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I'm confused AGAIN. Can anybody please tell me if conversations IN THE HOME (threats, etc) can be tape recorded --- whereas the other party does NOT know it's being recorded?

Thank You.

Eye

Yes, I'm sure it would be very nice for the Dad and you.... but I'd have to question the child's motivation. Does she get special treats at your place? Special attention? Is she mad at her BM? Does she like to pit BM against BD so she can get more attention....special privies?  

Our SD started saying these things when she was about 9 y.o.  BM wouldn't hear of it.  OUR SD is a lovely young teen....also very smart and an ace at manipulation.  It took a lot of sitting back, listening, watching body language, etc. to figure out what was what.

As far as changing schools...... it happens. Sure not often...but each circumstance is different.  My SD came here, 5 hours from her first home, between the 2nd and 3rd quarter of school.  All worked out fine.

This was/is a trial period and NOT official w/ the court system in MN. We hope and pray BM continues this into the next school year because the child is absolutely flourishing.  We need "custody" though......... BM has retained this thus far.  However we're content that the child is actually happy, losing a LOT of very negative habits and moving forward in life.  We sincerely hope BM sees it this way too and not just a contest of sorts.

Have you considered why your SD's BM is so against this? Does the child bring it up each time they argue?  Does SD repeat what she overhears in your house?  Remember to ALWAYS keep the talk positive, especially when it relates to BM and her family/friends there.  Nothing good can come out of badmouthing.  It hurts the child......and ticks BM off.

Remember to listen carefully to each word SD says when she makes these statements.  Sure, you'll WANT to jump in and get the scoop (it's only natural)....but now is a time to listen ONLY WHEN SHE BRINGS IT UP.  Personally, I find that - FOR US - not having a sit-down talk works the best.  She speaks to me more about feelings than her Dad... when she does I continue w/ whatever I'm doing... incorporate her assistance (eg: cooking, dishes, yard work, etc) and things flow naturally.  I learned this from a counselor that my son used to go to....many years ago.  He wouldn't sit in a small room and ask my son questions... instead they played pool or basketball.  I thought that was pretty good... and it worked beautifully.  Maybe this will work for you also! (hope so)  Keep in mind that SHE has to start the talking.

Also... has SD been evaluated by a counselor....a psychiatrist/psychologist or another mental health professional?  Often this is a good thing..... just to help the child.  The BM here, at first, didn't want any part of this...... I BELIEVE (could be wrong) that deep inside she may have thought we blamed her or was criticizing her for something.  Nope... finally she took the child in for help.  ~~~~  Right now, in our house...she has a TERRIFIC counselor that she can relate to.  We got lucky.

If you do decide to move forward... keep in mind that you can't represent the child.  A GAL or Expeditor may be of assistance.  When interviewed...also be very cautious about talking negative about BM.  Yikes.

I wish you the very best.  Keep us informed.

*** I am not an attorney. These statements are my personal opinion***

Thanks.... both DH and I looked at your writing and didn't know this. Good grief.... she just TOOK  your SS?

My brain tells me that, sure, it's preferable to get a court modification, but it also tells me that you had your ducks in a row.  She sunk the ducks.

So whatever happened?  Did SS get to come back to you? Did you go into court for a formal modification? Did the temporary custody you had, the paperwork and all stand up at all?

Truly..... this must have hurt SS very much.  It would really screw a kid up for this to happen.  What's wrong w/ these people anyway? Seriously, I know we all keep talking about "what's best for the child"...  but really......... how can that X feel THOSE actions were good for the child?  How can DH's X feel certain things......and then act for what is NOT in the best interest of the child???  I don't get it.

Now MY own son is 24. My 1st husband and I divorced when he was about 1 year old.  I can count the number of visitations he had over all those years on both hands and MAYBE a toe or two.  WHY? Mainly drugs and alcohol.  I was the *bitch* (excuse me pls) that wouldn't let our son go with his father...... his father was DRUNK.  I kid you not.  He'd show up on his motorcycle (arrr) totally smashed.  *sigh*

A few years later, he got with a really lovely woman. A mother herself.  She wouldn't tolerate the booze and drugs.  XH went into rehab and actually dried out.  :-)))))))  His temper was still there....and so was the good woman.  During that time is when our son spent time with them .... pretty freely too.  Actually, it was the woman (they didnt marry) who mainly watched our son.

Then XH started acting erratic again.  I KNEW what was going on... he was drinking again.  I'll never forget the phone call from the girlfriend, so frightened.  She said she was bringing *J* home as my XH threatened to spank him w/ a 2x4 board for getting smart w/ him. (XH has said something like, "I'm your father and you will listen to me"  Which our son answered, "If you're my Daddy, where have you been all my life?")  He was so erratic that the longtime girlfriend tried to get all the children out of the house and to a neighbors house.  When she called me on the phone I told her that he was drinking again.  She denied it...... until she started finding bottles hidden.

Anyway, I sure am off the subject.  Sorry.  I totally missed the point where I was going to tell how, when XH and g/f first got together they/he tried to get custody of our son.  There was no way he was gonna get custody..... because he was a DRUNK and drug user (heavy).  Unfortunately, I DID have to be dirty a little and threaten to expose him as he molested his own niece for years... and the niece would testify to this. ~~~~  So I do understand there are circumstances where I BELIEVE the child should NOT be with the NC parent..... and other times (like now, w/ my SD) when the NC parent is the best thing for the child.

Ramble, ramble, ramble....... on I go.  Too much coffee I guess.  LOL

Thanks again for answering.  I PRAY that this all works out.  A letter has been sent to DH's X proposing a meeting date for signing paperwork.  I don't believe she knows about things you spoke of...... and TOTALLY PRAY that she never does this.  THE CHILD NEEDS WHAT SHE CAN NOT OFFER RIGHT NOW and BM knows this.

Blessings!  Thank you!

Wow, thanks for the offer.  I will write today.  Look for something from a yahoo addy.... I'll identify myself in the subject line (ya just never know who's yacking at  you, lol).

The biomom does NOT want a "parenting plan."  Honestly I think it's lost on her.  *rolling eyes*  She wants it simple yet structured.

Ya know, I CAN understand her desires and needs as a mother.... but hell, she's gotta allow some wiggle room for the child to get comfortable and build a relationship with others including her new psych and counselor.  Biomom WANTS this, for now, only until the end of the school year or so.  I had SUGGESTED a RE-EVALUATION around the middle (or beginning) of August.  This should allow time for the girl to get her feet semi-planted, counseling to start (hopefully) to be effective and still allow time, if DEMANDED to return to that tiny town in central MN w/ the tiny minds of the ppl. there.  Arggg.

Thanks for listening...... I will write today.

Good Morning All!

I was a member here for some time during a VISITATION battle in 2003 I believe.  Things got worse...then better...then they evened off.

I have some wonderful news for everybody about the 14 yr. old female child in question (she is in central, MN, small town, kangaroo court) and her father!  In a nutshell, the child LIKELY is coming here for a "trial basis."
 
OMG... I can't believe it. :-)  She's become too much of a handful for
 biomom/step-dad....but is a "good girl" here for the most part.  Long story.

The transfer will LIKELY happen around the middle of March when the school quarters change.......BUT biomom/step dad (and us) want a written agreement.  We have the basics down HOWEVER I'd like to post on the board or have some fine tuning this.  We don't want any loopholes where biomom says, "The girl comes back NOW."  That's not good for the child......it's not good all around.  We KNOW we're missing critical stuff that biomom will use when she starts feeling guilty or whatever she feels.

There's an  unusual twist also.  I (stepmom) live in WI (literally across the river from MN) but DH works in Minneapolis and comes home on weekends.  There just is no pay here unless you consider $9.00/hr good pay for a full time person.  Uggg.  So although the biomom would (insists) retain legal custody of the child... she has relented to doing "the right thing" and letting Dad/hubby have physical custody for the TRIAL PERIOD.....BUT the child will live here in WI and attend school in WI(biomom is fine w/ this).  Oy.  Kinda sloppy.  There are a few more
issues that need addressing

Do you think friends here at SPARC can help w/ wording and issues for this "agreement"?  Biomom refuses attorneys and runs like a scared
puppy at the sound of the word.  Therefore this will have to be a
written agreement, signed and notarized between biomom, biodad, and
the steps (since the child will be living with me).

Oh.....what a mess.  BUT it is a great start I think.

We all MUST meet face to face, hammer this out, get in in writing, etc.  This must be done rather quickly as the child will have to transfer schools and the new school will NEED her records so she can continue schooling, uninterrupted.... and get the credits she needs to finish her 8th grade.

The child IS a handful for biomom and her step dad... however in OUR estimation the main reason is a clear as day. We won't get into that HERE or right now though........and will CONTINUE her counseling in WI.

So is anybody up for a little help writing this document? Warning: I had suggested a re-evaluation of the living arrangements just prior to the middle of August.  Biomom says that's unacceptable..... and at first said a re-eval would be at the end of the school year.  NO...the child would not have time to settle in, have a report' with a counselor, etc.  I had suggested August because of the upcoming school year.

In any case...... THERE IS LIGHT AT THE END OF THIS TUNNEL!!!!

Jurro....if you're still around... you may remember our case and the kangaroo court in central MN. Oy vey.

We very much look forward to hearing from anybody and everybody who would like to care, share and be a part of this celebration..... and the nuts and bolts that will pull it together!

Thanks KAT,

I thought that's the way I read it.......why can't it just say YES or NO?  LOL

Thanks so much.

Donna

I've looked at WISCONSIN law and don't quite understand it.

Can one party tape record the other party's without their knowing inside the married couple's home? i'm mainly referring to threats of violence.

Thanks.

Eye

Hi, thanks for offering this to us.  It looks like a very good jumping off point for us.  I will copy it into word....and adjust to our needs.  

Unfortunately....... BM will NOT go for something this easy and simple.  I guess I can't blame her.  She doesn't want anything super comprehensive either..... oy vey.  So somewhere in the middle would be great.

Wouldn't it be nice to just say, "Dear Judge, we're reversing custody of the minor child, XXXXXXX.  Everything is totally switched around. DH has full cusotdy and BM has visitation. BM now pays child support and has "liberal visitation." (we'd never do what was done to DH..... limit him to 1x/month...and a 15 minutes window to get there....when driving 5+ hours one way).

I'm really hoping there IS a family mediator that can help draw up the necessary paperwork.  BM is ready, DH is more than ready.... and the Expeditor is behind it (why wouldn't she be, it's off her Soc. Serv. caseload and I'm a thorn in their side, lol).

Thanks for giving us a starting point!!

Socroteaser?  Ok.... I give up.  Where is that?  Ya know, I seem to remember a section with 'victory' notes....... is this Socroteaser?

Thanks

Hmmm, thanks for the tips.  I will certainly check into this.  I know the county is large mileagewise, but small as far as assets (minds too).  I'm awaiting a call from the expeditor who would really like this case off her caseload.  All feel it's a load of poop anyway.  A couple of years ago we were fighting just for DH and I to see the child...... now she lives here and is totally happy and growing.  The Expeditor(s) were from BM's little town and really hated us.  We were referred to as: citidiots (city-idiots). Hmmff.  I don't think a town of 55k is too much of a city. Now, Chicago, where I was born & raised is a city.  LOL

Still, I must commend BM.  This must be hard for her.  She tried everything in the book.  Anything I've read on the forums she tried, and then some.  When FOV was introduced into court..... the judge said it was a felony....but not in HIS county.  Good grief.

We're treading lightly right now......but keeping all honest.  That's best for the child.  Teenagers are emotional enough.

I'll keep all posted.... and ask further questions I'm sure.

Thanks for the help!