Something that I read somewhere and wondered about was the second hand smoke issue..Although both my wife and are smokers we always made it a point not to smoke in the house but in the computer room as we called it, it was way in the back of the house (well later my wife started smoking in the bedroom with the door closed as well) so that the children, especially the baby, were not exposed to second hand smoke...Now my wife and the kids live in Ohio at Cathee's house (her best friend..read the previous message for more explaination) and my wife, Cathee, Cathee's boy freind and almost anyone that they know smokes...I know that I have no say about my 3 step-daughters and of course I am not trying to have any say as to what goes on in anyone's home (Cathee has made it very clear LOL that what goes on in her house is her business thats how my wife got into trouble in the first place) BUT my concern is this..what about the massive amounts of second hand smoke my son is now exposed to? I mean no matter what my wife or her friends say they are not going to start smoking outside or in some room away from the baby, especially since they never had to do it before and Cathee wont let anyone tell he what to do in her house LOL, and my wife has nowhere else to live at the moment nor does she choose to go somewhere else, so is this something I can bring up in mediation or am I just being foolish? Another question What is PAS I have seen it mentioned and have no idea what it means?
Simple facts are, you can bring anything up in mediation. Now,,, can you get a judge to sign off on the second hand smoke issue? Probably not,, unless a child is asthmatic, and is forced to seek medical care emergently due to smoke.
Second, can you enforce it? Hell no. Not any way to enforce anything like that.
PAS: Parental Alienation Syndrome.
Also see, Malicious Mother Syndrome.
You'll find plenty of articles and research on SPARC's website for these and other issues.
Personally, I would concentrate mediation on issues that CAN be resolved and see if you two can come up with an agreement you both can live with.
On another note,, your ex has no place of her own,, does she work?
It may behoove you to request a homestudy be done on both parties.
Child EndangermentBy Smoking?
Judge Orders Woman to Stop Smoking or Risk Losing Visitation Rights With Son
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/smoker_visitation020327.html
no she doesn't work and has no intention of working, she in reality wants the baby as well as he rother children as an end to the means, meaning the supprt check, so to her anything other than full, sole custody for her just wont do, she wants the cash..as for her living arrangments, she lives with her best friend, her bf boyfriend and 2 children and my wife and our 1 yr old son and her other 3 children...knowing my wife as well as I do and because I have seen how she treates her first husband with their kids (as well as how she treats the kids) if I can't somehow get to be the primary caretaker I will spend the rest of my life in court, like her first husband does, just to see my son and have to live everyday wondering everyday if he is getting what he needs, I really think it is a shame that she will get control for lack of a better word over him, because she ran off, and she wants the cash and she created this 200 mile distance between us, etc...but she will never take the time to be his mom or a parent and will pawn him off, like she does the girls, to everyone else, when he has a father who has been saying since day one I wll be glad to continue in the responsibility role, but no one in the system is listening and my son pays for that.....Now to me thats sad
So, you want to go into mediation and demand that she and everyone else in that home stop smoking around the kids? That's fine, second hand smoke kills....however, the 1st thing your ex is going to do is put a stick in your wheel by letting the mediator know you smoke as well.
What you should do, if you're that concerned, is smoke NOWHERE in your home. I'm a smoker, too. I'm outside, rain show or shine. My little butt is out there in blizzards, when the temp is below zero, when it's up over a hundred. It sucks, but my childrens lungs are MUCH more important than me being warm, dry, or whatever. We refuse to smoke in the car, whether the kids are in it or not.
Even if you "did" manage to get the Judge to prevent them smoking in their house (which I don't think is going to happen) you can never enforce this. It isn't possible. And you must remember...even if you do smoke in the computer room waaaaaaaaaaaaay back at the end of the house? The kids are still getting it. Put one of those incense sticks in the computer room, close the door, go to the furthest point in the house...and eventually, the aroma will find its way out of that room.
In Illinois, smoking is in the State Statutes. It states that it is a form of child abuse.
I smoke too, but not in the car. I smoke in the house, but only in one room and I have a hepa air cleaner that is excellent. When the weather is good, I go outside. When my son is here, no smoking allowed by anyone, anywhere.
"Children learn what they live"
Well I found out just a bit ago that my wife's lawyer ask for a continuance and will probably get it, meaning it will be at the earliest another month before we even get to mediation :-( another month she can get herself setup in Ohio, to my disadvantage :-( I was alos informed that she finally got the baby's birth certificate, ss card and her birth certificate so she can get on welfare there, man I tell you it feels like no matter what I do right it doesnt seem to be right enough and she gets away with doing nothing :-( I will try and keep everyone update
jaimes_dad
It seems like nothing in this system is fair or right. She will probably get her continuance. Use this time to get things in order. Documentation will be very important.
Do you have visitation set up at this time? How long has she been in Ohio?
Start reading all the articles this site has to offer. The more you know, the better you can handle whats going on. Check your state statues.
Hang in there, we have all been where you are right now...
Yea I am learning that the very painful hard way..sat down and had a good cry today at the thought of my son, being raised like an animal the way she raised her girls and the court saying it is in the best interest of the child :-( I am so confused as to what to get into order and everyone keeps talking about documentation. but it seems like everytime I think I have some sort of documentation my lawyer (legal aid by the way all I can afford) tells me that it isn't anything substantial :-( No we don't have any visitations setup yet, my lawyer is objecting to the continuance and if they get it wants some kind of "temporary custody" which from everything I have read on here pretty much does me in :-( Besides it won't matter whether they say I can see him or not, my wife and her best friend where she is staying at will make it impossible to see him. One reason being I will have to live in fear of false accusations. Heck false accusations is how the got the local police to make me surrender him to her ion the first place. :-( She has been in Ohio since January 5th 2004...The state of Pennsylvania statues I can't seem to find and if I find anything I dont understand half of it..I was hoping to be atleast somewaht prepared, but everyone keeps telling me that she has it madde, because she is the mom, he is one year old, and it doesn't matter that I was the primary caregiver for him and her 3 girls over the last 2 years, cuz I don't have offical documentation, other than some letters from doctors, etc..so she will get exactally what she wants and I will get the scraps...Sux knowing that my son will be punished by losing daily contact with his father, because his mother wanted some guy off of the internet...where's the justic in that? I will never understand this system nor what the courts interpretation of "best interest of the child" is..I will let everyone know what happens tomorrow and thanks :-)
Night
Just over a year ago, I was where you are now. Ex took off and I did not see my son for 3 loooong months. It was a hell I can't begin to describe. Missed the first Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Years and his first Birthday. He was 10 months old. I shared in his care giving.
I think those doctors letters are a very good start. Go thru any paper work you have. There may be some things you overlooked. I still go thru my papers and find things I did not see before. And I have been thru them at least 20 times. Any bank records of joint accounts? Try to catagorize them. Do you have phone records showing you call to try to see him?
Sit down with a calandar from last year and try to think of as many occurances as you can. Something that might show a pattern. Do you have neighbors, friends and family that witnessed you being the caregiver? Did you take your son to Church? Do you think she might have a relative who would be sympathic toward you.
I think in most states, the child has to be a resident for 6 months. You may be able to file for visitation in your state. This is not a slam for legal aid. Thank God they are there willing to do what they can. But people go to doctors for a 2nd opinion, why not an attorney. Most give a free consultation for the first visit and you may pick up some very important information. This site has information on every state. Start reading. If you have questions, there are plenty of us here to help you. Don't be afraid to ask anything.
VERY Legal stuff, you can ask Socrateaser.
As far as her and her friend trying to keep you from your son, once visitation is set, she will be in contempt. And you file on her everytime she pulls something and keeps you from your parenting time. If you are worried about false accusations, bring a witness who is holding a camera. If you can tape, TAPE!
Didn't you mention that she does not work. How can she take care of a child if she can't take care of herself? It's called employment instability and it would be easy to look into her work history. I would also be curious on what kind of people she has around those kids. Ever thought of checking out her friend? You can find things pretty easy by doing google searches. Just type in what you want and there it is. I will even include the State. I find more on google searches then thru net detective or something like it.
It would not hurt to bring in candid pictures of you and your son together. Show the bonding that is already there. Judges like visuals.
Don't be too quick on thinking she will get everything she wants, YOU HAVE RIGHTS TOO.
You just have to fight for them.
Good Luck, keep us posted
Ok, I know everyone says to document.
Some things to consider when you are preparing fo court.....does she have any kind of a record? Does she have any kind of mental history?
Go ahead and find a PI in your area, pay the several hundred for a backgound check on her. You might be surprised.
IF there is any of these types of histories, prepare a subpeona, have it delivered to the appropriate facility, and request any and all documents to be delivered to you, with an additional true copy brought to court by the Custodian of Records on court date.
Where ae the accusations against you curently in all this? Have they been proven false? If so, file a rebuttal against her claim of being primary caregiver due to false police report, and demand that your son be immediately returned home.
In my opinion, is truly a crock of shit. I understand that the best interest of the child should be paramount....but it's not. Best interest of the child usually means "where the childs been living" rather than what's really best.
Yes, temporary custody to the mother can be your downfall...but don't give up. Even though it is next to impossible to reverse a temp. order, it can be done. I did it. I've even reversed a permanent order once my temporary reversal was reversed again. LOL....it's a friggin nightmare, but there's always hope. Grab onto whatever hope you can and keep on going.
-----so she will get exactally what she wants and I will get the scraps...-----
Those "scraps" are what you have to hold near and dear. She'll toss you a bone every now and then (maybe an extra day here or there) but you HAVE to keep the hope alive that one day justice will be served.
Well I had to drive an hour in one of the worst snowstorms I have seen in awhile for a 5 minute meeting. My wife Amy got her continuance. She wasn't present because her lawyer said that her and her friend Cathee, the one that started all this trouble and whom my wife thinks is a God and wants to live her life, got into a car accident, apparently the slide on some ice and rolled the durango over, but other than bruised and sore they are ok..Thank God..I still love my wife and I probably always will, I just don't want to live the life she does...I asked her lawyer to pass on the message to contact us and let he know when she gets home and that she is ok, the lawyer said she would, but I doubt if we will her from Amy, she all of a sudden stopped talking to my family and has dropped off the computer totally, I even found out that she deleted her yahoo group, the one that started alot of this trouble as well, so I don't know whats going on with that...I think what hurts the most is how quickly she just seems to have forgotten about the last two years its like it never existed...you know she actually had the nereve to call and leave a message on my answering machine and then contact me on the computer last week and ask me to fix this guy (Dave) computer because he couldn't get online LOL I couldn't beleive it, then when I jokingly said I would she said he said never mind, etc, etc, because he didnt want me to see what was on his computer and I asked her if they had something to hide and of course she said no, then she said he was pissed at me because I ruined his life, by letting everyone in their group know what was going on and now his freinds wont talk to him, and Amy blames me for ruining her life as well, because I won't put up with letting her do what she and stay married for the kids sake, the last mesasage she left on my chat was were we going to stay married and start over from scratch? I was like what? and she said that we would talk about it tuesday the 3rd (today) I guess it is like a friend of mine said the other day, You can't talk rational to an inrational person.
As for her having any record, not that I know of, but I do know that one of her relatives made a comment to me once that Cathee got her into trouble "big time" about 7 years back, but with Amy's family "big time" could be anything...I do remember my wife saying to my mother once that when her oldest daughter, she's 14 now, was younger her parents called CPS on her several times, but I can only assume that anything that old, especially if it was unfounded, would be gone by now.
As for her mental history, to my knowledge she has never been professionaly diagnosed, but as someone who deals with depression every day, I know that she has sever problem with depression and ocd, I think thats what its called. I know that from day one her family said to me that Amy has been depressed for most of her life. I have emails where they tell her to seek help, take her meds, etc and sleep at night not in the daytime. In fact I have a hand written letter from her mother stating just that, that she needs to get good sleep at night not in day. I also have several handwritten letters from her oldest daughter, who by the way at one time asked me about adopting her...but now wont even speak to me, where she sayd that if her mom and I split up and they went back to Ohio that she would rather stay with me (her dad) it talks about how much better their life is since I came along, how her mom has always been depressed and angry, about how I clean, cook, etc for them and all of this..my lawyer says they don't mean much..I do know that Amy has been taking depression meds as long as I have known her, but she gets the from her M.D. She absolutely refuses to go to any counseling whatsoever, well alot of this is expalined in my original letter that I posted...
As far as subpeona's go I can't get my lawyer to subpeona anything. I want him to subpeona awhole lot of things and all he wants me to do is sign releases..I want everything that CPS (CYS in PA) has, but he just wanted me to sign a release so that they could speak with the caseworker...
As for the accusations against me, as I said I have no idea what is going on and my lawyer isn't telling me anything including what we are fighting for or what his strategy is or anything..My wife (in emails and chats of course) has given 5 different reasons for leaving the state and taking the baby. They are as follows:
1.) Because I supposedly threatened, on the phone the friday before she came home, to kill her and her best friend, if they were lieing to me about the Dave incendent and if they ever took the baby....1st off not true and it makes absolutely no sense, I had already moved out over the Dave incedent and I had the baby in my possession at the time.
2.) Because I supposedly threatened to kill her and her best friend the sunday night that she did come home and I was there to give her the extra keys, etc, BUT I supposedly did it before the police arrived...again not true, all I said was please don't start any trouble I just want to give you this stuff, get the baby's x-mas presents and go home ok? again I had the baby in my possession at that moment, and if I had threatened her when the police was there I would have been arrested.
3.) Because when she arrived home the baby was not there for her to see and visit with, she claims she would have never left if he had been there for her to see, and that I promised I was going to move out after she got home..yea she wanted it that way so she could throw me out and keep the baby..I think her and Cathee planned the whole thing the night they found out I moved..They had no plans of staying here when they came back. Cathee told me on the phone that friday that she was smarter than I was and she knew what she was talking about and that she was going to teach me a lesson for hurting Amy by moving out..
4.) Because victim's resources would help her and/or put a PFA (protection from abuse) order against me...probably because they didn't beleive her either, but boy the local police sure did
5.) Because althought she claimed she wanted me out and then said thats not what she wanted, I moved out of the house with the baby without my wife's consent..wow that one got me I am 41 yrs old and my wife is 31 yrs old, I didn't know I needed her consent..besides as I said to her I do NOT remember he asking for my consent when she took off for the holidays, instead of being home with the baby and I on his 1st x-mas and New Years, to sneak behind my back and sleep with Dave, but hey who am I right?
As far as I know there are no police reports stating any claims that I did any of the above..They just took my son gave him to her and escorted me out of the apt, telling me that if I came back in 24 hours it would be a different story and someone was going to jail (yea me)
As for getting my son home. I have called everyone from missing and exploited children to my states attorney general's office, no-one wants to get involved, even though thay all say that what the local police did was wrong and they had absolutely no right to do it, They should have told my wife that there was nothing they could do and that they had to let me take my son home, because he was in my possession...so since day one I have asked 1,000 times if they know it's wrong why can't they correct it? I have still gotten no answers, so my son is in Ohio for the last 28 days without his dad. I have been told that she doesn't have to prove that she was the primary caregiver or not, she automatically gets the nod, I have to prove that I was and It ahs to be with offical documents, not cards, letters, emails, chats etc....So if anyone has any comments, suggestions or whatever feel free to email me at my address
[email protected]and Thanks :-)
All of you really help :-)
Wow then you can definately understand what I am feeling..I missed my son's 1st b-day on the 13th of January and I was the only caregiver for not only him but his three half-sisters, but I can't prove that offically..
I have been through all the paperwork I have here, most of it I went through while moving. My lawyers says the letters are ok but not of much use. phone records no because I know my wife and her freind and all we will get is either hung up on or no answer, they have caller id..I have bank records of joint accounts I had to close the one we had because my wife was gone with the check book and I didnt want to get into trouble for any bad checks she wrote...In the last three or four months she wrote so many that the bank threatend to close the account and took away the atm cards.
Pattern? I got emails, letters, chats, and some offical docs that show patterns, of depression, anger etc, but again I have been told no good..yes I have neighbors, friends, family etc that witnessed it, but been told bias and the neighbors dont want to get involved with it as for her relatives no not a one they all live in Ohio and I am sure by now she has them convinced that I am out to kill her and steal the baby..In the last 3 months I took my son everywhere with me.I have a letter from my counselor, from the housing authority, and I think one of tow more people saying that they say me with my son and how much we interacted etc, again told no good or so-so
I filed for custody the night after the police forced me to leave my son with his mother, so that part is already started I just can't get anyone to do anything other than schedule or re-schedule mediation...9 out of 10 of the attorneys in my area want something like $75.00 for counsltation...might not be much to some, but alot to me at the moment..
Amy and Cathee dont care about contempt they no nothing is going to happen to them, Cathee does it to her ex all the time and Amy does it to her first husband when we moved her, she knows that Ohio isnt going to come over here and arrest her for contempt usually they send her some type of letter from his lawyer or something and I am sure it would be vica-versa from Pa..as for seeing him even if visitation is set up, Amy although she has been driving and has her own car plays the victim always..she was involved in a traffic accident in '94 and got sued for $20,000 she was supposed to be paying $60.00 a month but we got married she quit paying it expecting me to pay it, so when it didnt get paid the took her driving priviledges away, so now knowing her as well as I do, she will claim that she no way of bring him here to me, so I will have to go there and Cathee will refuse to let me on the property or charge me with trespassing or harrassment because she has made it very clear that no-one will tell her what to do in here house..
yes she doesn't work, she did for awhile when we first met but quit her job to teach me a lesson. long story refer to my 1st post. How can she take care of the child if she can't take care of herself? TWO WORDS....the same way she has been since her oldest daugter was born...WELFARE AND CHILD SUPPORT!!!! I hate to say it but thats what this is all about to her..Thats one reason I dont get along with her parents, they are judgmental, money hungry idiots, who dont know how to show love to anyone but themselves and I hate to say it but Amy and the girls are that way as well...Amy is planning on taking care of the baby with the child suport I will have to pay, that way she can sit on the computer all night and let whomever she wants watch the kids, she is famous for that...as far as employment stability goes that only counts against me, she can sit on the her ass and collect welfare and child support and be ok, in fact that way she supposedly can spend more time with the children because she doesnt have to work, its too bad she wont do it, but thats the theory and see I have to work so I cant spend as much time as she can, so that goes against me..I know exactally what kind of people she ahs around those kids and I they aren't good people, she lives with Cathee and hers kids and her boyfriend, but again doesnt matter where she lives or how, I was told that she could live in a shelter and still keep the kids,,it would be mionimum but atleast they had a roof over there heads and food to eat, but I have to have my own place, job etc
So you tell me LOL any suggestions, comments ,etc please feel free to email me at
[email protected] and as always thanks :-)
jaimes_dad
The enemy has assualted you. You have received some very serious wounds but now is not the time to cry. Now is the time to take up your weapon & attack. What weapon, you ask? Education.
You must educate yourself & then educate your lawyer. Most legal-aid lawyers do not have a clue about fathers rights. Your letters by themselves may not be admissable but they can be if the people who wrote them will come to court to testify that the letters contain the truth. You may have to have them supoenaed.
Consider this site your school library & the boards & chat your classrooms. Learn. Find out about parenting plans. Make one that fits your needs. Don't forget to project it into the future. 3 years from now will seem like yesterday when he starts pre-K. Contact your local school & get their school calendar & build it into your parenting plan.
Make sure your parenting plan contains a generous visitation schedule for his mother. It doesn't matter if she uses it or not. It is very important that you impress the court or the mediator with your knowledge of how important it is to keep both parents in the child's life.
Print out & bring the statistics that show the harm it does to a child to be raised without a father. If you haven't seen them, you will be amazed at how important you are in your son's life.
Yes, the courts are pro-mom. But with the right stuff, you can succeed. I know all about being screwed by the courts. We stood in shock as a blonde idiot judge ripped my son's 3 kids out of his fine stable home & put them back in the meth den their mother was running & living in. The police had given him the kids. That fool woman judge said that he had no right to take her children from her.
He now has full custody & she has shown her true colors & has lost all contact until she straightens her life out. So far she has chosen not to.
So, take strength & hope in knowing that you can get custody of your son. It just won't be easy.
You & your boy are in our prayers. Good luck & God bless.
You never get a second chance to make a first impression!
Never, ever go to pick up your son alone. Always take at least one person, preferably 2 people with you. Video tape it if possible.
When visitation is set up, make sure the exchange is made at a public place, preferably a police station. The station & parking lots are video monitored.
Carry a mini tape recorder in your pocket at all times & start taping all calls. Everytime you call, if you don't get an answer, send her a letter, certified, that says you called to arrange a visit with your son & will call again at a specific time & date. Also say that if that isn't convenient, please let you know when she would like you to call. Keep a copy of the letter for your file.
You never get a second chance to make a first impression!