or lock you up.  I am not sure about where you are, BUT, you MAY be able to request an administrative hearing with cse for an accounting of the money owed and arrange terms. Dont let it get to the warrant stage of proceedings.
>
>Frustrated Struggling Mother
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 18, 2004, 06:21:03 PM
OMG! Thank the Lord you were able to get your child away from this man!

I read all of these posts, and the links given. I see not one reason in this for you to be attacked.
I will pray for your daughters recovery.

According to the list of charges and the newspaper post this story is not fictional!

Yes you do owe the money, unfortunatly. You can when you go to deal with this set up a payment plan with the courts.Let them know your income, the bills you pay, including childcare, and let them know you can pay xx$ each month to pay it back. Let them know it is a debt that you have every intention to pay, even NCP's with arrearages only pay a portion with the normal cs payments.
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 18, 2004, 06:55:20 PM
>Its terrible to be where you are. You can, with a little self education, file on your own for a custody mod and jurisdiction change. Him being locked up will help that along.


I've already filed for the custody.  I won't hear when I have a court date for 3 to 6 months.  With me living in oh for as long as I have and now my daughter living here for 6 months, and the circumstances, I don't think it will be a problem having OH take over jurisdiction and awarding me custody.  (at least I hope jurisdiction won't be a problem).

>Unfortunately, despite what has occured, and the fact you will more than likely never see a dime, you do owe the back money and they will either collect it, or lock you up. I am not sure about where you are, BUT, you MAY be able to request an administrative hearing with cse for an accounting of the money owed and arrange terms.  Dont let it get to the warrant stage of proceedings.

I am already in discussion process with cs (trying to get ahold of the case worker) and the prosecuting attorney in OH.  
Here's a question.  If I do have to start paying it back, do you think I can file for support from him (which would be  prisoner state wages) and what ever i had sent,  would be sent back to us?

Thanks for the help!  
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 18, 2004, 07:08:01 PM
What I would do,, is get it negiated thru cse.
Title: No Apology here.
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 09:30:33 AM
   No, I will not apologize.  In this country we are supposed to be INNOCENT until PROVEN guilty.  
 
   I am EXTREMELY disgusted with the fact that a parent can harm their child in anyway!  But, Peanut, have you seen the video?

   When me and my ex were together and my daughter was about 5 months old, we went to Walmart to take pictures of our daughter.  My ex wanted to pose my daughter laying on her stomach naked with no diaper.  I said fine, I thought it would be cute.  The walmart associate said "no, we can't do that anymore" she said they consider that a form of child pornagraphy.  Wow! You mean to tell me that MY parents have child porn pictures of ME? All of our parents need to be arrested for it now. There is no statute of limitations, so why not?

   I have a VIDEO TAPE too by the way.  But in that video tape it shows my ex doing something to me that the police now have me charged with!  The funny thing is I have talked to a couple of lawyers and they said that the prosecutor will not do a cross-warrant on her!  I have VIDEO TAPED evidence.  But you see, she got to file a charge first, so now I'm screwed.  This VIDEO TAPE which the prosecutor has not had a chance to see proves my innocence.  I wish I could fill you in with more but I cannot.

   The Prosecutor said that they have evidence against me.  Ha! I can't wait to see what it is, because there can't be any because nothing happened! So, it's obvious to me that my ex not only just tried to take a legal maneuver  to keep me from going for custody of my daughter but the prosecutor is so desperate to throw 9 innocent men in jail just to get the 1 who is truly guilty that they are willing to make up evidence to support themselves.  

   It's a witch hunt out there and I wonder what the video tape of that guy and his daughter actually have on it.  Lets see, bathroom video maybe of him giving her a bath? Changing her clothes? Well unfortunately in this upside down world now if any of that is caught on tape it is illegal.  So, a warning to all you parents out there.  Don't video tape your children growing up because it will be used against you somehow in the future.
    $1,000,000.00 bond doesn't mean he is guilty, it means that the prosecutor made multiple and multiple charges and SAID they have this evidence against him. The Judge does not get to see the evidence when he makes the bond. He just looks at the seriousness of the charges and how many there are and goes on the prosecutors word and usually this is all takes place before the defendant gets a chance to speak to a lawyer.  

    Also, Peanut read everything strwbry has stated closely, and you will find something you didn't expect.  I will not say what it is because that is evidence for the defense.
    I will not apologize. I will not retract my statements. Have either of you been on the other side? Charged with something you didn't do and face long term jail time while the prosecutor and police try to make whatever evidence they can? It's a feeling you can't explain, but it opens your eyes to reality of the CRIMINAL actions that prosecutors take to try and throw INNOCENT people in jail.  
    I use to just go about my everyday life and didn't pay much attention to people being locked up. It was their life not mine, and I figured they must have done it if they are locked up.  Now with research I have been doing, I am completely flabergasted to see how many men have spent a good portion of their life in jail for crimes they did not commit and when they are finally freed, they get no apology and no restitution for their 10 20 30 years spent behind bars.  
    Okay, back to you strwbry.  If this man is guilty he will most likely plead guilty to lesser charges. They will drop most of the charges on him and he will spend jail time, but with a guilty plea he will probably be looking at around 20 yrs with something like 10 yrs suspended and several months already served for the time he was in there.  So, As happy as you sound about you thinking he is going to be sitting in jail for the rest of his life isn't going to happen.  He didn't kill anyone did he? He will pay for his crime if guilty but he will still have a life afterwards and you will still responsible for the back support.
    By the way, no offense but, A judge will throw a man in jail in a heartbeat for not paying his child support.  How did you manage not to be jailed for not doing what is right?
    Hey peanut, if I were to sit back and take everything for everybodies word I would have to say then that this poor child really needs to be in the care of her grandparents because by just hearsay this poor little girl has a perverted father and an irresponsible mother.
   I pray for the truth and justice of all in this matter and bless this little girl for she is the only true innocent.

   





Title: Here's the irony
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 10:24:06 AM
   Here's the irony.  When I was a child, I was molested by more than one person.  As a matter of fact there are 6 children in my family and each one of us was molested.  We were all molested at different times and different people. I never told anyone.  2 of the persons were found out later on for a different incident and charged with molestation. One of them served jail time for several years and when they got out they died a few years later.  I have been fortunate enough to realize there is nothing wrong with me and have never needed therapy for my past, because I know it is just that, my past.  The one who went to jail was raped in jail and contracted AIDS and died.  I was never angry at these people and death is not what I would have wanted for any of them.  You see what they needed was psychological help, not a death sentence.  I still know and talk to the other ones who molested me.  I see them as troubled but not dangerous people.  I do know that the other ones did get the help they needed and are now very fine outstanding citzens. I don't know of a single friend of mine that hasn't told me of molestation in their past.  This tells me it is a bigger problem than any of us can even fathom.  If we were to jail all of these people for the rest of there lives then I believe most of your own families would be in jail right now.  I DO NOT condone this behavior, but I believe we need to come together as a people and make serious changes as to the way people are taught to grow up.  Our society is guilty for most of these happenings.  There are hardly any stay at home parents anymore and molestation usually happens when the parents are at work.  Nothing started happening to us until my mother went from being a stay at home mother to working as much as my father did. That was a big reason for my telling my ex that I wanted her to be a stay at home mom so that my daughter would always be looked after and not be caught in one of these sad situations.  You see I took from this situation and learn from it so that I would provide my own child with what she would need to be protected and cared for. Unfortunately my situation has now completely crashed around me.
    Needless to say, in our crazy messed up world, some people like to hold themselves as being better than others and God forbid if they think you have done something wrong because they will send you to jail for life just so they don't have to think about you.  What we need here people is studies and provide the help needed for both sides to understand the difference of right and wrong.  We need psychological help for those who need it.  Strwbry's ex need's some serious therapy if he did these things.  But if he is thrown in jail or say 5-10 yrs., when he gets out he will pobably be worse of a human being and have his eyes set out to definately try and harm people then.  So, that's the way the cookie crumbles.  
    When I am angry I speak in words not fists, so peanut and strwbry I will only apologize for being so blunt with my words.  If he did do this strwbry it is your right to be ticked off and want revenge.  But let me ask you this.  Do you believe he should die?
    Also, I might sound angry alot of times but the reality is that I try now to get people to look at what they are doing and saying about others and start to open their own eyes to what reality actually is.  Not to be vindictive or hateful, but to be understanding and take the steps needed to get help for those who need it and most of all help yourself and not rely on everyone else.  
    I am now facing some serious charges that could land me in jail for a minimum of 20 yrs to life.  Well just so you know I will tell you what the outcome will be: NOT GUILTY.  I can tell you this though. I am tired and emotionally exhausted now for what the BM has done to me.  I said she should be in jail for this, but the reality is she needs to go back to therapy.  I did nothing wrong but do to the criminal justice system I do feel I may give up on trying to be a father because I can only see more allegations in the future and she won't stop until she has me put away, and all just because she doesn't want to lose custody of our daughter, even partial.
    People people people.  Stop this insanity.  Love your children, and stop hating because one day someone will probably end up doing the same thing to you if you don't.
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 10:27:50 AM
-----I know how the courts like to add and multiply charges to the insane from personal experience. -----

It was explained to me by my public defender.  They add and multiply charges to make SURE that "something" sticks.  I agree with you, District Attorneys want to slam dunk whoever for a crime, as they only want a win.  

Take my case for example.  I was facing 6 years in prison for something I didn't commit.  Would you like to hear the "evidence"?  The "weapon" mysteriously disappeared...there  was no weapon.  Why?  Because monster had this weapon illegally...he got rid of it for that reason...but also because my fingerprints would NEVER have been found on it as I never touched it.  This particular "weapon" is something I disagree with having.  

There were 4 different versions of the story.  And I'm not talking "slight" differences, I'm talking different rooms the "incident" happening in.  One room was the bedroom, with him sitting on the bed.  One room was the living room with him sitting on the recliner.  One version said I had my son in my arms as I attempted to kill monster.  Another version said he had no clue where my son was.  

There was another interesting piece of evidence.  I was at work, and had a time card proving this.  I didn't rely on my printed out schedule, I relied on my time card.  My time card wasn't the "usual" time card, it was a receipt.  We used the cash register, typed PLU 1 then cash, it then printed out a "receipt" just seconds before turning on the alarm, a receipt that had the exact time on it.  Not only that, but it was MY security code typed into the alarm system at 815pm on the night in question.  My boss and coworker were both willing to testify to this.  

And to go further....the "alledged" crime happened at 744pm.  When confronted with the information about me being at work, it suddenly changed to 844pm.  What's funny about that...and something I couldn't prove, was that I didn't get home til 5 after 9pm as I took the bus at 823pm which dropped me off a mile from monsters home.  If I could prove it, i'm sure the time would have changed to 944pm.

And to top it all off?  The alledged crime happened on the 8th of this particular month...he never made mention of it to ANYONE until 4 days later when I finally got up the nerve to leave my abuser.  Isn't that interesting?  

The police and investigators went hog wild on this one...but in EVERY report written by anyone are the words "monster refuses to cooperate with authorities".  IOW...he lied, then didn't want to go through with it because he KNEW he lied...and couldn't keep a story straight.  He gave the "bare minimum" to the officers...and that bare minimum is where we got all the different versions.  Of course...one thing he did say was that he was in terrible fear for his life.  Wouldn't you have reported this "crime" the moment it happened?

After reading this, you're probably thinking I was "let off" due to insufficient evidence, or "dismissed" because of "whatever".  No.  The prosecutor wanted my ass in jail for 6 years.  She had NO evidence, she had NO case...simply put, she had all the proof in the world that NOTHING happened....but wanted a "win".  

She made my life a living hell for 53 weeks.  With all the stupid little hearings, motions, settings, bullshit this, bullshit that...and then all along the way offered me plea after plea.  She did this because she KNEW she was going to lose...and if I pled down, she could still get a form of "win".

I KNOW people are prosecuted with no evidence.  I KNOW people are sentenced to jail on basically no evidence.  I KNOW the system sucks.  However, I've read the case and the article in the paper and find that this "monster" more than likely did molest this child.  I can't see any "faults"...and trust me, I WANTED to find it.  I wasn't reading it to find out about the case, I was looking for faults but found none.

ps...the day this DA fights to be elected a Judge is the day her and I go face to face...since my 'ordeal' I promised myself that she will NEVER become a Judge.  

Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 11:23:34 AM
-----As far as the arrearages and what the state paid for your daughter,, I dont think there is any way to erase that. It's levied against you and Im afraid you will either be forced to pay it or serve time. -----

PD?  I remember a big thread where Dedicated_Dad jumped in.  It was about this very thing...an NCP having to pay back welfare debts the CP has racked up.  What I remember him saying is that there isn't one law saying the NCP must pay for the CP's state bill.

He said most NCP's are "bombarded" with threats by the social service people that they'll go to jail, but DD said that was completely untrue...unless SS has managed to get the NCP to sign a form acknowledging the debt is theirs.

Title: What a PILE OF...
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 11:48:34 AM
WHAT A PILE OF CLAP CRAP!!!
----We need psychological help for those who need it. Strwbry's ex need's some serious therapy if he did these things. But if he is thrown in jail or say 5-10 yrs., when he gets out he will pobably be worse of a human being and have his eyes set out to definately try and harm people then. So, that's the way the cookie crumbles.
----
---I do know that the other ones did get the help they needed and are now very fine outstanding citzens. ---

A child molester should go to JAIL! Then they can find out what it was THEY did to their VICTIMS! What they are doing IS criminal!
How can you say all they need is therapy to GET OVER being that???
Every study that has been done on these digusting people shows that they do NOT change just because they talk to others about it.

If you did not do this then I hope to the heavens you are treated as such. True child molesters NEVER change their ways, they just get better at hiding it! And they get more and more vicious as they go.

If you think I have anger on this issue, your right I do.
Guess what I have the right to have that anger.
Title: RE: kiddosmom...
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 11:59:46 AM
I have just written 3 different responses to this post.  I deleted all of them out of my wordpad. I had a post that was EXTREME, I had a post that went off, and the other was a mixture of the two. I couldn't post any of them. This poster is in denial, and that is VERY dangerous.  I do see that this poster is screaming for help, without coming right out with it...because denial is taking over.  

I'm not a doctor, a therapist, or anyone "qualified" to diagnose or give advice on this...I'm just a little no one...but I think this person needs MASSIVE amounts of help to pull him out of denial.  mustang has demons he must face......demons that are taking over his entire world.

No one in their right mind would "defend" someone who destroyed their life...."in their right mind", I will say again.  mustang is asking for help for those who destroy lives...but no help for those who's lives were destroyed.  That, my dear, is extreme denial.  

IN MY OPINION ONLY!  
Title: Agreed .... (eom)
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 12:07:23 PM
...
Title: RE: What a PILE OF...
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 12:35:34 PM
    Oh, yeah, I forgot to mention that of course I realize there are many of them who will not change and yes, those ones do need to be locked up somewhere.  I'm not saying to free James Manson here.  What I am saying is that you have to look at each individual person and find out what the heck is going on in his head and see what can be done.  We do not have that right now and many innocent people are being locked up for something they did not due because some selfish person wants to keep their child to themselves and not share custody.  This goes for BOTH men and women.  
Title: Monster
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 12:45:53 PM
   Well, I am not happy at all that that happened to you, but finally, I think I have found someone who can actually say they know how I feel.
Did you sue that Monster for perjury and try to get him to pay for your lawyer's fees? That is the step I am going to take as soon as my ordeal is over.
   There should be someone else linked to every prosecutor to oversee any submitted evidence and ensure the prosecutor is not just out for a win.  You situation should have never went that far.  We all know the real monster- the prosecutors- have absolutely no fear or care about what they are doing even when they know the alleged person is not guilty.  They just want to boost there own pocket books. Pathetic.
Title: RE: Monster
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 01:20:23 PM
-----Well, I am not happy at all that that happened to you, but finally, I think I have found someone who can actually say they know how I feel.-----

I feel you...loud and clear.  I wish you didn't feel me, though.  I'd like to be the only one who's ever experienced a false accusation...but the truth is, most NCP's go through this.

-----Did you sue that Monster for perjury and try to get him to pay for your lawyer's fees? -----

No, I didn't.  I was told I should, but what's the point?  I'll tell you what made me feel good.  Not only being found not guilty, but my verdict was the quickest in Colorado history.  I didn't even have time to ride the elevator down 2 floors before my public defender said "well, they've reached a verdict".  THAT...is a good feeling.  Also, he's known for his false accusations now.  He tried to have my husband arrested 3 different times in as many weeks for "attempting to kill him" but the police shot his accusations down because he's a liar.

-----That is the step I am going to take as soon as my ordeal is over.-----

Do NOT do this.  And here is why.  This is all entangled in a custody case.  Very dangerous.  I read your "2 cents" post and based on what you say of your ex?  Don't aggravate the situation any more.  What is a lawsuit going to bring you?  I know...another false accusation and more hell.  When justice is served and you are found not guilty...leave it at that.  It's gonna be hard, but do not do this for revenge.  

-----There should be someone else linked to every prosecutor to oversee any submitted evidence and ensure the prosecutor is not just out for a win. -----

Ya...well, that overwhelming desire they have to win...that's all that matters to ANYONE in the DA's office.  

-----You situation should have never went that far. -----

Tell me about it.  I can't begin to tell you the pain I felt.  See, I went and got myself pregnant during my trial process.  My daughter was a month and a half old when I went to trial.  While at trial, all I could think was "oh my god...i won't see my baby until she's in the 1st grade".  That is something NO ONE should ever experience...unless they're guilty.  

-----We all know the real monster- the prosecutors- have absolutely no fear or care about what they are doing even when they know the alleged person is not guilty. -----

They should be held responsible for their actions...but just like Judges/GAL's/Lawyers/Evaluators/Mediators/(enter any court person here)...no one is accountable for their own actions.

-----They just want to boost there own pocket books. Pathetic.-----

Yep!  And become Judges and other elected officials!  Pathetic isn't a strong enough word to describe these people.

I have to advise you of something.  Get rid of the anger and DO IT NOW!!!!!!!  I know "why" you're angry, I believe you have a right to this feeling...BUT...it's not going to help you in either your criminal trial or custody.  Learn to relax...You need to.  Your going to wind up causing yourself a heart attack...and then where will your child be?  You need to get strong for this child...











Title: RE: Here's the irony
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 01:27:33 PM
ok, child molesters will do it again.  this man raped my daughter, thought he would get away with it, and now there is an investigation going on about the possibility of him being charged for the abuse of another child.  
people who know they have a problem are the only ones who will benefit from counseling. child molesters don't believe they have a problem.  if you put all molesters in counseling instead of jail, the children in this already screwed up world will be even more screwed up and possibly very violent because no one is being held accountable for what was done to them.  
"The second classification of sexual offender is defined as a preferential child molester. These offenders have a sexual preference for children and usually maintain these desires throughout their lives. Preferential child molesters can have an astounding number of victims and these crimes can remain undiscovered for many years. In 1995, a child molestation case in Texas caused a national uproar when the suspect was due to be released from prison after serving a six-year sentence for the rape of a 6year-old boy. He told the police that he got away with abusing over 240 children before getting caught for molesting a single child and if released, would do it again(4). One long-term study of hundreds of sex offenders found that the pedophile child molester committed an average of 281 acts with 150 partners. These types of offenders wreak havoc upon society far out of proportion to their numbers."
"Few pedophiles are able to resist their powerful urges to initiate sexual contact with children. As a result, child molesters often make efforts to gain access to or authority over children. They take jobs where children are easily approached, or they actively pursue youngsters by befriending parents (particularly single parents), attending events for children, coaching children¹s sports, chaperoning camping trips, frequenting video arcades, or offering baby-sitting services to friends, family, and neighbors with children.
The majority of pedophiles prefer children on the brink of puberty and prey on a child's sexual ignorance and curiosity. To quote one molester, "Give me a kid who knows nothing about sex, and you've given me my next victim."
Small groups of militant and highly organized child molesters operate worldwide through pedophile organizations, whose members claim genuine concern for the welfare of children. Their belief is that sex with children is harmless; some even claim that sexual relations are healthy for children. These groups' goals include decriminalizing child molestation and lowering the age of consent."
"A typical molester will abuse between 30 to 60 children before they are arrested - as many as 380 during their lifetime."
Do you really think there are programs  to HELP these people?  Studies have proven that they cannot be helped and they will continue to do this to others!
Title: You go girl!! (eom)
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 01:34:07 PM
...
Title: children first
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 01:42:49 PM
   Yes, I know, I think I am going to have a heart attack.  I felt numb up and down my left side the other day, so now I am taking an aspirin everyday.
   When you said you were afraid of not seeing your child until she reached the 1st grade I know there is no way of explaining that feeling unless you have gone through it like we have. That is what is bothering me the most. I'm not worried about the trial. I'm worried about how long they can drag this out and keep me from my child.  I first went the first 5 months of her life not being able to see her but for only a total of 48 hours even though I made 1000 mile trips every other weekend to go see her because the BM was UUUGGG, I can't describe it.  And now again, I can't see my daughter.  I haven't seen her since December the 9th and my lawyer says it could be alot longer and because of the type of charges I have no leg to stand on for trying to get custody. He said I have to get this over with first.  I think my anger is more over the fact that the court system is what is keeping me from my child and they just don't give a sh*t.  Somebody needs to create a law that allows alleged people to still see their children, with supervision, I wouldn't have a problem with that, it would atleast get me through most of this heartache.  I watch home movies of her for right now trying to fool myself into thinking I just saw her so its okay.  But it's not, I'm starting to cry right now as I type. gott go
Title: RE: No Apology here.
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 01:44:30 PM
an irresponsible mother doesn't pay over $7,000 in cs in less than a year and  a half.  she doesn't take on a second job so she can make sure she does see her kid,  pay cs, and try to manage a rent payment,  car payment, ins. etc.  i have always had a roof over my kids head, food in her stomach, & clothes on her back (even when i was getting phone calls from her father saying he couldn't afford to buy her a winter jacket or socks, i sent them to her.)
Title: RE: children first
Post by: sweetnsad on Jan 19, 2004, 01:57:18 PM
Are you for real?  You want us to pity you after the things you've said to strawberry?  This poster isn't about you, it's about her and I'm angry at some of the things you've said about her...you don't even know her.

I'm sorry if you are having problems, but don't expect pity when you are unkind to others.
Title: To be or not to be, that is the question.
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 02:05:11 PM
   hmmm. You have noted alot in that story. good job. however I am not here to defend the actions of those found guilty(unless they are innocent). I am defending the fact that there should be complete honesty on the side of the accusers and prosecutors.  I did find a flaw in one of your statements, just like prosecutors are so noted for, just to ensure his fate.  Be honest, tell only what you know and not what you think, and do not make things up.  If he is guilty, then the truth alone should be enough.  There is no question that I am speaking out of anger here.  But the reality is that when someone accuses you of doing something you didn't, and how easy it was for her to get the court system behind her, you all of a sudden feel for those accused because you know its happened to you, and its probably happening to them.  Don't think I am defending pedophiles. I am defending people who are locked up who haven't had their day in court.  Only then can we say he did it.  As for right now, he is innocent until proven guilty.
Title: RE: children first
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 02:10:41 PM
   If you would only pay attention to what she said and notice what I noticed then you would not be very with her either.  She is not in any danger, and i don't think I have hurt her feelings.  She is standing up for what she says and I am doing the same.  Go back and read her earlier posts and pay attention to what she said.  Be analitical and you should see. P.S. I don't want your pity.  Pity the children who are dragged through hell for all of this.
Title: Been there, feel for you guys!
Post by: KAT on Jan 19, 2004, 02:39:41 PM
And no, I don't think there is any apologizing necessary. UNLESS you have been falsely accused of child abuse, then you have no damn clue. These are shoes that have GOT to be walked in. And yes, I too speak from experience!!!! From a bioloon who had nothing better to do with her time but to research how to get custody from a FAMILY who took extremely good care of the children. Who went to a lawyer who told her, no chance unless there is abuse..well, dah BINGO!!! What the heck, she has an EXTENSIVE criminal record (crimes against humanity), bankrupt, court admitted adultress, there was no change in circumstances & no way she could prove us unfit…so unless..Unless she could coerce the kids into saying they were abused by us that was her only way. And she did so; one at a time…she worked them. Slowly. Like a cancer, you know that it has set in, but you are almost powerless to do anything about it.
It changes you. It jades you. I believe that most falsely accused persons suffer from post traumatic stress syndrome. I also believe that until criminal charges are routinely filed for filing false reports, perjury & coercion of children this isn’t going to stop, it’s only going to get worse. There are little legal consequences for lying in court, even if caught & these scums of the earth know that. The truth does not set you free anymore.
Fast forward in our case, lucky taxpayers you all…..we now have an 18 & 16 year old with 8th grade educations & criminal records. Are they selling drugs to your children? Are they marrying your sons or daughters? Will they be your in-laws? Are they having babies so that your son can pay support or your daughter can raise the baby alone? Is this what you want? They look so normal, they play on your heart strings. They will tell you how they were abused. *sniffle* Yeah, we have got to stop this pattern.
KAT
Title: RE: Been there, feel for you guys!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 02:56:29 PM
OK PEOPLE!
This is not about your personal vendeta's. Yes their are people out there who lie and make others suffer.
This women did not come here asking for your wrath, she came to ask for help.
Is every person who is in jail for molestaion as innocent as you were??
No they are not, please do not attack someone when they ask for help.
Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 19, 2004, 02:59:53 PM
Indi, if you can find that,, get it forwarded to strawberry.
Title: RE: HEY!!!!!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 03:02:38 PM
-----OK PEOPLE!
This is not about your personal vendeta's. -----

I hope you're not speaking about me...

-----This women did not come here asking for your wrath, she came to ask for help. -----

Yes, and I do believe she received alot of help.  I'm sorry for helping this thread go haywire, but honestly, kiddosmom...I see extreme pain and suffering, that which I can relate to.  I wasn't trying to take away from the original post...I simply wanted to help someone, even though some of his views make me scratch my own head.  I wanted to help another poster...which just so happened to be posting in this thread.

-----Is every person who is in jail for molestaion as innocent as you were?? -----

Absolutely NOT!  However, I do believe accusations made during custody battles are very interesting...indeed.  No, I don't believe the original posters ex is innocent at all.

-----No they are not, please do not attack someone when they ask for help.-----

I'm sorry to the original poster if she feels I'm attacking her.  That was NOT my intention.  Like I said, I saw a serious problem and wanted to help this guy...not insult the original poster.


Title: Indigo !!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 03:09:15 PM
LOL no dear I did not mean you!! No way no how :)
When you explain your situation, thats exactly what you do, you do not accuse the poster of doing the same.
Sorry I did not put that up there!

oops fixed mispelled name!
Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 03:10:08 PM
I don't think i can get that thread, it was on the old boards.  But he specifically said that there was NO law saying a non custodial parent has to pay for the welfare debt of a CP.

Come to think of it!  When monster went on the whole welfare shebang, I called them.  My son was "unofficially" living with me, and I thought it was pretty damned sick for him to be claiming lil dude to get more money and food stamps for himself...so I wanted him removed from monsters benefits, thinking I'm going to have to pay for that crackheads debt.  The social worker I spoke with said Colorado doesn't go after the NCP for welfare debts.  They also removed lil dudes "portion" of the welfare, reducing monsters bennies.  

I wish deeder was here to explain it...it was quite a long thread, if I remember right.  

Strawberry!  Call the department of social services...the welfare people...and ask him if your state goes after the NCP for CP debts.  Don't let them know "who" you are, though.
Title: RE: children first
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 03:10:12 PM
Why are you hiding what you think you have found wrong with her story. Why dont you come out and say it rather then keeping it a secret? I dont think you have found a flaw. I think you are just a miserable person that hates women. Why are you tring to make this person feel bad? She is just looking for help not humiliation. Have you even looked at the links she provided? How do you know the video tape does not show the father actualy melesting the child? What do you have against this person?
Title: RE: children first
Post by: sweetnsad on Jan 19, 2004, 03:16:23 PM
I CANNOT find any flaws with her story...how the hell could I when it's the only story I'm hearing??  The only way you could find a flaw is if you knew her and her story to begin with....
So enlighten us, Mustang...what is this "flaw" that has you so against the woman??
Title: RE: that's right!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 03:20:59 PM
ya best modify that sh*t to get my name spelled right!  LOL

Anyway, the reason I responded was because you were screaming at 'YOU PEOPLE'.  



Title: RE: Ok...
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 03:22:53 PM
i really appreciate the information.  i will call them tomorrow.  hopefully that will get me somewhere.  

thanks!

Title: RE: that's right!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 03:24:21 PM
:) Well you should KNOW you were not included in that! LOL
I meant the people attacking the poster, you were not.
Title: RE: children first
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 03:30:56 PM
-How do you know the video tape does not show the father actualy melesting the child?-

Exactly, how do you know it does? Like I said in an earlier post, Walmart won't take pictures of 5 month old babies without their diapers on because its now considered child porn. so what really is on that tape.
Read that same page where strwbry posted those links. Read it closely and think about it for a second.  At first I didn't see it but now I do.  Why would I give up the information voluntarily so she can change her story if this guy is innocent? I'm not trying to make her feel bad, I'm trying to make her be completely honest for all parties.  I don't have anything against her, I don't know her.  I see a problem with the story that you don't and I spoke my mind.  
   The only person that can even closely understand my situation I believe is Indigo because she has been put through it too.  Only when it happens to you will you ever truly understand because there are no words to explain it.
Title: RE: What a PILE OF...
Post by: MKx2 on Jan 19, 2004, 03:54:28 PM
[em]"A child molester should go to JAIL!"[/em]

******

kiddo ... I think you're WAY off base here.

Jail is FAR too good ... castration for a man and a sloppy circumcision for a woman - both performed with rusty tin can lids ... a bit harsh, I will agree, however I have HUGE issues with molestation, a ZERO tolerance level for it, and I speak from personal experience.

Nope - no tolerance, zero, zip, NADA!  Flame me if you will, but walk in my little ol' worn out moccasins first and then tell me you disagree.  :-)
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: hisliltulip on Jan 19, 2004, 04:03:23 PM
The great state of MN (cough, cough) came after my DH for $7,000 in back support for BM, and $5,000 to the state because of her being on welfare, and medicaid.  (They were separated for a long time, divorce finally granted almost four years later).

DH got an attorney, who went over everything.

Long story short she was awarded $0 in back support.

State dropped their claim to just under 3k.  Which he pays a monthly payment of, and they take his income tax returns.

See if you can work with the state to "pay them back", but to have the CS owed to him dropped in lieu of him not being able to contribute to cs for you.

BETH
Title: RE: children first
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 04:03:31 PM
  Read again closely. If you find it, fine, if not then to bad. All are innocent until proven guilty.  
Title: RE: What a PILE OF...
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 04:07:57 PM
Exactly Mk,,

But I still think they should go to jail so they can get a 'taste' of what they have done to a child.

Yes I left the pun in there on purpose.

I am afraid you are not the only one in in those moccasins :(
Title: RE: children first
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 04:10:56 PM
The only people that know what is on the tape is the child (unfortunatley) Her father, the state investigators and the county prosecutor.

why are you so defensive off the rip.

-Read it closely and think about it for a second. At first I didn't see it but now I do.-

 I have read it over several times and dont see anything that gives me the impression that she is lieing.

-Why would I give up the information voluntarily so she can change her story if this guy is innocent?-

This girl is not asking for information to put this guy away. She is looking for help from somebody. so she does not have to take money out of her childs or her mouth to pay back child support to a man that (if convited, and is looks like he will be) will be in jail for quit some time and not be able to pay her child support. $3000 my not be much in your eyes but in all reality 3k goes along way when putting food on a plate. espesialy in a time of need.

-I'm not trying to make her feel bad-

could have fooled me.

-I see a problem with the story-

you still have not said what that is.

-The only person that can even closely understand my situation I believe is Indigo because she has been put through it too. Only when it happens to you will you ever truly understand because there are no words to explain it.-

How do you know is has not happend to me. This post is not about me its about a "Frustrated Struggling Mother" looking for help.

not all women are like your ex and I think you need to reread some things you have said.
Title: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 04:12:44 PM
  Holy moly! Castration! Hey, that's actually not a bad idea. I think many offenders have issues that can be handled with help. However, for those that are repeat offenders or ones that are obiviously beyond help. That would be a good way to turn them off.  
Title: RE: What a PILE OF...
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 04:13:48 PM
oh, PLEASE don't get me wrong.  if i had a sporke and a couple of minutes alone with him, his thingy would be where the sun doesn't shine.  but since i can't do that, him sitting in jail taking punishment from whomever gives it to him will have to do until the day he meets his creator.  *sorry if your choice of religon isn't God.  but i firmly believe in God and know in my heart that when this man does die, he will have more of a punishment then, then he could ever receive here on earth.  and yes, he has not been proven quilty in a court yet, but concidering the evidence that we (my family and myself along with higher officals )  know they have, he WILL be found quilty and he WILL GO TO JAIL  for the rest of his life.  
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 04:17:34 PM
----------I think many offenders have issues that can be handled with help. ------------

Don't you get it yet???? The offenders issues are VICTIMS! They are beyond help the first time they act out.

Title: RE: children first
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 19, 2004, 04:18:56 PM
I see, we are to pity your child, but show strawberrys child the same cold indifference you are.

IF you are innocent, then your child is far less in harms way. IF you are guilty, God help you.

It very seldom that a guilty man admits it,, ( ever hear,, everyone in prison is innocent), thus, you are charged, you will be tried and you will either be found guilty or innocent. If it turns out your ex has falsely accused you, I would hope you go after her for the maximum.

But you will never convince me that ALL accusations are false,, I see too damn many children who are torn and bleeding from rape. As far as I am concerned, no punishment is sufficient for these animals. You want to be a pedophile advocate? Stand in front of a room or raped children and say that.

Quite honestly, I do think you have some serious denial issues concerning your own abuse, and I shudder to think, that you may actually one day have your child around the people that abused you. You already stated, they had mult victims over an extended period of time, what makes you think they arent still engaging in their favorite pastime of pop the puppys can?

I'll be following strwbrrys case , but as it stands right now, I wish her the best.
Title: RE: children first
Post by: sweetnsad on Jan 19, 2004, 04:19:10 PM
Get a grip...apparently we aren't all as "smart" as you...
Title: RE: Been there, feel for you guys!
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 04:51:53 PM
You dont think Mustang owes strabery an apology?
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: MKx2 on Jan 19, 2004, 05:06:16 PM
mustang m'dear ... you don't get it.

PEDOPHILIA IS A DISGUSTING CRIME - whether once or multiple times.  

E-N-D  O-F  S-T-O-R-Y

This is a crock of crap - "help the offender" - SORRY!  NO HELP!  ZERO TOLERANCE.

You will not change my mind, so don't even try.  Yep ... I'm narrow minded and closed on the subject.  At 57 yo, I'm allowed.  

Ya see, mustang, I spent 35 friggin' years of my life wondering what was wrong with ME!  Way back in the covered wagon days when I grew up and was molested it was swept under the carpet, not acknowledged, and not did ONE SINGLE PERSON tell me it wasn't my fault -- in fact NObody talked it about.  All the adults pretended it never happened.

Spent most of my adult life screwed up because ONE MAN did ONE thing to me.  Nice - stole a good part of my childhood and life from me.

And I'm not the only one in the world, I realize that.  But dammit, there should NEVER be a SINGLE child who has all that taken away simply because an adult has an "issue."

Now excuse me while I go puke ... everytime I think about these things I get sick to my stomach.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 05:06:16 PM
  Well in reality I really don't have a problem with the Castration thing after the first time.  But it has to be an open and shut case.  If there is any doubts then they shouldn't be.  But life in prison? Something just doesn't seem right about that.  
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 05:46:43 PM
   Okay, I must be wording something wrong here.  Oh well.  When I think of what happened to me, I get sick too, but I don't thrive on it or let it ruin my life.  What happened to you and happened to me is disgusting.  No, it was not your fault, and no, it was not my fault.  But hmmm, You say you were messed up in the head now.  Maybe they were messed up in the head too by someone.  So, it trickled its way down the line.  
    Now, I think you will all have a problem with this.  Reality is that we are not that far away from our caveman instincts as you may think.  Men and Women both fight with there own natural cravings.  Whether they be disgusting or not.  We as a people have said this should be the natural order of things, but mother nature has said something else.  Yes we need to further human kind and do as we feel right, but remember what everyone is actually dealing with is nature.  Some people are more educated than others to know what society wants from them and know what the difference is from right and wrong.  Those who are not as educated tend to follow their animal caveman instincts.  Society says wait a minute go to jail you disgusting creature.  True, that they are.  But this person probably doesn't have the education that we have and needs to be educated on what society says goes.  They need to learn to be not so easily giving to their natural born nastiness.  
   Mother Nature says that a woman is ready when she grows breasts and has her first period.  However society says 18 yrs or older is ready.  We say this because of education.  Mother nature doesn't seem to give a sh*t.  A couple of years ago I new a 19 yr old male who had sex with a 16 year old girl.  He was sentenced to 1 yr in jail for having sex with a minor even though it was consentual.  The girls parent were the ones who persued it.  He had no idea about the 18 thing, and was just letting Mother Nature take its course.  Some people can't find a way to make a relationship with someone their own age yet Mother Nature is still inside them screaming.  They are not right socially and so they have turned to other hideous ways to try and please what Mother Nature is telling them to do.  Unfortunately children are not educated enough to no the difference, and I believe that is why they target them.  Someone who won't tell them no.  These people need to be educated on what Society wants them to do and what the difference is between right and wrong.  My parents both taught my brother's and sisters what is expected of us and we are all successful hard working people.  No major problems except some speeding tickets.  We were all affected by what happened to us as children, but we were taught valuable lessons by our parents.  Mother Nature people has become our enemy.  Thes people need to be educated on Society's wants.  Mother Nature doesn't give a D**N.  In the old days people would get married at 11 , 10 and even still younger ages than that.  In those days it was normal and in some countries it still goes on with normal practice.  If a man molests a 5 year old child he has a serious disgusting problem.  He needs to be educated or castrated, one of the 2.  Jail time? Absolutely, but for life? I don't think he killed anyone.  If you truly look at the stats of child abuse, you couldn't even imagine actual % of children in this world who have been abused.  If we as a people want to hold these standards, then we as a people need to educate everyone about the difference between Mother Nature laws and Society laws.  They are 2 different species.  If a man from another country marries an 11 year old girl where it is completely normal in their society then comes here, would you send this man to jail for life?  I am just trying to break things down to reality not stand up for their disgusting nature.  They need a cure, and we need to find it or it will never stop.  We need to learn how to decifer the clues that show up in a man while they are still young and educate them on the rules society has set and stop it before it happens.  Throwing everyone in jail will never solve the problem.  We need to nip it in the bud from the early years.  Educate them or you will continue to have Mother Nature rule them.  Many times it is truly the parents fault that a man or woman grows up to do these things because they did not educate their children.  Loud and clear people!  You must be a parent and educator to your children.  If you educate your children you will not see them going to jail for crazy bizarre and disgusting things!

Peace
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 06:04:29 PM
So you think a man that molests a five year old can be educated? I think not. Its a deisease not lack of education.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 06:13:22 PM
I frankly didn't even bother reading all of the post you just wrote.
The only thing I could think of was

---Tell it to the hand---

You cannot tell me that a college educated man does not know that sexually molesting a 3-4 year old, and continuing to molest and emotionally abuse a child untill they are 11-12 does not know that it is wrong.

On one hand you are condeming molesters, on the other you are making excuses for them. You I hope go to therapy to deal with YOUR issues.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 06:23:09 PM
   I see why no one in here is seeing what I saw on strwbry's post.  You don't read between the lines!  I guarantee you that college educated man had been doing that since he was probably a teenager.  Learning how to add and multiply and run a company by going to college is not the education to keep his taliwhacker to himself.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 06:26:29 PM
I can read between lines just fine thank you very much. There is still no proof that this poster is being anything but an honest caring mother.
What makes me sit back is your posts. Should we ask if maybe you on the other hand is not? Since you are advocating for child molesters.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 06:26:41 PM
You still have not enlightened us onto what it is that you and only you have seen in strwbry's post
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 06:36:29 PM
  Throwing out ideas on how to possibly cure a problem hardly seems like an advocate to me.  People who don't throw out those ideas and try to brainstorm and don't educate their children do advocate for them.  So, are you advocating for them?
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: MKx2 on Jan 19, 2004, 06:38:19 PM
mustang-mustang-mustang ....

I never said I was "messed up in the head" - I said I wondered what was wrong with me.  If you're going to quote people be PRECISE with your words, please.

While I agree with you that as sexual beings, we are not far from "primal" if you will.  HOWEVER!  Read my fingers very carefully (no not the middle one, the typing) ...

I need no responses from you regarding this.  You have your enabling views of sexual offenders, I have mine.  I have to live with how it changed my life.  Okay?  Don't be so presumptuous as to think this DREADFULLY long post of yours is going to change my mind on this issue.  Ain't gonna happen.  Walk in my moccasins my friend ... not just for the abuse, but how it affected my life, how I viewed myself, how I dealt with relationships ... THEN perhaps I'll listen to an edited version of of your thoughts on the matter.

[em]"So, it trickled its way down the line.[/em]

Now if that isn't sick thinking I don't know what is!  Because someone ELSE is wacko they should have a "right" to trickle it my way?  or another child's way?  nonononononononononono

Jail and counseling ... then out to do it all over again to another innocent child.  Oh - well after we've allowed a second life to be ruined, so maybe we made a mistake, eh?  Maybe we should try someting a bit stronger this time, eh?  Life in prison?  Maybe ... but perhaps with more counseling and a bit more lock-up we can save this person ... golly gee whiz - I hope it doesn't happen again after the next release!

Just don't bother with a response, 'cause I'm done with posting to this thread.  I politely agree to disagree with you on the issue, which quite frankly is my right ... and you will not change my mind.  LOL - so stop trying!  ;-)
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 06:45:49 PM
   If you don't see it, then I'm sorry.  I don't think your blind to it, I just think you haven't read into it enough.  I see a critical error which makes me second guess the situation.  If he is innocent then his lawyer will need to know and should be able to see it.  If he is guilty then there should be enough evidence to get him.  If it is told what the issue is then it will oddly enough change when it gets to court.  Why potentially give away an Innocent until proven guilty man his only defense so that he won't have one.  

   If I told you that my ex put a gun to my head, and that I have proof, but you saw something in a statement I said that clued you into something else, would you let me know of my mistake so that I could fix it in time to make sure that my ex would go to jail without even knowing if my ex actually did it? You my friend would then have just made me tighten up and fix my mistake so that a possibly innocent person would go to jail.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 06:49:33 PM
There is no CURE for these people. They are not an infection of body that therapy or education can get rid like antibiotics.

I do educate my children, I educate to them that things like that are worse then sick growths , because they are not human beings, they are animals they prey on children that cannot defend themselfs.

I am an advocate for the victim, not the abuser.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: nosonew on Jan 19, 2004, 06:51:39 PM
Mustang- I only have one thing to say, whatever your intention was here, just cut it loose.  You will not get the last say, you will not make other people here think this woman is lying, and I am sorry if you have been falsely accused, but the way you defended your own accusers, makes me wonder....are you a pedophile also?  Scary.  If so, get some help now.  Castration doesn't work, this is proven, Rape is a crime of power, and anything can be used to rape, not just a body part.  

So, mustang, if you were abused as a child, and you think "you are just fine, it is in the past" well, IT ISN'T!! Just re-read your posts.  If you think they are normal, you do need help.  NOW, not tomorrow, not the next day, but NOW!

And to Strawberry, soooo sorry for your dtr and what you are going thru.  Perhaps your past cs could be given back to you/your daughter as some type of restitution after he is found guilty.  Until then...keep on lovin!  You're doing great and we, Sparc people, support you!
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: kiddosmom on Jan 19, 2004, 06:52:55 PM
whatever, i have better things to do then to debate a non existant wording with you.
Title: Your right! Misquote
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 06:54:09 PM
  Your right! I did misquote and for that I DO apologize.  Being misquoted can sometimes really lead the wrong way.  

   Well, anyway we do have our differences and I just think I may not be wording my thoughts correctly.

I hope the world treats you better from here on out for what its worth.

Best wishes.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 07:06:12 PM
  Well I will tell you this.  Much of my statements have come from my up and down frustration of my own situation.  That much I can tell you.  As for your accusation, that's a pretty horrible response.  As for strwbry, I have not said she is lying, in fact I believe that is the first time I typed that word.  I said I see a flaw (mistake might be another word to use) that obviously I only saw.  I have said before she needs to be honest about the situation.  If she is then fine if not then d**n it!  We all thought that O.J. Simpson was guilty as He**.  But for some reason 7 jurors sat and listened to more than we got to and found him not guilty.  Pictures are painted very precisely, but when you look at them with a microscope you can see the mistakes.  I am not alleging her to be a lyer. I am reminding her to be honest. I saw a mistake, you didn't.  But you my friend have make a very bad allegation.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 07:09:02 PM
---I see a critical error which makes me second guess the situation.---

Still dont see it and just read it again. So in my eyes you are calling this poor women a lier.

---"If he is innocent then his lawyer will need to know and should be able to see it."  "If it is told what the issue is then it will oddly enough change when it gets to court."----

well anything in this post would be considered as hearsay anyway, and would not stand up in court. Have you read the police reports???

---Why potentially give away an Innocent until proven guilty man his only defense so that he won't have one.---

how does anything she says give him a defense? Because she asked the kid if daddy was touching her????

----but you saw something in a statement----

Have you read any other statements then what has been provided by her or the links supplied?

Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 07:22:15 PM
She filed for a modification of custody AFTER the father was arrested without bond.  I don't know, but maybe that is the "issue" with mustang?  I think, because mustang is going through this right now, he sees that as another bullshit reason to get custody of a child.  I think he thinks it's a false accusation to gain the upper hand.  After all, if he's in prison forever, why the need to file for custody immediately?  


I, however, think this "father" is guilty as fucking sin.  Scuze the language, but damn...he best be thankful it wasn't MY little girl he touched.  Getting "trained" in prison by a bunch of "big" men would be the least of his concerns...as he probably wouldn't have lived to be arrested.  
Title: You know, you are in the wrong place...
Post by: nosonew on Jan 19, 2004, 07:24:45 PM
Buddy, you didn't take my "nice" post to heart.  Re-read.  Get some help.  You really need it.  Anyone who has been sexually abused as a child needs help.  You are not God, you can't control everything nor can you handle everything on your own.  

I didn't accuse you of anything.  I just felt like your responses were a bit off the wall for someone who WAS abused.  Something strange here, and it's not strawberry....

Get some help.  How hard is that?  
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 19, 2004, 07:30:40 PM
There is no education nor cure for a pedophile. Period.

The only 2 things that have been shown to keep a pedophile from harming another child, is being locked up, or castrated.

I do educate my children. Most caring responsible parentas do. We more than likey all tell our children about inappropriate touching, that they have the RIGHT to say NO! That they can come tell us or a teacher or a cop about sick sonsabiotches trying to touch or molest them.

The original poster comes across as a caring parent, who truly is at her wits end over the mess her and her childs life has become.

You mustang, do not. You come across quite labile in emotion, one post angry and full of hate, next one asking anyone and everyone to "understand" the molesters. The more you speak, the more I begin to wonder if you are indeed innocent of what you are charged with.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 19, 2004, 07:40:13 PM
  Interesting, One person says castration works, and another said it has proven not to work. That shows the difference in all of our thinking. It shows that one person can read something and see something others don't.  Yes, I am angry, and this is how I vent.  Typing my frustration away is a clearly better idea than some of the alternatives, don't you agree? I'll be cleared of my charges, don't you worry about that.  I would fill you in but my lawyer has strictly forbid me.
  You mean if you had a chance to understand a murderer, a child molester, a rapist or etc... and learned the psychology of that type of person, it wouldn't help you to pick out future ones so we could do something about it?  nonsense.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 07:54:34 PM
that's how my daughter new what was going on was wrong.  we taught her about "bathing suit " places and what was appropriate for an adult to do (doctors exams, help washing in the tub, that kind of ok) and what was not.  my daughter was over 500 miles away and had no one to go to.  concidering my ex would move (more than 7 times in 2 years) and I  would have to track him down in order for me to even talk to her and then he would be right there in the back ground listening to the conversations.  I hadn't seen my daughter for six months, but when i did, she spoke.  

i believe all children are educated in some way by their parents. at least decent parents.  

my opinion on mustang is that he has some real deep issues and does need physcologicaL help.  for him to actually be around the people that abused him as a child concerns me too.  he obviously has not delt with the fact that he was abused. and if he has, then he must not think that it was wrong.  well it was and whoever did this to him should have been locked up. they probably have done this to several others, if not hundreds others.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 08:09:04 PM
just to clear something up, i filed so quickly because i am being harassed by his physco, druggie sister.  i won't let my daughter speak to them because i have reason to believe that they knew this was going on and did nothing about it.  she finally (after calling my parents home , calling my friends home , and receiving the birthday gifts she sent to us  back)  actually called the cops and sent them to my home.  we weren't there, but when i was told that the police had stopped by and were looking for me, i took myself down to the police dept.  all in all, she was claiming to them that she had filed for custody of my daughter and wanted them to do a well check.  I called several places to see if anything was filed and was told that nothing was filed by her in the entire state of mo.  so she lied to the pd.  so i am just covreing all the legal aspects of keeping my daughter.  not that even if this woman would try something she would get my daughter, but i am trying to avoiding a very long trip and legal hassel in mo.
Title: RE: child support - back owed
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 19, 2004, 08:32:29 PM
---It is a terrible situation however, it sounds to me like you are only concerned about the $$.-----

Isint that what this message bourd is about? $$$

Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 19, 2004, 08:53:30 PM
Actually mustang,, nosonew didnt make any allegation against you,, but I sure will.

I am beginning to think with your atitudes and positions on the issues here, that its a distinct possibility that your ex has not made a false accusation.

I dont argue that false accusations happen,, they do,, but so do real crimes against children,, and buddy your atitude and posts about nature vs society,,, it dont wash, it doesnt hold water.  Any person not mentally handicapped, and even most of those knows its unacceptable in society to have sexual relations with underage people. Yet your post argue for doing exactly that.
That is the thinking that I think needs to be made available to the DA in your case . Or, am I wrong in thinking you really wouldnt want to see your posts emailed to the DA and your attrny?
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 19, 2004, 09:36:51 PM
-----You mean if you had a chance to understand a murderer, a child molester, a rapist or etc... and learned the psychology of that type of person, it wouldn't help you to pick out future ones so we could do something about it? -----

Being a nutcase myself, I'm VERY interested in the criminal mind.  If there's a serial murderer out there, I've probably read all there is to read about him/her.  I'm absolutely fascinated with crime and spend more money than I should on it.  I'd like to know all there is to know and won't stop til I "do" know everything.  I have books from "The creation of dangerous violent criminals" to "The effects of child abuse and neglect" (hub still yells cause I spent $47 on it)  Ann Rule is my 2nd favorite author, 2nd only to Mr. James Patterson, who, in my mind, is the most twisted individual ever, with the worst criminal mind...and my dog is named after.  Crime is not a "passion" to me, but very close.  One day, when I grow up and the kids do, too...I'd like to go to school (after school after school) to become a medical examiner.  I love "crime" that much...but I don't/won't condone it.  

I'm so interested in crime...but never in a million years would I even BEGIN to learn about the mind who brutalizes our most valuable resource...our children.  

Some say castration would work, I disagree...it won't.  It's not so much about "sex" as it's about control...controlling someone smaller, weaker, unable to protect themselves.  It's about having power over those who could NEVER talk back, fight back, help themselves.  To me, someone who harms children is a pussy.  Yes, I said it.  That's what they are.  There IS no rehabilitation.  There IS nothing that will magically "change" them...any more than there's a miracle to bring world peace.  

Nothing will change them, mustang.  Much like a sociopath...death is the only "cure" for a pedophile.  And no, I'm not saying they should all be killed...just stating what I truly believe.
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 19, 2004, 09:46:55 PM
there actually in mo is something where when a pediophile comes up for parolle, that the prosecuting attorney's office then goes infront of the judge saying they should go to a mental hospital and be commited until they are "cured".  funny though, cuz there is no cure for pediophiles, so they spend the rest of their lives locked up.  
Title: RE: CASTRATION!
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 19, 2004, 10:10:53 PM
You know Indi,,

I like that option,, yuppers, death DO cure em....hmmmmmmm
Title: Allegations
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 20, 2004, 09:42:15 AM
   IF you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen peanut.  You can make allegations all you want.  First of all my charges don't have anything to do with children.  Secondly if any of you were half way educated you would look for answers and look for every solution possible to help make this world a better place.  You can't handle having things broke down because you don't know how to comprehend things very well.  Email away Pea-"Nut".  Sorry, did that hurt your feelings too?

   Dean Tong a very well known attorney was sent to jail for 10 yrs of his life because of child molestation allegations.  Only after that time were his children old enough to understand that their wonderful mother had put them up to it and went to authorities to tell them the truth.  As soon as he got out, he studied the law and fights for the truth.  I question people no matter what the allegation and no matter what the evidence says.
 
   This whole thread started because I questioned what was said.  You are so gullible that you are willing to believe what is said or written and not go into details.  I am a private investigator mack.  I know how to read the details and see the flaws in a statement.  You are not educated enough to see them so you can't handle someone else telling you that something is wrong.  

   Open your eyes and READ between the ligns Pea.
Title: Hey...
Post by: sweetnsad on Jan 20, 2004, 10:30:44 AM
I think you had better lay off Mustang...you are taking this too far and as far as I'm concerned, this thread has gotten ridiculous.
Title: RE: Hey...
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 20, 2004, 11:05:52 AM
   LOL, no question.  Ridiculous isn't even the word to use for it.  I'm tired of entertaining everyone anyway, so I'm out of here.  No more posts.  Seeya!

  Regardless of what you all want to believe,  God Bless all of you and your children.  Stay safe and love one another.
Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 12:00:43 PM
And here's what I'm wondering about.

On the casenet website, it shows EVERY charge being dated 11/8/1998.  5 years ago.  

On 9/10/2003, it shows "order for grand jury warrant".  It also shows that he was arrested 9/11/2003.  

However, the newspaper article, dated Wednesday August 6th, 2003....says differently.  Says he was questioned Monday August 4th, 2003...and charges were filed on Tuesday August 5th, 2003...and that he was arrested between those two dates.  It also says he was 34, but really, at that time, he would be 3 months shy of his 36th birthday...nother stupid thing I found.  

So, my questions are these.

Why are the casenet file charges dated 5 years ago.

Why did it take the state 5 YEARS to arrest this guy.

Why does the newspaper article say that the questioning, arrest, and charges filed happened a month before casenet says it does.  Also, the newspaper article quoted the detective as saying "the information turned up thus far indicates the crimes occurred over a period that could range from four months to two years."  What's up with the same charges being filed in 1998 if it's only been possibly going on since 2001 at the earliest?  

Color me a blonde bimbo all ya want, but the casenet files and newspaper article ARE about the same guy, same street name...but the facts are so far off between the two of them it isn't even funny.

Was he charged in 1998 and let off due to insufficient evidence?  Was he recharged in August 2003 and let off, only to have it reopened a month later? Is there another man, with the EXACT same name living on the EXACT same street?  

strawberry, i am in NO way calling you a liar.  I just find the court case and newspaper article quite odd.  that, and the fact that I'm sitting on me butt accomplishing absolutely nothing today.


Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 20, 2004, 01:17:38 PM
---On the casenet website, it shows EVERY charge being dated 11/8/1998. 5 years ago. ----

That would be the earliest date that the crime could have happened on. I would guess the childs brithday

---On 9/10/2003, it shows "order for grand jury warrant". It also shows that he was arrested 9/11/2003.

However, the newspaper article, dated Wednesday August 6th, 2003....says differently. Says he was questioned Monday August 4th, 2003...and charges were filed on Tuesday August 5th, 2003...and that he was arrested between those two dates. It also says he was 34, but really, at that time, he would be 3 months shy of his 36th birthday...nother stupid thing I found. -----

August is the date the phone call was made from strbery. They were gathering evidence since and finaly charged him in september. so he sat in jail for 3 months when they were gathering evidence. Even know he never posted bond they still have to issue warrent and charge him. As for the age thing... we know how newpapers are.

You just got to know how the court system works.

Mustang did not find a flaw cause if he did he would have pointed it out but he didnt he was hiding it.

All this poor women is doing is asking for help. Not to have to prove her story to everybody.

If you cant help this women dont respond.
Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 01:39:35 PM
-----That would be the earliest date that the crime could have happened on. I would guess the childs brithday-----

I see...grasshoppah!  I never thought of that, obviously.  I suppose my arrest warrant could have gone back to monsters birth, too, but it didn't.  

-----August is the date the phone call was made from strbery. They were gathering evidence since and finaly charged him in september. so he sat in jail for 3 months when they were gathering evidence. Even know he never posted bond they still have to issue warrent and charge him. As for the age thing... we know how newpapers are.-----

Again...I see...grasshoppah!  Yes, we know how court documents and newspapers are.  My arrest warrant said I had glasses and "stubbed facial hair".  hmmmmm...I have 20/20 vision and have never shaved my face in my life.  I do sport the occasional leg stubble that just about stabs my hub to death at night...but the ol legs are far from the face.  

Though I don't know why they would have to charge and arrest him twice.  He was charged and arrested for this a month (not 3 months) before the court documents say he was.  'Spose I'll never understand.  You can bring a person in for questioning, but if you don't charge him, he must be released...they did charge him.  He sat in jail...charged with this crime, then charged again a month later?  

-----You just got to know how the court system works.-----

Aaaahhh...why yes, I do know how they work.  Or don't work...whichever one fits, ya know?  Courts are about the most screwed up of places, if ya ask me.  

-----Mustang did not find a flaw cause if he did he would have pointed it out but he didnt he was hiding it.-----

Which is precisely why I sat on my behind trying to figure it out.  People asked him over and over to show his "flaw" but he wouldn't...so I did.  I'll bet you 10 something I wrote in my post was what he called his "flaw".  Probably the charges in 1998....

-----All this poor women is doing is asking for help. Not to have to prove her story to everybody.-----

I know that.  She doesn't have to prove her case...the prosecutor has to prove the childs case against this guy.  

-----If you cant help this women dont respond. -----

First of all, don't tell me not to respond.  I'll respond if I feel like it.  I ain't out to please anyone. I DID try to help her with the question at hand...monies owed to the state for a welfare debt of the father.  

You can get all bent out of shape or you can be happy that her case was proven by my "mean" and "nasty" response...unworthy of being posted because I'm not "helping".  And yes, I've stated time and time again that I believe this person is guilty of molesting a child.  











Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: The OutLaw on Jan 20, 2004, 02:24:22 PM
Wow you are unreal. I was just tring to point out some things and help YOU understand. NOT start a war with somebody I dont even know about something that has nothing to do with me. But I guess you have nothing better to do then rip apart someone looking for help and get rude to people tring to help YOU understand. This thread is unreal out of almost 100 posts only 4 of them are tring to help this women.

Strbery I am sorry this thread has gottn out of control I would suggest contacting MO CSE they are probably going to be more help then anybody in this thread. Odviously these people like the drama of negativity and thrive on it.

Title: RE: Excuse me???????
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 02:46:22 PM
I pointed out everything which I thought "could" be considered a flaw!  (by mustang) You explained every "flaw" away with a legit "reason".  What is left but the truth??????  When the truth is the ONLY thing left, then the truth is the ONLY thing to a case...am I right??????  

Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 20, 2004, 03:02:43 PM
ok, '98 is my kids birthday.  they probably use it as reference to the victim(since they can't actuall disclose that).

they didn't arrest him twice.  they arrested him and got a warrant to go before the grand jury (they had to serve him so he could show up in court)
A Grand Jury has two responsiblities, (1) of which is: to hear evidence of criminal accusations in possible felonies  presented by the District Attorney and decide whether the accused should be indicted and tried for a crime.  Since many felony charges are filed by the DA in a municipal or other lower court which holds a reliminary hearing to determine if there is just cause for trial instead of have the grand jury hear the matter,"  they usually don't use go to the GJ.  But the DA thought it to be necessary to go infront of the GJ so he can be charged with federal charges instead of state  so they can get the maximum sentence.

I didn't come on here with a bunch of lies so that I wouldn't  get the  true help I am looking for.  I came here with the truth!

I don't care who responds, I just think that mustang was seriously out of line and not on the same page.   All he had to do was tell us his "flaw" and I would have been able to correct him.

Thank you all for the help & support, it hasn't gone unnoticed.
Title: RE: aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 04:18:07 PM
Actually, the first thing I thought when I saw "1998" was that he was accused by another person (because your child would have been a newborn then)...but then those charges were dropped.  Then, I thought maybe it took the investigators THAT long to find enough evidence on him (which, BTW...if that was the case, the head investigator should be shot).  Then, I saw the newspaper article and scratched my head a bunch of times.  Then I got all twisted up in the WTF's...and thought screw it...I'm posting them.  Oh, and yes, there was a short time this morning when I thought something just wasn't "right"....

noooooooooooooow i see what the whole mess means!  I didn't know about the charges turning federal. I want to say, i NEVER accused you of lying, I didn't think you were.  After all, who the heck is going to post the case number if they're lying.  However, I've been stuck on this "flaw" since mustang brought it up.  (not to prove you wrong, mind you, to see if I could fricken find the thing) I've made a few posts about a sort of/possible/maybe/maybe not "flaw" and I've stated what I "thought" mustang may have meant...and then ended each post saying I believed the guy was guilty.

There's only one person in this thread who is questioning you...and it's not me.  Each and every poster who's read your story, seen the article, and went to the court website has stated that you sound like nothing more than a sincere, loving mother.  I never said those "exact" words, but never said you were lying.  You can read each post of mine and you won't once see me calling you on any "lie".  I haven't attacked you in any way, shape, or form, that I know of.

I still hold by what I said...I HAVE to have found the "flaw" mustang is talking about...so when he brings it up, it can be explained, rather than being thrown around that you're a liar making ME go bonkers trying to find it!!!

BTW...did you call social services?






Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 20, 2004, 04:48:02 PM
strawberry,

One of the great things about the help folks can get here,, is if they ARE full of sh*t,, typically, the help wont help em.

The only person whos taken that stance in your thread is mustang,, and I think its become apparent he's not wrapped too tightly.

Once you wade thru all the bs that has become embroiled in this thread, you do find a few things that should help you.
Title: RE: aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 20, 2004, 05:04:59 PM
k, i never said you called me a lier or tried to bash me in anyway. mustang is off.  way off his rocker.
i don't think he called me a lier out right (i would have to read through all of his irrational, insane responses again and i don't really want to take a nap right now), he said he was making allegations that my story wasn't right, but got all offended when peanutsdad made allegations on him.  i don 't see how that's not a double standard.   he has his right to have his own oppinion and i'm not at all trying to take that away from him,... but so am i.  i personally still believe the man needs some serious counseling and maybe a physc exam.  again, my own feelings.  

yes, i keep trying to call ss.  i keep getting put on hold and transfered because no one seems to want to answer my question.  but, i will keep trying until i get an answer.  i am a persistant little woman.  if that doesn't work, i think i will try to look it up on the net, not that i've gotten too far with the net in other searches, but its worth a try.  

thanks again for the help and understanding.
Title: RE: Ok, looked over this stupid case...
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 20, 2004, 05:08:32 PM
oh, i totally agree.  that's why i've proven my point to him and let it go because he's wacko.(in my opinion)
yes, i have seen the advice and help and am very greatfull for it.  i am looking into it and hope its what i need.  

thanks
Title: RE: aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 20, 2004, 05:09:19 PM
Send a request for administrative hearing to cse.
Title: RE: aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 20, 2004, 05:12:14 PM
just to clerify, that's where i can get the bigwigs to sit down with me and give me all the evidence?  when i would go, what would i need to bring?
Title: RE: UGH!!!!!!!
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 05:43:56 PM
http://www.dss.mo.gov/cse/geninfo.htm


-----DCSE collects child support on behalf of households receiving public assistance not only to eliminate their dependence on assistance programs, but also to reimburse the state for the benefits provided to these families.-----

Methinks you're SOL on this one.  

I don't get it.  Does the NCP have a say as to whether the CP goes ON welfare to begin with?  NO....!!!!!  So why the hell are NCP's responsible for the CP's debt???????????????  I had to report monster because while my son was "unofficially" living with me, monster used the court order to get all the welfare benefits...and claimed my child! I wasn't ABOUT to end up paying back the state for that squids deception.  I proved my case, my sons "portion" of the bennies was removed LUCKILY!!!  But then they told me they don't go after NCP's for a debt like that!!!

And another thing that pisses me off?  When you do end up having to pay back the 3333...is it going back into the tax payers pockets?  After all, it's the taxpayers who fed your ex and child...

Do whatever PeanutsDad said...I can't remember what he said, but I think it's some form of review.  






Title: RE: UGH!!!!!!!
Post by: stwbshort on Jan 20, 2004, 05:56:41 PM
no offense, but i really don't care if it goes back to the taxpayers.  he decided to QUIT his $14, $15 dollar an hour job and go on welfare. not me.  he's the one who should pay it back.


thanks for the link, i'll have to check it out.
Title: RE: that's not what I meant...LOL
Post by: Indigo Mom on Jan 20, 2004, 06:09:01 PM
-----no offense, but i really don't care if it goes back to the taxpayers. -----

I saw somewhere on that website that they're bragging because they collected something like 400 million dollars in "welfare debts".  Well...who paid for the welfare to begin with?  Taxpayers...so...each NCP they go after should be paying back the taxpayers...not giving the fricken state an extra 400 million.  Did I 'splain it right this time?  LOL

-----he decided to QUIT his $14, $15 dollar an hour job and go on welfare. not me. he's the one who should pay it back.-----

monster was making 13 an hour before he got all shrunk down with crack.  His habit before that was snorting coke...then it progressed to smoking actual crack!  Anyway, he did the same thing and got on welfare.  I don't know about you, but I most definitely would prefer the lifestyle $15 dollars an hour could bring over welfare ANY DAY.  I've never understood why people do this.

-----he's the one who should pay it back.-----

BINGO!  With all this new welfare to work crap, you'd think they would let the CP know up front that when they get employment, they'll owe this money back.  Kind of like a student loan, you know?

It's stupid to make an NCP pay a CP debt.  Never in a million years would a Judge have ordered monster to pay my utility bill!  

Title: RE: Allegations
Post by: Peanutsdad on Jan 20, 2004, 11:46:33 PM
hehehehehehe,, methinks I struck a nerve. It seems mustang, you are the one cant take the heat. It's all fine and good when you are busy slamming someone else, isnt it?

So you are a private investigator eh? really,, gee, thats impressive, I suppose now I'm to shake in my boots, quiver in awe of your towering intellect? Not even bub.

Lets see , now what educational requirement did that take mustang?

You know whats funny mustang? I've been in emergency medicine a hellova long time and have heard just about every bull story out there,, and right now,, my bs meter is pingin off the scale where you are concerned.
Title: Got Peanuts message
Post by: mustang292 on Jan 21, 2004, 01:14:07 AM
     And blah blah.  Anyway I didn't want to post anymore but what the heck you guys seem to love this drama.  
 
     Heck, no more drama.  Fact is I do believe you are a caring mother Strwbry.  If you weren't you wouldn't put up with having to deal with your ex.  Same here, it's a pain in the a** but I'm putting up with my ex to make sure my daughter will be taken care of.  
     I just said there was a flaw (error) not lie.  I have gone to all the case site and read everything.  I still see problems.  This does not mean he didn't do it.  
     I did post alot of aggressive posts.  I can tell you its more of the fact that I am still heated about my situation.
     But I never alleged you lied.  I said there was a flaw.  If I believed you were lying, I would not hesitate to say it.
     If it makes you feel anybetter, I just got Child Support papers in the mail today!  Yeeha! I'll probably be paying at least 600 a month according to the calculations.  
     Important: For your daughters sake make sure you let her know that she did nothing wrong, and DO NOT HARP ON THE SUBJECT with her.  She needs to play and be a child again.  If you harp on the subject it will only make it worse on her.  Try and get a job that has daycare available or someway to be with her almost always.  Children need to have a stay at home parent!  Don't let strangers raise her!
    So,  I tell you what, I will apologize for being soo negative.  
Good Luck. and by Peanut!
  And by the way for the money part?  Here's your advice:  If he is found guilty, I don't think any judge in this world will make you pay it.  So relax, think about who is going to be your valentine this year and buy your daughter the Dancing Elmo, My daughter loved it!
  Have to go, there's another post I have to fall off my rocker about. LOL