Interstate/Long Distance Joint/Primary Physical Custody

[testypants]

I am an out of state father entering into a custody and child support case. The custody elements as of yet have not been established or begun. I have not yet been ordered to pay child support (a court date has been set to decide the monetary amount). Currently, paternity has been verified through DNA testing but no legal orders so far as I know. I am simply looking into the paperwork and hoping to find a solution as soon as possible.

My question is: While living out of state (roughly 300 miles away), what are my chances of obtaining at least joint physical (and legal) custody at this point? Somewhere around 50/50 or as much time as possible to be with my child – having him in my home.

Are such arrangements awarded? If not, what kind of scenario should I be looking for or expecting? The child is about half a year old.

Can the idea of obtaining primary physical custody from the mother even be entertained at this time?

The mother is unresponsive to communications and denying all visitation at this juncture.

[ocean]

Can you go for 50/50, yes. Will you get it? Probably not. There are different kinds of custody. You SHOULD fight for JOINT LEGAL custody (regarding school and health decisions, major decisions). Then you will get a a parenting plan. Since you are talking about 2 different states, miles involved, and young child, you most likely will not get primary custody or even 50/50 especially since you have not seen child for a while.

Since child is not in school yet, the parenting plan can be flexible BUT you want a detailed plan with days, times, and where pick-ups/drop offs will be. The plan should include a holiday schedule, birthday (yours and child), and summer schedule (Think about when child is in school, long holiday weekends, long weeks at holidays, and summer).

First send her an email or letter (trackable) to prove you are trying to communicate to her. Offer to meet child in a public place in her town a few times. Ask her to get back to you by a certain date. This way you can start to see child and child will get to know you. If she denies this, then the courts will start a schedule. Sometimes it is a graduated schedule : Father will have child xx hours for xx times then move to full days then brought back to his house for weekends then maybe longer weekends or one week a month. Does mom work? Does child go to daycare? Look up parenting plans here, get a very detailed one as possible as it is VERY VERY hard to change a court order, they rely on that first one as the one you agreed to. It can be changed but you really want to get this one right as much as possible. You can even say you will go back to court when child gets to school age to revisit parenting plan for when child goes to school.

Custody is very hard to get as you will have to prove neglect/abuse and child protective services usually has to be involved. Start out asking for a graduated plan with the goal of 50/50 but daycare and distance here is an issue. Did you move away? If you moved, you will probably have to responsible for transportation or you can have a half way point to meet or you can do who ever is receiving child picks up (so you both are on time).

Child support will include: child support, splitting health costs, splitting daycare costs, splitting activities and school costs.

Ask questions...we are not lawyers but have been through family court many many times. When you go back to court the first thing you want is temporary orders to see child, focus on that so you get to see child during this LONG custody process that could take up to a year or more to fully settle. Family court is very very slow.

[tigger]

Excellent advice given except one thing:

Child support will include: child support, splitting health costs, splitting daycare costs, splitting activities and school costs.

This depends on your state.  In NC CS is ONLY monthly child support.  CSE (Child Support Enforcement) has NOTHING to do with splitting health care (unless you can prove extraordinary expenses), activities or school costs.  Daycare is entered in the formula. 

[testypants]

Can you go for 50/50, yes. Will you get it? Probably not. There are different kinds of custody. You SHOULD fight for JOINT LEGAL custody (regarding school and health decisions, major decisions). Then you will get a a parenting plan. Since you are talking about 2 different states, miles involved, and young child, you most likely will not get primary custody or even 50/50 especially since you have not seen child for a while.

Since child is not in school yet, the parenting plan can be flexible BUT you want a detailed plan with days, times, and where pick-ups/drop offs will be. The plan should include a holiday schedule, birthday (yours and child), and summer schedule (Think about when child is in school, long holiday weekends, long weeks at holidays, and summer).

First send her an email or letter (trackable) to prove you are trying to communicate to her. Offer to meet child in a public place in her town a few times. Ask her to get back to you by a certain date. This way you can start to see child and child will get to know you. If she denies this, then the courts will start a schedule. Sometimes it is a graduated schedule : Father will have child xx hours for xx times then move to full days then brought back to his house for weekends then maybe longer weekends or one week a month. Does mom work? Does child go to daycare? Look up parenting plans here, get a very detailed one as possible as it is VERY VERY hard to change a court order, they rely on that first one as the one you agreed to. It can be changed but you really want to get this one right as much as possible. You can even say you will go back to court when child gets to school age to revisit parenting plan for when child goes to school.

Custody is very hard to get as you will have to prove neglect/abuse and child protective services usually has to be involved. Start out asking for a graduated plan with the goal of 50/50 but daycare and distance here is an issue. Did you move away? If you moved, you will probably have to responsible for transportation or you can have a half way point to meet or you can do who ever is receiving child picks up (so you both are on time).

Child support will include: child support, splitting health costs, splitting daycare costs, splitting activities and school costs.

Ask questions...we are not lawyers but have been through family court many many times. When you go back to court the first thing you want is temporary orders to see child, focus on that so you get to see child during this LONG custody process that could take up to a year or more to fully settle. Family court is very very slow.

Thank ocean, this all proved quite helpful.

I am originally from another state -- never moved or took residence up in his current state.

In your view, from the get go here, my odds of obtaining a hefty chunk of time/custody with my son is very slim at this point?

My concern is since this is a long distance setup, it is not overly feasible to be driving there and back every other day or so for example. This most likely means I will be awarded the few and far between visitation days? Or do they hand out schedules more along the lines of what I referred to initially?

[ocean]

Look up long distance plans for non school age. You can have in papers that if you give other parent 48 hours notice, if you are in child's area, you can take child for up to xx days and keep child where you are staying (hotel).

Child is very young and I am not that familiar with long distance plans that young but both parents can parent child. How is your work schedule? If you had child with you for one week out of the month, would child be in daycare a lot that week? Work around your schedule and see what you can figure out to see child every month or every other month even if one of them have to be in child's area.

When child is older, can child fly to you? Depending on the airline, children can fly alone around 5 years old. Might want that in papers with direct flights from xx airport to xx airport and who pays for it.

When school age, then yes, you are looking at long distance plan which is usually splitting holidays weeks even and odd years. Odd child would be with you for thanksgiving days off (make sure this is outlined very well, child will be with father from last day of school until night before school starts again - usually wed-sunday off that week for kids here).
So split these holidays every other year:

Columbus day weekend (3 days, maybe in child's town?)
Thanksgiving break (wed-sunday)
christmas from first day child has off until dec 26 OR dec 26- jan1
Martin Luther King (3 day weekend)
Feb break (we have one week off for kids during presidents week off)
April break (easter or passover)
Memorial Day weekend (at least 3 sometimes 4-5 if they did not use snow days)

Look online at child's district calendar to see when they have off.

You can also add skype/face video app on certain days to see and talk to child, even as a toddler for a few minutes.

The only way to get more contact time is by moving closer if possible. Then most would get a few night visits (if you work) and a day on the weekend, something like that.

[MixedBag]

In my son's school district there were additional 3-day weekend created because of teacher in-service days too.

And yes, when he got older, I flew him back and forth over a weekend.....he learned that I thought family was important...

And now as an adult (well, at 20) has made 3 trips down here 12 hour drive friday, stayed saturday (for weddings), and drove back sunday.  he gets it.

[testypants]

In my son's school district there were additional 3-day weekend created because of teacher in-service days too.

And yes, when he got older, I flew him back and forth over a weekend.....he learned that I thought family was important...

And now as an adult (well, at 20) has made 3 trips down here 12 hour drive friday, stayed saturday (for weddings), and drove back sunday.  he gets it.

That is very fortunate and high minded of you to take such an approach. As opposed to my scenario where the mother basically makes a powerplay (due to the flawed child custody system in my eyes!) and denies me all access, leaving me with no legal recourse at the moment. And I have little doubt they will be rewarding her behavior with a grand custody judgement Joy oh joy

[testypants]

The only way to get more contact time is by moving closer if possible. Then most would get a few night visits (if you work) and a day on the weekend, something like that.

Ocean, are you familiar with the standard/average/regular court ruling on overnight or shorter extended stays for young children? I've been reading a number of sites -- some say no younger than 3 years old for the first overnight visit!? Others are stating even as young as 6 months has worked out fine for them. Has there been any actual evidence to substantiate any of these claims? Generally I see the mothers agree with the 3 year rule... and I can see why (no hassle with visitation/departing for 3 uninterrupted years). The catch is IF the non-custodial has/is spending a lot of time with the child then it is more likely. However, it becomes almost as case of employers wanting experience but not hiring anyone without it. The question is: how can I get the experience? If I'm denied access to my son, there can be no establishing of a relationship, and it seems the courts will side even more heavily with the mother as a result. Once again, in my eyes, rewarding her for preventing me from bonding.

Do they factor this into the arrangements? I heard they look at which parent will be more amenable to facilitating visitations for the other. I imagine her denying me would be frowned upon (for what good that does me).

[testypants]

Also as stated, I have an upcoming child support hearing scheduled. As of yet (obviously!) the mother and I have no parenting plan mapped out. Should I attend the hearing with my own idea formulated to present to the judge? Or does the matter of custody even come into play here when nothing is finalized? California btw.

[ocean]

Depends on the judge and area. It is getting better with allowing both parents to have visitation from birth. It really depends on how often you can get/be with child. That is one thing that you should stand your ground. You can parent just like the other parent can. Go to your local library or your local family court. Take a parenting course. Take infant and child CPR course. It will look good for court. Sign up at least and say you are enrolled. You do not need experience to parent. Offer the gradual plan for a few months but get it in writing when it will change and to what. If it is not written down, you do not have it and can not enforce it.

For severe custody cases with major fighting, they will look at which parent would be better at parenting and communicating with other parent, especially if it is already 50/50 and now they need to decide on one parent being primary. Most times in this country it is the mother, and mother gets more chances to retain custody. A child so young, you really will not get primary custody without something major in the other parents home.

Child support, look up California child support calculator. Put in your numbers. Some states take both parents income in the formula, some just the non custodial parent. NY it is 17% of income for one child. You can ask that you get travel credit to get child, since you did not move and never was in child's state. This will help with gas and plane tickets. At the hearing you can ask for it to be postponed until you get a parenting plan set as you want to see how much court ordered travel will be incurred. Or you can agree that you will pay to get child and she will pay to get child back (driving all the way). Or agree to meet at half way point, both incur costs.

[testypants]

Depends on the judge and area. It is getting better with allowing both parents to have visitation from birth. It really depends on how often you can get/be with child. That is one thing that you should stand your ground. You can parent just like the other parent can. Go to your local library or your local family court. Take a parenting course. Take infant and child CPR course. It will look good for court. Sign up at least and say you are enrolled. You do not need experience to parent. Offer the gradual plan for a few months but get it in writing when it will change and to what. If it is not written down, you do not have it and can not enforce it.

For severe custody cases with major fighting, they will look at which parent would be better at parenting and communicating with other parent, especially if it is already 50/50 and now they need to decide on one parent being primary. Most times in this country it is the mother, and mother gets more chances to retain custody. A child so young, you really will not get primary custody without something major in the other parents home.

Child support, look up California child support calculator. Put in your numbers. Some states take both parents income in the formula, some just the non custodial parent. NY it is 17% of income for one child. You can ask that you get travel credit to get child, since you did not move and never was in child's state. This will help with gas and plane tickets. At the hearing you can ask for it to be postponed until you get a parenting plan set as you want to see how much court ordered travel will be incurred. Or you can agree that you will pay to get child and she will pay to get child back (driving all the way). Or agree to meet at half way point, both incur costs.

Do you have any resources that explain the travel credit situation? I googled a bit to no avail.

And if you are capable and have the time, can you give me a breakdown of the court hearing and how I might proceed?

For example: At this point I will basically walk in there with nothing other than a DNA test, no custody papers, and no contact/visitation at this point. The judge is going to look at my income, see the 0 time spent with father, and set the amount accordingly? At what point and what steps would I take to alter or as you mentioned postpone these items? As of now I can't establish a parenting plan with the mother because she has proven unresponsive. So any plan I have in mind will be entirely one sided -- unless I can quickly file through a court paper to begin the proceedings for custody before the hearing?

[MixedBag]

ok, NONE of us are attorneys....we're all simply parents.

Go to the root page of this place -- where you can find a link to the articles and start reading as appropriate.

There's good information out there and reader/user friendly.

I'm starting to get concerned -- that you don't have an attorney to help you through this.

[testypants]

ok, NONE of us are attorneys....we're all simply parents.

Go to the root page of this place -- where you can find a link to the articles and start reading as appropriate.

There's good information out there and reader/user friendly.

I'm starting to get concerned -- that you don't have an attorney to help you through this.

Are there many low income/free lawyers I can get access to? With lawyer fees, filing fees, back child support coming in, and travel expenses, I'll be in quite a hole -- all without seeing my son to begin with.

[ocean]

Yes, you can file next week but you need to file with her family court. Call them Monday and see if their custody and visitation petitions are online (or look on their website), if not, ask that they mail you a set of papers. Fill it out and send it back to go there and drop it off.

At the hearing, you will be called in, if your papers are in judge will see that. If not, say "I am willing to support my child, I have just filed for a visitation plan and want to see my child as often as possible. As of today, ex is not allowing visits. I am requesting transportation credit as I will be traveling often to see child".

Judge may order temporary judgment until you have your other hearing, may postponed and do it all at once, or tell you to pay xx and to refile when you know how much travel everyone is doing.

The amount should be set as you have standard visitation. Judge understands this is your first time and will go get visitation order next if it is not part of this hearing. Since you are coming from afar, hopefully something will happen as here they postpone a lot and tell you to come back next month.

You can do the paperwork yourself or hire a lawyer near her to do it for you. You pay them to file for you and then come to the hearings. Ask if you can hire them per hearing instead a big amount -retainer in the beginning. Offer to file papers yourself so save money. THis first one, you should try to get a lawyer there with you. Call family court by her and see if you qualify for legal aid.

[testypants]

A little update on the case:

From reading the papers she sent in here, her claim is basically saying I made threats to steal the baby away, she is frightened by me, and states I have no bond (or interest) with the child. She is afraid I will run off with him.

I view this as her ploy to deny me access to my child for as long as possible, so when the court date rolls around she can claim I have established no bond or relationship with him and hope it gives her even more power in the custody matters. Despite the fact she is the one refusing me access, yet claiming it is my idea. I have written conversations which refute her story, however.

I am documenting all conversations, dates, and times.

Any input?

[MixedBag]

Who moved away?  You from your child -- or her taking the child?

IMHO travel -- there isn't going to be a detailed description of how this is handled again IMHO.  SO, you have to gather documentation on the different potential ways this is going to happen.  For example -- go to Mapquest, print off directions from A-B.  That gives you miles and hours.  How much gas is that gonna be?  (ROUGH estimate, food, hotel)....think like you would do your taxes and business expenses. What about flying?  add in the unaccompanied minor fee.  Add in your fee if you have to accompany the child because they are too young to fly on their own.

FIND the clause in the state's code that says CS can be adjusted due to extra-ordinary expenses -- if you moved away -- skip all this stuff.....travel is your responsiblity 80% of the time and not worth arguinging in court.

IMHO -- again -- k?  Travel expenses should be split according to income ratio.  Use minimum hourly wage for the other side's income if they don't work or won't provide their income (it's something).

No Contact -- send something in the mail twice a week asking for time with the child -- send it in a way that you can verify she received it.  (First Class Confirmed Delivery costs less than $2 and is a fairly new service -- set up a paypal account to print off the label at home, stick it in a larger envelope, 2 ounces....probably $1.69)  In the past I recommended priority confirmed -- but this option is cheaper.
When is court for CS?  Will a temporary parenting plan that includes parenting time be addressed?