For those of you who have been following the David/Sean Goldman case for the past dew years:
(http://a.abcnews.com/images/site/printlogo.jpg) (http://abcnews.go.com/)
Brazil Court Awards David Goldman Custody of Son After 5 Year FightSean Goldman Was Taken to Brazil By His Mother in 2004By SARAH NETTER and KATIE ESCHERICH
June 16, 2009 —
New Jersey father David Goldman (http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=7790766&page=1) received a holiday gift from a Brazilian court today. After waiting more than five years, he will regain custody of his son Sean Goldman, who had been held in Brazil (http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=7848050&page=1) by his mother.
A court in Rio de Janeiro ruled 3-0 in a closed session that nine-year-old Sean should be handed over to his father on Friday, the Associated Press reported. David Goldman has been told to be in Brazil in 48 hours to pick up his son at a U.S. Embassy.
Sean has been living with his stepfather since the 2008 death of his mother Bruna Bianchi, who took her then-four-year-old son to her native Brazil on vacation in 2004 and never returned. She divorced Goldman while in Brazil and married Joao Paulo Lins e Silva, a Rio de Janeiro lawyer.
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I bet he can't get to Brazil fast enough! Congratulations, Sean!!! You got the BEST Christmas present of all.........your Daddy!
Congrats to Sean and David! The battle for custody is definitely worth it, I'm glad for such a good outcome!
Yes, I'd have to agree with him though.....until he's back on the plane and landed here.....there's still one more hurdle.
You're right, MB..........I just read that the family in Brazil has filed a writ of habeus corpus, hoping to get a stay on the ruling. Plus, they say that the child has to be brought to the US consulate.....after all the fighting in court, I'm sure that the family will not be that willing to take him there. What do you want to bet that law enforcement will have to get involved, if it comes to that......
Well looks like it's not over yet....
I know.....I heard. David Goldman gets to Brazil and is told that the Brazilian family was granted a stay, because they're looking to have the court approve for Sean to testify. And since the Brazilian Supreme court is the current venue, they are in recess and it's possible that they won't give a ruling until February. What horse$hit........
That stinks! And exactly what can a boy of 9 testify about what a child of 4 knew? In all those years it would be so easy to modify a child's memory by telling them what happened to them - and none of it be true.
I was just gonna come post because of the blurp that's on the CNN site that didn't go into details.
If it isn't ONE delay, it will be another.
I was wondering about that, have been following his story. Really hope he gets his son back without any problems...
maybe a step CLOSER???
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,580931,00.html (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,580931,00.html)
I saw that.......I'm just waiting to hear that they're BOTH on a plane heading for the US.......
Wouldn't that be the most incredible Christmas gift David AND Sean will ever have??
We're getting closer........apparently the Brazillian family now realizes that Brazillian law is against them. I think all they're trying to figure out now is how the transfer will take place and when.......
This is and always has been an "abduction " case and NOT a "custody" case as protrayed in the media and elsewhere.
I do not know how the child landed in Brazil to know if this matter can be referred to initially as a "parental abduction" but it is crystal clear that once the mother passed-away the child should have been immediately returned to his father. At that point in time the matter DEFINITELY became an "abduction". The step parent and the MIL have zero custody rights over a natural parent.
Accoording to a article posted on Yahoo, a STL attorney commented "The critical lesson from this tragic story is to not permit these child abduction cases to spiral into protracted custody disputes, as happened in Brazil," he said. "While Brazil finally made the right decision, Brazil breached its fundamental obligation to decide the abduction case expeditiously."
The sad fact is that the very same happens among the US judiciary in matters regarding children among two or more states. The US judiciary is just as broken and corrupt brought on by their bias and prejudices.
And, it has been written, like in this Brazil case, a third party is usually the driving force behind the abduction. The sicko is often the maternal grandmother.
I know this happened years ago, but currently don't you have to have both parents consent (and notarized I thought) regardless of having a child's passport to get out of the country?
Of course there is always a way to probably skirt around it....
Quote from: CuriousMom on Dec 23, 2009, 05:50:23 PM
I know this happened years ago, but currently don't you have to have both parents consent (and notarized I thought) regardless of having a child's passport to get out of the country?
Of course there is always a way to probably skirt around it....
Would this apply to married parents too? I would hope not...
Five years ago, David Goldman's wife took Sean to Brazil under the pretence of going on vacation, but never returned. She divorced him, married a Brazilian atty. and died giving birth a couple years ago. Because of the Hague convention, Sean should havve been returned immediately or at least returned after the mother died, but the stepfather is the one who put up the fight to keep him in Brazil.
As for passports, I don't think it matters if the parents are married or not, BOTH parents have to sign for it.
According to reports the father received custody of the child shortly after the mother divorced him and remarried in Brazil thus signaling the child would not be returned home (in the US).
The father's fight APPEARED to be against the stepfather .. a lawyer in a powerful family of Brazilian lawyers in a nation where the wealthy are used to coming out on top —
The maternal grandmother adamantly declared that a child belongs with the maternal grandmother when the mother is gone and subsequently blamed international pressure — in particular, the U.S. Senate's delay in renewing a trade bill worth $2.75 billion a year to Brazil — for losing her grandson. In addition, very high ranking officials from both nations have been involved. I think the US was contrmplating issuing a "travel warning" to Brazil.
The maternal grandmother also lodged an appeal before the Brazilian Supreme Court last week, petitioning that the boy's own testimony about where he wanted to live be heard. That was denied Tuesday by Brazil's chief justice Gilmar Mendes.
"He is really sad, he doesn't want to go," she told the Estado de S. Paulo newspaper. "Gilmar Mendes stripped him of his right to expression, to open his mouth and say he doesn't want to go. In his own country, he's not respected. Here, he's under a gag rule."
Currently the Federal police are prepared to use force to return the child to his father and Interpol is on alert for the child being removed from Brazil. Thr child resides in a compound with 24 - 7 security.
WHAT SHOULD BE TAKEN AWAY from these discussions is that these matters, both international or interstate, are beyond the scope of family courts without legitimate rulings on the uniform legal statues governing jurisdiction and moreso the enforcement of those rulings BEFORE APPROACHING ANY "CUSTODY" ISSUE. MANY CHILDREN WOULD BE SPARED A LOT OF UNNECESSARY PAIN AND SUFFERING in both the short and long term !
I wanna read headlines saying that the son is back in the United States.....with his dad.
closer?
http://www.sphere.com/world/article/sean-goldman-reunited-with-father-david-goldman-in-brazil/19293326 (http://www.sphere.com/world/article/sean-goldman-reunited-with-father-david-goldman-in-brazil/19293326)
Father and son are on a private jet on their way to New Jersey as I type this.........
What gall...........the Brazilian grandmother wanted to accompany David and Sean on the flight......'to ease transition' as she put it. David Goldman never even entertained the thought. He said first and foremost is therapy and counseling for Sean to combat the 5 years of emotional and psychological trauma they put that poor boy through.
"It is now time for our new beginning, the rebirth of our family at such a special time of the year," Goldman wrote in a letter that was read to reporters by U.S. Rep. Chris Smith after the father and son's plane took off.
"Today the abduction has ended," Smith said.
"I was disappointed to see him paraded through the streets," Smith said.
Once inside the US consulate, however, Smith said the boy calmed down, ate a hamburger and talked with his father about basketball and how much snow there might be in New Jersey.
"Once he was with his dad they were smiling, with their arms around one another," Smith said. "They looked just like best buddies."
I think the Goldman case it's a victory to all of us and certainly brings hope to many of us.
my concern is about the great amounts of money spend to finally get his child back.
5 years!
i been 4 years away of my child and i don't reach courts yet (http://www.deltabravo.net/forum/Smileys/default/undecided.gif)
anyway good for the Goldman's.
Jan -
I didn't think it applied if both parents were present, just for one parent traveling without the other.
CM, I'm sure you realize that a passport is good for 10 years........if both parents and the child leave the country for whatever reason, that's one thing, but at any time throughout that 10 years, either one of those parents could take the child out of the country on their own. Thus the reason for BOTH parents to sign for the passport. Also, if both parents signed for the child's passport and one parent has reason to believe that the other parent may leave the country with the child, they can contact federal authorities to have the passport watched, if they did not give consent for the child to leave.
But I really can't see any way of stopping what happened to David and Sean Goldman.....considering he thought they were only going on vacation. He had NO warning whatsoever that her intention was to leave permanently. So he gave his blessing on the trip, only to deal with this fight for the next 5 years.
Adults -- 10 years, Children less....dare I guess 4 or 6.
I agree not sure dad could have prevented this since MOM lied or changed her mind once she got south.
SO....have they landed???
They arrived in Orlando....
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091224/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_brazil_us_custody_battle;_ylt=AmJAhOgAyFRMK5_yIqGmUf29IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTNncm1wN2w1BGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkxMjI0L2x0X2JyYXppbF91c19jdXN0b2R5X2JhdHRsZQRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzMEcG9zAzMEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNib3lhbWVyaWNhbmQ (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091224/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_brazil_us_custody_battle;_ylt=AmJAhOgAyFRMK5_yIqGmUf29IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTNncm1wN2w1BGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkxMjI0L2x0X2JyYXppbF91c19jdXN0b2R5X2JhdHRsZQRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzMEcG9zAzMEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNib3lhbWVyaWNhbmQ)-
Children's passports are only 5 years, adults 10. I already knew that. The traveling without both parents regardless of having a passport was something I had heard and wasn't sure. On the news last night during the update, they confirmed you do not need the other parents approval other than the passport so that answered my question.
For passports, either both parents need to be present when they submit the paperwork, or the one that won't be present needs to sign the Consent form. But after that, you don't need the other parent's approval to travel (the only reason I know is because my hubby is in the military and we are stationed in Japan and he doesn't need a written consent from BM to get SD over here for his secondary custody).
Quote from: CuriousMom on Dec 25, 2009, 06:43:05 AM
Children's passports are only 5 years, adults 10. I already knew that. The traveling without both parents regardless of having a passport was something I had heard and wasn't sure. On the news last night during the update, they confirmed you do not need the other parents approval other than the passport so that answered my question.
"To take the boy on Christmas Day is a heinous crime."
Oh please, give me a break. What about the last 5 Christmas Days, the last 5 birthdays, the last 5 Father's Days, the last 5 blocks of 365 days that the child was taken away from the PARENT? Her heart is broken? How the heck does she think the FATHER felt all those years? Or if she's completely without compassion for males, how about the grandmother and aunts?
"It is inhumane that he left without a guarantee that his grandmotherwould be able to see him in the United States," Tostes said.
If that was inhumane then it was BEYOND inhumane that the child left 5 years ago without a guarantee that his father would get to see him and that it was in fact BLOCKED. Got no sympathy for the grandmother. Makes me mad.
The Children's Passport Issuance Alert Program
http: //travel.state.gov/family/abduction/resources/resources_554.html
I signed my daughter up.
It has been said (I think) that the boy and his father are appearing on the NBC morning show tomorrow (Monday, 12/28).
I very much doubt there will be any mention of the passport process since it does not appear to be relevant in this case.
From the remarks I last heard reported from the father we can expect to hear of the large number of abducted children and the EXPECTED increased ENFORCEMENT efforts resulting from hopeful changes in the law. (Judges find a way not to follow)
Personally, I hope, to set an example, the US withhold the Labor agreements with Brazil and both the grandmother and the deceased mother's husband be criminally charge and convicted.
Further, I hope there is a way to prosecute the deceased mother in abstanence since she was a major player. Very interested in forensic evidence of her death. Everybody may be surprised.
I hope there is some discussion of interstate abductions.
Father still waiting to be called "Dad."
"I said, 'You can call me Dad,'" David Goldman said on NBC's "Today" show. "And he didn't say anything."
There could also be legislation to address other international abduction cases.
U.S. Rep. Chris Smith (New Jersey) is pushing a bill that would allow the U.S. to impose sanctions on countries that don't comply with an international treaty on how to handle similar abduction cases.
There are about 2,800 such cases worldwide involving children from the U.S., officials say.
Hallaluah everybody say cheese !! Poor child.
- SAO PAULO — The Brazilian family of a 9-year-old boy returned by court order to his U.S. father said Tuesday it will fight to regain custody.
Brazilian lawyers (deceased mother's husband family) for the relatives (grandmother) of the kidnapped US boy said they will push forward with a request from his Brazilian grandmother to allow the kidnapped US boy to make his own father-alienated wishes known in court.
The request was initially denied, but the Brazilian Supreme Court has not issued a final ruling on that matter. The court does not convene until February .
"Sean's early delivery does not end the legal process," the lawyers said in a statement. "The legal process in Brazil is not over." The lawyers said that if the Supreme Court rules in favor of the grandmother, the decision will be relayed to American authorities so the boy can be heard.
Five years an early delivery ?? Of course this matter shouldn't go forward. These sickos should be happy they're are not in prison.
I'm glad to hear the boy is back. No doubt he's going to have to go through an awful lot to begin to think well of his father. I've no doubt he's been PAS'd something awful. Hopefully the father will get the boy some therapy.
As to the Supreme Court of Brazil considering the boy's wishes. I would HOPE they'd be smart enough (seems like they were to begin with, at least) that they'd realize that a boy of 9 won't know what his real wishes are when he hasn't seen his father in 4-5 years and has probably been told negative things about his father - like maybe his father didn't want him.
It's going to be a hard adjustment for the child, both culturally and emotionally. Poor kid.
the grandmother's wishes NOT the boy's wishes
Quote from: Davy on Dec 29, 2009, 12:34:40 PM
the grandmother's wishes NOT the boy's wishes
Quote
Lawyers for the relatives of Sean Goldman said they will push forward with a request from his Brazilian grandmother to allow the boy to make his own wishes known in court.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/091229/world/lt_brazil_us_custody_battle (http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/091229/world/lt_brazil_us_custody_battle)
Not that it matters. Nine years old and hasn't seen or heard from his dad in all that time, a boy has no idea what's really best for him.
I'm glad that he'll be spending time with his father. One good thing about this is the longer he spends with his father the less likely they'll send him back. Once he acclimates, they won't want to change him again. *fingers crossed*
LIKE I SAID...the grandmother's wishes NOT the boy's wishes
Every time I hear about one parent (or in this case a grandparent) wanting their child to voice their wishes to the court, it's because that parent knows that the child will say they want to be with that parent. Sean's relatives have already done this in the past, taping him saying he wanted to stay. Of course he's going to say that! Even if he meant it (he doesn't know anything else), it doesn't mean he knows what's best for him!
If this does go forward, and he does need to be heard (I hope not), I hope he tells them just how wonderful life in the US is, with his loving father and extended family, and that though he loves his gma, he is perfectly happy there. Maybe David can delay, delay, delay like they did, so that Sean is even more settled in, and the court will not want to disrupt him - again. Like his mother did.
Gma is nuts. Sean has already texted and spoken to her. David has said she could come and visit him. They are more interested in themselves, and/or making a point. I understand her attachment to Sean, I have grandkids, and raised one for a couple of years. He is not her child. She has to let go.
A quote from an article on abcnews.com:
'Brazilian courts have already turned down the family's initial request to let Sean testify but has not made a final ruling on the matter.
But a U.S. judge said he doesn't believe any ruling by Brazil's courts would be enough to send Sean back.
"Realistically, it's just not going to happen," U.S. District Judge Peter Messette said. "I cannot imagine any judge or any judicial system in the United States sending this boy back."'
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If this is the case, then the grandmother can whine and cry all she wants to, but Sean won't be going back, regardless of what the Brazilian supreme court rules. I can well imagine that David won't even entertain the thought of traveling there, because I wouldn't put it past them (the mother's family) to try to abduct him again. So if they want to see him, they will have to come to the US.
Everybody absolutely needs to understand that this case is clearly about an "abduction" of a child and not primarily about "custody issues" ie primary residency, visitation, parent plans, etc.
Every interstate and international abduction case I have ever read about or heard about goes awry as soon as "mother" is mentioned whereas the abductors government, judicial sytsem, attorneys, abductors and their supporters try to substantiate the resulting illegal behavior against the acts that exist for the protection of children. This case should have been finalized years ago !!!.
In the case at hand, what the abductors say and want simply do not matter. Not the grandMOTHER, her attorneys or their supreme court in any custody matter. Even the abducting parent (if still alive) would have lost her gleeming glamor and privilege.
At this point, the father's only responsibility is to provide a loving, nuturing environment for the child to live and thrive without interference from no-count SOB's.
btdt...and it's a long recovery if ever.
We all know it started as an abduction, but with the mother dying (and the only person they could legally hang an abduction charge on), it is now considered a custody dispute (at least by the Brazilian family), regardless of how we would like to interpret it.
Wrong. Where in the world, interstate or international, does a mother's husband or a grandparent have custody standing equal to a natural parent ??
Legally the same as stranger abduction when a child is held and not returned.
Simply put ... it is not their child. It is not "how we interpret" it is according to long standing legal statues and backed by treatys (international).
You may notice there were no custody hearings in Brazil. Just statutory.