what happens when you can not afford to pay full cs required?

[LESLIEONE1]

Ok, 1st off. My first post a few weeks ago, only got me bashed and crucified so I don't want to go through that again. I am not trying to buck my reponsibilities, I am mother, that got screwed out of physical custody by ex. I now have to pay him. have house for sale, but the amount here in NC is 1/4 of total bring home pay. I have cancelled my phone, cable, and waiting to sell my house. What happens if I truly cannot pay the $385.00 CS to ex. (by the way he makes 75% more a year then I do) Please only sincere replys. This is hard enough on me, I don't need to be crapped on anymore.

[jilly]

I'm not sure of the exact arrearage amount that causes this to kick in (I think it might be $500.00+ in arrears) but what will happen is you will receive a Notice of Motion to Show Cause. This will have a date, time and location for you to appear in Court and the Judge will ask you why you haven't been paying your child support as ordered and why you shouldn't be held in contempt of court for not paying. He'll most likely give you 30 days (or maybe more...depending on his mood that day) to get caught up on the arrears, at which time you will have to come back into Court (if it hasn't been paid) and explain to him why you still haven't paid the arrears. If it's paid in full prior to the next Court date then you will not have to appear.  Also, the Judge may ask if you are able to make a payment that day and will have the Court Clerk take the money to credit towards your arrears. He may also suggest that you have the current order modified.

[Kitty C.]

And the only way to keep that from happening is to file for modification.  But you will have to PROVE why you can't afford the ordered amount.

With the first CS order, did you fill out a financial statement, showing what your monthly income and expenses were? Is your CS based on gross or net income? One-quarter of monthly income for CS is pretty standard, so you will need to prove that either your income or your expenses (and they have to be legit, only saying this because that's what the court will say) prohibit you from paying the amount ordered.

Many people, in filling out income and expense forms, fail to realize just where all their 'disposable' income really goes or how much they truly spend on variable expenses, such as gas, groceries, etc.  I would recommend you go over your records VERY closely for maybe at least the past six months (to get median amounts) and check your disposable and variable expenses.  

One thing you need to be very careful of is getting rid of what could be considered needed utilities, like your phone.  If you have a cell phone also, and the kids know how to use it in an emergency, that's fine.  But you have to have a way to dial at least 911, at least when the kids are with you.

It may mean more cooking at home and less eating out, going with your current wardrobe longer than you expected or recycling it, or shopping at second-hand stores (BT, DT, still do!), but sometimes you REALLY have to get creative on where to trim the pennies.

I know one of the things that got severely curbed was our vacations.  Since our honeymoon 5 1/2 years ago (which was only 4 days long and 200 miles away in the Ozarks), we've been on two real vacations, the longest being a camping trip just this past summer for a week.  And the other was only for DH and I that we used our refund on!  It's the ONLY time it wasn't pegged for either back support or bills that had to be caught up on because of paying support instead!

[LESLIEONE1]

Thank you for your reply. Believe me I can prove that I cannot afford it. North Carolina maybe different as far as guidelines for CS. They have not asked for anything but monthly gross income. They use the Child support guidline worksheet and it calculates for you. The court could care less if you can or cannot afford it.

I made the mistake of purchasing a home after my divorce to keep my children in their school district, at the time I had full phys custody, little did I know it would be cut in half, then cut all together, thanks to the wonderful court system. I have my house on the market but it could take a while to sell. I have no cable, no home phone. I work a full time and a part time job. I do not go shopping, I eat  lunch and dinner everyday at home. I can not tell you whe I took a vacation. I use my complete income for food, shelter, water, elect. the basics needed.  There is nothing left. Do you know what they give you for plasma?

[Kitty C.]

I don't know if this is nation wide, but in the blood donor center at the hospital where I work, they no longer pay for plasma or platelets.  

BUT I used to work for a plasma center (11 years ago!) and they then paid $20 a shot, and you could donate up to 2 times a week.  In all, you could make about $120 a month then.   I don't know what they're paying now.  And if it's a for-profit plasma collection center, they WILL pay!

Nothing but gross monthly......what a bitch.........

[cathy]

In NC, they court will send you a notice.  I know my husband ex-wife was either 2 or 3 months without paying (order is for $340/month plus $50 towards arrears).  

Generally, the first thing they will try is wage garnishment if you have a job.  Your employer will have no choice but to take the amount out and send to court.  I think there is also an additional $2/check charge you have to pay your employer.

If that doesn't do it, there are other remedies - from taking your driver's license to putting you in jail.

[cathy]

Really not trying to discourage you, but you may as well be prepared.  It is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to get a deviation from guidelines in North Carolina - at least in the county I'm in (Wake) - - where are you?

My husband's ex tried to get out of paying - claiming that she didn't make enough and couldn't afford it and that their older son that was living with her needed extensive therapy for Aspergers.  (Kid is almost 20 and there was never anything said the need for therapy prior to us filing for child support).

Our lawyer said she had only gotten one deviation - and that was only temporary in an extreme case.

[jilly]

In NC they use the income shares model and they go by gross instead of net. The only thing they ask you for is paystubs for the last 3 months.

[cathy]

Yup - in this case, I think the amount has already been set.  I think typically they will ask for a financial affidavit - I know we had to fill them out.  Not totally sure why because they weren't really used in determining the amount.  They also take into account other children, extraordinary expense, insurance, stuff like that.

There is a child support calculator for NC online:

https://nddhacts01.dhhs.state.nc.us/home.jsp?TargetScreen=WorkSheet.jsp

[joni]

when was the last time your CS was evaluated by the court?  you need to have this done.  the problem you may encounter is this, CS is based on your income, not your bills.  if you're overextended because of your bills, the court won't take that into account because you're overextended by the cost of your living.  it's different that not being able to afford CS support that, for instance, was calculated on income of say $75,000 and now you're earning $25,000 or you're unemployed.

one way to approach this is to appeal to your Ex, put all your cards on the table, your bills, whatever and show him what you're doing to get back on your feet, such as selling your house and stuff.  ask him to give you "x" amount of time to get back on your feet by reducing your support to something that you can afford.  of course, you would have to do this without the court calculating the order by requesting that the court is not involved other than to sign off on the reduced CS order.

if your Ex doesn't cut you a break, welcome to a Club that many of us on this board belongs to....those counting the days until their kids turn 18 or the day the NCP can become to the CP.  it's a large club with many members tinkering on the brink of bankrupty....my husband included.

[KAT]

Ex isn't going to cut her a break. He had the children 50% of time, but she still demanded child support. What comes around, goes around.

NC is NOT likely to deviate from the guidelines simply because you can't afford it.  You'll start getting notices & then when it reaches 6 months or several grand you'll have to tell it to the judge. Arrears pile up, so does the interest. Luckily you have the right plumbing to cry your way out of it for several years before anything is really done to you for CRIMINAL NON SUPPORT.

What you can do? Start selling on e-bay. Heck, my sister clears 400 a month selling (used but in excellant condition, look for custom made ones) curtains she buys at Goodwill. It's NOT easy, it's certainly not fun,  but it helps her pay the mtg.

Actually, even though it doesn't sound like it, you do have my sympathy. HOWEVER we need more WOMEN to start SCREAMING & COMPLAINING about having to actually PAY child support for the laws to get changed. I bet before you found yourself in this position you never thought once upon hearing the term *Deadbead Dad*that the man simply couldn't AFFORD to pay & live too. Kinda changes things huh? Now, what are you going to do about it? VOTE, write letters, complain, kick & scream until someone listens then keep going until the laws are changed. Your 50 parenting time should not have been taken away unless you were proven unfit (which I don't think was the case, your ex didn't feel he should have to support your household so he did what he could not to....)

Good Luck.

KAT

[cathy]

PBFH was 3 months behind, or $1170.  Out went the notice to appear in court.

And you are right about the deviation...

[wendl]

I really think it depends on your state.

I am in WA my ex is 20K behind for my child, 10k for another womans child and 5k for another womans child.

Last payment I received was $29 in Sept.

Here in WA if the ncp is attempting to pay they really don't do much, like in my case ex has contempt charges filed against him by the state back in August, ex and the prosecutor are SUPPOSABLY working together but no contempt orders and really no cs as he is ATTEMPTING to pay.

I would speak with your cs worker and explain you have no problem paying support but cannot come up with the entire amount and ask if they could work with you.

You can also file a motion to modify CS based on your income etc and hopefully they will reduce it.

Good luck

**These are my opinions, they are not legal advice**

[cathy]

http://info.dhhs.state.nc.us/olm/manuals/dss/cse/man/index.htm

You may want to review the information here - especially under enforcement.

You may want to call DHHS for any clarification you might need.  

BTW - what county are you in?

[jilly]

Yeah...in NC you get the notice when your arrears reaches $500.00.

My DH just received a notice that he had to pay $538.00 by November 1. He was in arrears because he changed jobs.  He is currently working as temp-to-hire.  He gave the agency he is working for all the information they needed prior to working for them and they just now started withholding CS from his paycheck. Until that time he wrote checks directly to CSE for CS.  I called the automated system on the 26th and as of that date the current amount owed was $161.38, so I doubt anything will come from the notice.  Of course, that's just from one County (Rockingham).  I'm not sure what the current amount owed or balance owed is for SD.  That information has to come from Rowan County.

His former employer sent in notice to CSE that he was no longer working for them but I don't know if they gave the new employer information.  I don't think they did because Rockingham County DSS sent him a letter requesting he contact them immediately and provide them with his new employer information. His respnse was "F*** them! I'm not giving them information so they can increase my child support!"  Anyway, it's not like they don't have ways to find that information without getting it from him.  So far, haven't heard anything else from them and hopefully we won't.

[LESLIEONE1]

you are right on some of the issues but as far as my parenting time taken away, it wasnt taken away so to speak. Kids boys 13, 16 stated they wanted to live with dad. Judge listened thought they were old enough to decide and granted it...plain and simple...heartbreaking on my end.We had both gone to evaluation and were both proven as fit parents, that was not the issue in court, it was what did the kids want.

[LESLIEONE1]

I will ck out the website.  I live in High Point, NC..guilford county.  My case is a very unusual one. He is in arrears by $2,000 and has been for 2 years...now tables turn, I have to pay and basically lost my kids, besides everyother week visitation. EX threatend me one day he would take the kids and I would have to pay him. He followed thru by being vendictive, bad mouthing me to my boys, and being able to buy them anything and everything they wanted. At 13 and 16 and going thru a family break up, this influenced them enough to tell the judge we love mom but want to live with dad....go figure.

[Wi-Mom]

Unless you have a rare blood type like AB neg. My brother had a girlfriend who used to make good money selling it. My son happens to have AB neg... hmm..

[Wi-Mom]

You know.. when my DH's 1st wife suddenly decided she was in love with another man.. he was a full time college student at the time. He did not have a job.. instead he took out a large enough school loan to pay tuition and the rent for the year. His wife worked at a bar for $5/hour for food. The idea was to get a degree so they could have a better life....

So she brings home another guy, says, "I never loved you get out.." The judge ordered DH to quit school, get a job and start supporting his kids. He got a job in a bakery for $8/hr. Upon quitting school the school loans became due immediately and he found his wages not only garnished for child support for their two children, but his check also garnished for the school loan. (10 Years later he's still paying that off!) He had no way to pay rent or anything, so he went to the Salvation Army in the area (Turned from satanism to Christianity) and literally ate once a week when his parents made the 5 hour drive every weekend to take him out to dinner. Finally, he moved in with them.. which is where he was living when I met him because there has never been any possible way he could ever afford to live on his own. He will forever be greatful to the Salvation Army, and if he were posting here he would make sure you knew that is an option if things get that bad.

[KAT]

it happens all the time. It's called Parental Alienation Syndrome, degrees vary. There is plenty of information on this site or do a web search.
DH's ex made it just bad enough so that Daddy could never get custody back...but close enough to the line where he wouldn't be arrested...ahh, who would pay support if he was in jail then eh? BTW, she lives in a little blue trailer, junk cars on the lawn, 2 dogs tied up in the back, couch on the porch in NC. You don't want to rent anywhere near that evil...it leaks ou the doors and I believe it could suffocate an upright, moral person.
KAT