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My Step Doughter in Cutting herself....Help!

Started by worried_step_mom, Jun 02, 2009, 09:29:24 AM

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worried_step_mom

hi, i am new to this site, hopefully i can find the answers i'm looking for.

My step daughter is cutting her self, she is 17 1/2, she told her dad on memorial day weekend when she came. She had been going to counseling for about a year now. The mom told dad that it was because she tried weed once.  Well when our daughter told her dad, she said that cutting was the reason why mom have her start counseling. (about a year ago) still to this day mom has not mentioned anything to dad.  We have taken these couple of weeks to talk to counselors before she comes over again.  Every one is telling us that we need to get her out NOW! That the fact that she went straight to dad was a HUGE cry for help.  How can we get her out?  Mom will flip, phys and counselor told us that she might be hiding something from dad and thats propably the reason that it has not been mention.  There is no exsiting custody order in court, custody was never established.  My husband pays child support and is not late.

please anyone help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(State:California)

ocean

Will daughter come willingly to you? At 17 1/2 you wont be in court soon enough before she is 18.
Can you talk to her current therapist? I would start there. Tell her what she said and that you are very concerned. Therapists are mandatory reporters and if she feels she is in danger she will call CPS.

worried_step_mom

our daughter told her dad that she want to stay with us.  We don't want to wait to long to get her out.  Once she is out we will do the paper work at court if need be.  Our main problem is dealing with mom, the guilt that she has put of daughter of even mention to her that she want to live with dad.

ocean

Have you talked to her therapist? You need to hear what is going on (the full story) if the therapist will even talk in detail with you. But you can say, just listen to what I have to say and use it with her in therapy. I would encourage her to talk to the therapist about recent events. When is her next appointment? Can you go?

At 17 1/2 she can choose to go to you herself pretty much. Legally, you could try and and get emergency temporary custody. You can do this at family court in one day. You present your evidence and see what the judge says. Can she get to your house on her own? Will she call you to come and get her?

She sounds like she needs help and you need to be ready to get it for her. Will mom be willing to get her in a treatment program for a few weeks? Why is she cutting? Friends at school, depressed, boyfriends?

worried_step_mom

The counselor the she is going to was appointed by mom, she wont talk to the dad.  I am assuming that daughter has talked to the counselor about it, we do know that the counselor meets with mom at no cost after daughters session.  It is all to fishy.  We took these last couple of weeks to get mentally and physically prepared for her.  We want to welcome her to our home with open arms.
As far as whyshe is doing it, we have not gotten anything yet, she is not dating anyone, mom started to bring in foster kids last summer, and daughter has to help mom with mom's 2 kids from her current marrige and the foster kids that i think theres 2 now.
Daughter is willing to say she will come over in a bus if she needs to, and we want to know if dad just tells mom this weekend that daughter is staying for good.  Will he dad be arrested. will there be any court problems?

ocean

Usually the police will ask your SD to go back home and if she says no, she wants to stay there they will file a report and tell mom to go to court. At 17 1/2 BM will not have too much of a say if it goes to court.

If your husband has joint legal custody now, he can call the therapist, fax over custody orders, and ask to speak to her. Not sure, but your daughter may even be allowed to give her the right to talk to you guys too.

I wonder if you called your local police department general number and ask "what if this would to happen, how do you respond to an almost 18 year old?" The local laws change depending on where you live.


Have her pack whatever she wants for this weekend because BM will probably not allow her back in for a while. Enough clothes for a while, her essentials. If she does stay, have an appoint ready with a therapist for early next week. You can always cancel.

Good luck...

worried_step_mom

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]Thank you so much[/HIGHLIGHT]....we have been really nervous about the whole situation.

If everything works out, we will be getting a counselor next week.  We want her to get help, if something comes up in the session we will deal with it then. Press charges if we need to. Our main objective is to remove her from the situation/enviroment that is causing her feel like cutting is the answer.

All the family on this side is standing behind our daughter and us 110%, and i hope that help her too.

We have a lot of work and hard times ahead of us, but thank you so much for giving me the tools to move foward and do what is best for our daughter.

Thanks to this site i was able to express my problems with out the fear of judgment, and i was able to get the answers we needed, that helps alot.
[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]May God Bless You[/HIGHLIGHT].

MomofTwo

Press charges against who...Mom??? For what? Cutting is a self inflicted wound. You are blaming Mom and you have no facts.

Cutting is a serious issue.  Why do you automatically assume it is Mom's fault? Maybe Mom didn't talk to Dad because their child (sorry, she is not yours) asked Mom not to.   I think it is great she talked to her Dad and is seeking help, but so did Mom.  She HAS been in counseling so Mom did not ignore whatever she was going through.  Additionally, it is very common for a counselor/therapist to talk to the parents following a session as they will try to devise a plan to help the child based on the session.  It is not suspicious in the least.   If there are  no custody orders then if paternity has been legally established, she can go to Dad. If there are orders, I don't agree with advocating custodial interference, no matter the age.   I do think she clearly needs help, I don't think the blame game will be beneficial at all.  She herself did not confide in Dad till now.  You don't know why she is cutting, yet you are determined to remove her from the situation. Maybe it has nothing at all to do with Mom. Maybe she has coping issues. Maybe she feels torn between her parents.  Maybe, the best place to start is with the counselor who has been treating her and go from there. Maybe Mom Dad and child need to attend family counseling and work through this.

I applaud you for wanting to help, but you need to let Mom, Dad and child work through this and not do that by attacking Mom when you have no basis to do that.  Dad needs to have a very open discussion with his daughter and the counselor.

Kitty C.

Momoftwo, if you read the previous posts from the OP, she says that the current therapist will not discuss the situation with the father.  And it also sounds like BM hasn't talked to Dad about it because she is purposely trying to keep it a secret.  The OP mentions that SD cannot even talk to her mom about wanting to stay with Dad, so there's heavy duty issues going on there, too.  For BM to keep this from Dad is a HUGE red flag and for SD to come to her dad and stepmom and tell them what is going on is like SD shouting for help.  For this child's safety, she needs to get out of BM's house...NOW.  I agree that custodial interference is not a good idea....BUT when the safety of the child is at stake, that flies right out the window.

This is the way I see it:  this has been going on for a year and BM is purpopsely keeping it from Dad, which tells me that the issues of why SD is cutting could very well be coming from BM's. You can about guarantee that if the BM thought issues from Dad's house were the cause, he would have found out RIGHT away. Obviously SD is going through so much at BM's that she sees cutting as her only outlet.  It's also possible that her stress was compounded by the knowledge that she could NOT tell her dad about it.  The only bone I can throw to BM is at least she is taking SD to a therapist, but even that is fishy if the therapist refuses to allow Dad to participate.  Given that SD is so close to 18, the best that Dad could do in the courts is file for emergency custody based upon SD's confession.  And if SD wants to be with Dad bad enough, it sounds like she will find a way to get there.  I also understand that it would depend on the jurisdiction, but even if BM reported Dad for interference and the cops showed up, it's a very good possibility that they will not remove SD.......for a couple reasons:  one, she has made the decision herself that she wants to be there and two, the cutting issue is severe enough that if they were called to the BM's home regarding it, it's very possible they would remove SD from that home anyway.

All I can say is thank God the child DID speak up, because she could have done that with just about anyone.  Obviously she isn't getting any help from the therapist, or this still wouldn't be an issue.  So whether she tells Dad, or a teacher, or counselor, or someone else she trusts is now a moot point.  It appears she trusts Dad enough to tell him and that is HUGE, given the dynamics between the homes.

As for pressing charges, it all depends on the jurisdiction.  Depending on how the system works in the area they're in, and if local law enforcement deem the BM having been negligent in obtaining proper care (counseling for a year with no obvious results doesn't constitute as proper care), the LEA may require that charges be filed.  No one can know that for sure unless that comes up.  I'm sure that is NOT something that Dad and stepmom want to do, but you always have to remember that it might be a possibility.  All one can do is pray that it doesn't get to that point.  But if Dad obtains another therapist, the history leading up to this point will come out and that therapist will be obligated by law to report if it is required by law in their jurisdiction.  Once that happens, the system takes over and if it is deemed criminal, it then is in the hands of the local LEA.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

MomofTwo

Kitty,
I don't disagree with any of what you wrote. However, all things considered, I think it is extremely important that without knowing the root cause for this self infliction to be occuring  it is dangerous to be doing the blame game.  Lack of co-parenting, blame games, feeling isolated, .... this could be exactly what has contributed to this.  Cutting is a symptom.

We don't know why the daughter waited a year to talk to Dad (one could speculate she was fearful of him or felt he was part of the issue), we don't know that the child's current counseling was ineffective - maybe that counseling has prevented her from doing more serious harm to herself.  We don't know why Mom didn't talk to Dad.  We don't know that the child was the one who didn't want him to know.  We don't know any of this.   Why didn't Dad talk to Mom when he found this out instead of going to different counselors who have never seen the child or treated her ? A counselor can only speculate based on what you tell them. It is not a diagnosis, it is not factual.   Any mental health professional who advises you the child is in danger or blames Mom without ever having peformed a full evaluation is crossing a professional and ethical line.

It is never acceptable to render a diagnosis and treatment without having evaluated the patient.  Dad needs to go to the counselor with the court orders in hand giving him legal access and demand to talk to the therapist. SM posted there are no court orders. Maybe that is why the therapist refused to talk to him.  Talking to other therapist is totally ineffectual since they have never seen or diagnosed the child.

My only suggestion was and is for this child's parents to start working together for the sake of their child.  I can't imagine what a scene with the police being involved would further do to this child.    Instead of talking to everyone else about it, maybe Dad should have talked to Mom.  The blame game without any knowledge about why this was occuring is dangerous.  Mom and Dad need to both stop what they are doing and work together.   

worried_step_mom

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffc000]MomofTwo[/HIGHLIGHT]: I am sorry you miss understood what the situation is.  The only "assuming" anything towards the mom is you. 
Yes, the counselors we spoke to did NOT speak to "OUR" daughter, we spoke to the counselor so we can have an idea this whole situation was about.  I dont know about you but personally i have never dealt with anyone cutting themselfs, this has never been a topic that both my huband and i have never come across.  I do belive that talking to a professional was the best thing we could do at the time. We are just tring to learn and understand "OUR' daughter situation.  Like i mention before:
[/quote]
If everything works out, we will be getting a counselor next week.  We want her to get help, if something comes up in the session we will deal with it then. Press charges if we need to. Our main objective is to remove her from the situation/enviroment that is causing her feel like cutting is the answer.
[/quote]
We are taking this very seriously. WE are pass the point to try to get answers from mom.  If she wants to talk she can do all the talking she want to the mediator or judge, she can give them the reason/excuse/accusation there.  We will not be confronting the mom, we will let that courts take care of it. Dad has been there her whole life and has been paying and does not owe any back child support. (in case you were already thinking the worst of him). She is the adult and parent, she schould have notified dad the moment she found out.  Just make it a point to blame him for everything else that 'OUR' daughter does, (e.i. daughters first kiss: mom blamed dad "she is missing a father figuer").  WE are positive that if it had anything to do with dad or my self, mom would have pointed that finger right away.
If once "OUR" daughter speakes to the counselor and anthing comes up like abuse in any way, shape, or form WE WILL PRESS CHARGES. Yes, that could include negligent. 

Either way the most important thing now is to protect OUR DAUGHTER. She comes first. The reason of the cutting, we can figuer that out later.

** by your personal attacks to me: i will assume that you are one of them people that assume that the MOM is always right, that she is the angle and that there is nothing she can do wrong.  Well let me you in on a little secret MOM's = human, make mistakes too, just check the cementaries, hospitals, jails, and child servises. They are full of kids/adults that MOM's and every adult in there life ignored or excused the initial red flag with 'oh, its just a fase, she/he will grow out of it'.

I am a mother too, my husband and i have a boy.  I sure as hell hope that if my son has problems later in life that some will lisen to him.  We all as mother pray and do our best, but sometimes life doesn't work that way.

ps: even if i did not give birth to her she is still MY daughter too.  When my husband and i married she became my daughter too, and I love her just like she was own if not more.  I accepted her completly, some family you are born into and then theres the family that is a special gift from God.

MomofTwo

I understand emotionally you feel she is your daughter, however, legally speaking she is not and you have no bearing LEGALLY.   Not only is she not legally your daughter, if you go into a court room spewing OUR daughter WE felt , YOU could hurt your husbands chances.

I understand you are frustrated at the situation, but posting here and then replying back confrontationally to someone because they view it from a different perspective is not beneficial.

Cutting is a self inficted injury. For you to press charges when Mom has sought counseling and treatment for a year, well, you would have to prove negligence on not only Mom, but the mental health professional she is obtaining treatment from.  You would have to get other mental health professionals to testify that the treatment that therapist is rendering was not in accordance with the American Psychiatric's scope of treatment and therefore put the daughter at risk. 

I NEVER attacked you. I NEVER blamed Dad and no, I am not a Mom is always right person.  I do know however that with this situation cutting is often the result of emotions that they feel they cannot deal with. The cutting is an emotional and physical release for the person doing it.  For you to automatically blame Mom demonstrates you have no knowledge about a cutter and their  thought process and yes, unfortunately, I do have experience related to this.  If often is not one issue they cannot deal with, it is multiple, and is usually emotionally based. 

I stand by the fact that the parents need to work together for this child.   

Kitty C.

So you don't think this child is in danger??  And how can the parents work together when one parent refuses to?
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

MomofTwo

and by Dad not discussing it with Mom when he did find out perpetuates the situation.  You can't blame one person for not talking when the other one is doing the exact same thing.  Making threats of custodial interference and police scenes and charges, how is that going to help a child who can't deal with emotions now.  This child NEEDS to see a calm collective response to this, she needs to see her parents working together for HER benefit. 

Dad did not confront Mom to get the story.   I absolutely recgonize Mom should have discussed this with him, this is serioius. You are all assuming Mom is hiding something. maybe she is, maybe she isn't. I dont know. Th child herself did not discuss this with him. I don't get how you are all blaming Mom when it took the child over a year to be able to talk to her Dad.   However, him talking to mental health professionals not involved with no understanding of why she is doing this, is not helpful to that child. It does give him an understanding of cutting, but you have to get to the root cause of THAT childs reasoning and thinking which a therapist cannot do by listening to the Dad and step Mom and not evaluating the child.

Mom needs to be talked to about what she knows and why Dad wasn't talked to.  Dad also needs to take his court orders giving him legal access to the therapist involved and talk to her to get the accurate information from the therapist about why she is doing this.  Until he knows why, you can't blame Mom.  Mom, Dad, and child need to go to counseling together.

I can't imagine what a court room scene, a police scene, would emotionally do to this child.  A collective calmer approach needs to be taken FIRST, or at least an attempt at it.  If Dad talks to Mom (sorry, step Mom again should not be involved in that discussion), and Mom refuses, he needs to let her know he will pursue it, the child wants to be with him, but cooler heads need to prevail in this situation as a first attempt for the CHILDS sake.




Kitty C.

Well then, I'm glad I won't be around if and when Dad does talk to Mom about it, because I seriously doubt there will be a 'calm, collective response' from the BM.  And as for going to another therapist, what is wrong with getting a second opinion, because this is exactly what Dad appears to be looking for.  ANY new therapist will not know what is going on until they are able to gather the information from all parties available.  IF all Dad can get out of a therapist is a better understanding of what is going on and how he should handle the situation, that's more than he had before.  And you can't get blood from a turnip....if someone doesn't want to give up information, whether it be the BM or the therapist currently seeing the child, they won't unless court-ordered and sometimes even then all the information might not come out. 

Obviously in this case, they are way beyond the 'first attempt' and Dad is now forced into a position of gathering information in any way he can and save his child by any means available to him.  And why would you 'assume' the child would be present in a court or police scene?  I would think you would give those professionals more credit than that because unless the judge insisted the child be present in court or the child was in imminent danger and the cops were called to the scene, that is the only way she would be exposed. 

But the thing everyone needs to understand is that when certain wheels are set in motion within the system, you relinquish all control over it and if the authorities deem it necessary within the law to act in a certain way, you have no say-so over it.  To give an example, we all know many states have DV laws that require an arrest to be made when cops are called to the scene.....whether the purported victim intended that to happen or not.  In this case, it doesn't look like it is the intention of Dad to push to have BM arrested for anything...at this time, but if it were to come out somewhere along the line that the courts and/or LE that the BM has committed an illegal act, obviously Dad will support an arrest.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

ocean

I agree with you to a point. This "child" is almost 18 and in a few months can walk out of moms house anyway (if not sooner depending on the laws). Yes, she needs help but if Dad goes to Mom now there is a good possibility that she will not allow daughter to go their this weekend. The daughter asked her dad for help and to be able to stay there for a while. When she gets to their house, THEN dad can call mom and tell her what is happening and that child wants to stay and take it from there while he can control the situation. Maybe the cutting was under control for a while and she recently just went back... I understand you are very mad with BM right now for not telling you, but you do need to find out her version of the story. Do you have her e-mail? Maybe after she is with you, you can email her and say things came out this weekend........That way emotions are not yelling at each other. Ask if she knows the reasons for her cutting and that daughter would prefer to stay with you. It will take weeks of therapy, especially with someone new for her to trust and relax and really open up about what emotionally is going on. Teenagers have a lot going through their heads and some of this might be from friends and school.

I dont think they will be able to charge her with anything since she is in counseling and really the therapist is on the line now. The therapist is legally responsible to call if she felt daughter was in danger.

I would still HIGHLY suggest calling the old counselor and telling her you are the legal father and there is a situation that you need help with this weekend. If that doesnt work, send her a certified letter with the same information. If daughter goes before she comes, tell her to tell therapist that it is okay to talk to dad (not sure if she has to be 18 or not). 

Be prepared for daughter to come to you but then not want to follow rules. She is coming with a lot of emotional baggage. Be ready to have support her but to have clear house rules.

Kitty C.

'If daughter goes before she comes, tell her to tell therapist that it is okay to talk to dad (not sure if she has to be 18 or not).'

Per HIPPA, she does have to be 18.  Once she turns 18, she MUST give written permission for anyone else to have access to records or contact any provider regarding her case.  This applies to all educational, medical, and legal issues.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

worried_step_mom

Thank all you so much for all the advise.

There are a couple of things that i want to address:
First I DO know my part in this whole situation. I have never once said anything about me being LEGALLY involved. I been honest about how I feel and I will not apoligize for loving "OUR" daughter.  I will do anything for my family and that completely includes my STEP-DAUGHTER (just to make u happy).  I am not in anyway tring to push my self to court and speak for dad, but I am his wife. I will gather all the information  (hence why i am in this site) he needs to go in to court ready. I will also support my husband  every step on the way, just like i will support and help our daughter with anything she needs.  I KNOW i am not her mom by birth but once she is in my home my role as STEP_MOM will beco a big part.
We will be sending daughter to a counselor and once the mom starts the drama in court, dad will request all info he can from the counselor she is speaking with now.

Bottom line with the mom is that...talking to her (even being civil) is little nail on a board, or getting a root canal.
They way dad and I see this is that mom had about a year to talk about the situation.  Dad is not consern in anyway about mom nor her feelings, all he is seeing is his daughter, "daughter is hurting, she asked for help" Like i said before all the excuses on why it was not told to dad and why daughter is cutting is relevent and can be discussed at court,
where it will only be mom and dad.
We have thought about every senerio and we have plan a , b , c on most of them.
Our first and only consern is our daughter.  She will not be seeing the whole drama. We will not be exchanging a single word with mom.    Dad will talk to daughter, ask her if this is what SHE want, if she is ready for change its going to take.  If/When daughter says yes. Dad will call mom and tell her, daughter is staying here, she asked to stay and she will stay here now.  Daughter will be in a different part of the hm with family watching a movie, if cops come they will be welcomed in the hm only. dad talks to them they talk to daughter and make a deceision.
We dont want her to see anything, dad will tell her that he will deal with the fall out. NOT her.

As far as mom, she can deal with the courts.

Yes, we do not know the reason on why she is cutting, it could be mom, the home, friends, attention, dad...ect....
But either way she is asking for help. and she is CUTTING and it is serious that needs to be addressed and treated.  Daughter is asking dad for help, his only option is to help.

Kitty C.

There is no reason to fear or believe that the cops will come to your door, even if the BM reports it to them.  Most often, all they can tell the complaintant is that it is a civil matter and to take it up with their atty.  If they do show it, it probably would be in the vein of a welfare check, just to see that she is there and she is okay. 

BT, DT and we actually handled it all by phone....but then it's a small community and I personally knew and worked occasionally with the deputy involved.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

worried_step_mom

Thank you Kitty.

I know its going to be hard on the mom, i dont mean to sound coldhearted towards her.  I have spent the last weeks tring to put myself in her shoes and i just cant get to anything that would stop me from telling the dad if it was me.

I finally decided to advise dad to let the court handle it.  He was ready to go confront / scream / pull daughter from home. He was just upset and hurt. I stopped him from doing all that in order not to have his daughter see and be in a tug a war with them.  I feel its safer and calmer this way.

I do pray that you are correct and the cops are not called. The less messier the better.  Either way is going to tough on all daughter, dad, and mom and all the family.

Kitty C.

It WILL get worse before it gets better, for everyone.  Until all is said and done and even after your SD becomes an adult, this will be an issue.  What matters is how one handles it, which has a direct effect on the stress level of all involved.

I would venture to say that IF law enforcement is ever involved regarding an arrest, it's because somewhere along the line (possibly the court or DHS/CPS) determine that whatever happened was a direct result of criminal negligence on the part of the mother.  And if that is the case, the arresting officer would be duly informed of the circumstances surrounding the situation, and if children are involved, they will make every effort to minimize the stress.  Unfortunately, that all depends on the individual being arrested.  If any of you have watched Cops on TV, you've seen how individuals charged with a crime react.  If they have children present (and if they were 'smart'), they would comply willingly to lessen the effect on any children present........but from what I've witnessed, that's not always the case.  Bottom line: it can go as easy or as hard as they want it to be, but it's up to all parties involved to make that happen.

I'm glad you were able to talk Dad down from reacting and doing or saying something that could very possibly make matters worse.  It is such an emotionally charged situation and it is VERY difficult to leave feelings out of this, but you have to be thinking clearly and not do anything in the heat of the moment without thinking it through and considering the consequences.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

MomofTwo

Funny, I think I read this exact same advice somewhere else ...oh yea, that was exactly what I said. Except I was criticized for it.  Interesting dynamic this board has.




worried_step_mom

That may have been what you where tring to say...but it sure is not how it came out.

It's ok, I am glad that both sides came out on this topic.  I help me realize that there really is not excuse to hide/cover up a problem this serious to the parent.

All i can think is the what if's:
what if we (huband and i) left to pick up chineess and rent a movie, and daughter is hanging out at home waiting for us, in that time she gets an upsetting call and does the cutting the right way, or cuts to deep and we come home to her bleeding out. On our watch cause NO one mentiond what was going on. I am sure mom would have blamed us then. She would of found her voice really quick.

Kitty C.

If you worry about the 'what if's', it will drive you to the looney bin!  You just have take care of what you can, and hope for the best..........
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

worried_step_mom

your right. I just need to take one issuse at a time.

we will see what happends this weekend :)

thanks again for everything

ocean