Father has child 51% of time???

[ellehcim87]

Here is the situation...My boyfriend has a 5yr old daughter and he is divorced.  He works 2, 24 hour shifts a week and ex wife works typical Mon-Fri work week.  Up until this past September he had the child every day during the week unless he was working.  She never had any daycare or play groups of any kind.  He also agreed to one Saturday night a month.  He returns the child to the mother an hour after she has already been home from work and has been responsible for 3 meals a day and also doesnt pay support since he has had child more than mother.  Problem...she started pre-school Mon, Wed and Fridays from 8-3 and he has now asked to not have to be her taxi cab driver/babysitter on Mondays and Fridays.  He would still babysit her on Tues, Thurs and pick her up Wed afternoons.  Mother somehow feels she is getting screwed and inconvenienced by this and wants father to pick up every day of the week no matter what the situation.  She has come back with a 12 page rebuttal to the simple asking of 2 days of per week.  My question is would a judge actually force him to pick her up everyday?  He wants to get on with his life, work more, start a life with me and basically force the mother to take responsibility of this child.  Most father see their children every other weekend.  How this mother sees her situation as getting screwed is beyond me.  We are planning on getting married next year and Im afraid this woman will be a constant thorn in our side if this is how she wants to play.  We have gladly said we would take full custody but that would make it impossible for her to control his life.  Any advice is much appreciated.
PS  Yes I am a single mom as well in case anyone was wondering.

[msme]

Is there a court ordered parenting or is this just something that evolved out of their divorce? If there is an ordered PP is that what he is following? With this info, we can give better responses. Thanks.

You never get a second chance to make a first impression!

[ellehcim87]

>Is there a court ordered parenting or is this just something
>that evolved out of their divorce? If there is an ordered PP
>is that what he is following? With this info, we can give
>better responses. Thanks.
>
>You never get a second chance to make a first impression!


The original divorce stated that the father MAY have the daughter on the days he doesnt work.  He sent a letter to his lawyer asking to not pick her up from school on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays and the lawyer sent it to her lawyer.  Now we are awaiting a 12 page letter from her lawyer with new requests on the mothers part.  He has also been paying the mother 1/2 the preschool cost even though it doesnt say he has to in the divorce.  My assumption so far is that the divorce doesnt say he HAS to watch the kid at all.  I never even knew there was any kind of law that would force a father to see his child at all, just pay support.  Thanks

[msme]

your boy friend is a very lucky man. There are so many fathers on this site who would give their right arm to even see their kids. How long has he had this arrangement? Can he prove how much time he has her? If not, he needs to start documenting. He should document everything, anyway.

After he has some documentation, he can file for a modification of custody. There are several excellant parenting plans on this site. He can download & modify one to meet his needs. He should go to the local school district & get their school calendar. That way he can use it to plan future changes & avoid going back to court every time there is a change in her life, as there will be as she grows & has more things going on.

When he has it in order, he can have his lawyer file it with the court. She will get the opportunity to amend it & the lawyers will negotiate an agreement with both of them. The judge will have the final say.

After that they will both have to follow it to the letter unless they learn to cooperate & work together for the child. then they can help each other out with necessary changes for special events.

Maybe I am just being nosey but you mentioned that you were a single parent. Is your childs father involved in his life? I hope you realize what a vital role fathers play in a child's development. The following is for your info & to share with your boy friend & let him know just how important he is to his child & to cherish every moment he can have both with her & doing for her.

Divorce and Fatherhood Statistics


61% of all child abuse is committed by biological mothers
25% of all child abuse is committed by natural fathers
Statistical Source: Current DHHS report on nationwide Child Abuse


79.6% of custodial mothers receive a support award
29.9% of custodial fathers receive a support award

46.9% of non-custodial mothers totally default on support
26.9% of non-custodial fathers totally default on support

20.0% of non-custodial mothers pay support at some level
61.0% of non-custodial fathers pay support at some level

66.2% of single custodial mothers work less than full-time
10.2% of single custodial fathers work less than full-time

7.0% of single custodial mothers work more than 44 hours weekly
24.5% of single custodial fathers work more than 44 hours weekly

46.2% of single custodial mothers receive public assistance
20.8% of single custodial fathers receive public assistance
Statistical Source: Technical Analysis Paper No. 42 - U.S. Dept. of Health & Human Services - Office of Income Security Policy


90.2% of fathers with joint custody pay all the support due
79.1% of fathers with visitation privileges pay all the support due
44.5% of fathers with no visitation pay all the support due
37.9% of fathers are denied any visitation
66.0% of all support not paid by non-custodial fathers is due to inability to pay
Statistical Source: 1988 Census "Child Support and Alimony: 1989 Series P-60, No. 173 p. 6-7. and U.S. General Accounting Office Report" GAO/HRD-92-39FS January, 1992


50% of mothers see no value in the father's continued contact with his children.
--See "Surviving the Breakup" by Joan Berlin Kelly


40% of mothers reported that they had interfered with the father's visitation to punish their ex-spouse.
--See "Frequency of Visitation...." by Sanford Braver, American Journal of Orthopsychiatry

63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes
--U.S. D.H.H.S., Bureau of the Census
85% of all children that exhibit behavioral disorders come from fatherless homes
--Center for Disease Control
80% of rapists motivated with displaced anger come from fatherless homes
--Criminal Justice and Behavior, Vol. 14, p. 403-26
71% of all high school dropouts come from fatherless homes
--National Principals Association Report on the State of High Schools
70% of juveniles in state operated institutions come from fatherless homes
--U.S. Dept. of Justice, Special Report Sept., 1988
85% of all youths sitting in prisons grew up in a fatherless home
--Fulton County Georgia jail populations & Texas Dept. of Corrections, 1992

Translated, this means that children from a fatherless home are:


5 times more likely to commit suicide

32 times more likely to run away

20 times more likely to have behavioral disorders

14 times more likely to commit rape

9 times more likely to drop out of school

10 times more likely to abuse chemical substances

9 times more likely to end up in a state operated institution

20 times more likely to end up in prison


There are: 11,268,000 total U.S. custodial mothers and 2,907,000 total U.S. custodial fathers
--Current Population Reports, U.S. Bureau of the Census, Series P-20, No. 458, 1991

Love your children & let their other parent love them just as much. There will be no losers & the children will be the big winners.

You never get a second chance to make a first impression!

[ellehcim87]

>your boy friend is a very lucky man. There are so many
>fathers on this site who would give their right arm to even
>see their kids. How long has he had this arrangement?
>
>Maybe I am just being nosey but you mentioned that you were a
>single parent. Is your childs father involved in his life? I
>hope you realize what a vital role fathers play in a child's
>development. The following is for your info & to share with
>your boy friend & let him know just how important he is to his
>child & to cherish every moment he can have both with her &
>doing for her.

Hi, Perhaps I wasnt clear about his arrangement and what he desires.  What the ex wants him to do right now is make her life as convenient as possible.  This means picking her up from school on those 3 days a week and not allowing him to work more or have any other life activity.  The ex has 2 other non-working family members who love taking her that can pick her up.  He would then have the child 2 full days a week, which is more than most fathers get.  He has for the past 4 years taken her for 13 hours a day, every day of the week.  We dont consider picking her up for 2 hours on those days quality time with his daughter.  The mother simply doesnt want him to be able to have any time at all since she doesnt.  Most single mothers have their kids in daycare if they dont have family and have to drop off and pick up.  She has had the luxury of an ex husband who is at her beckon call.  He cannot work a 2nd job to pay his mortgage, work on his house or go back to school since he is a glorified babysitter.  He picks her up from school and for 2 hours she is completely wiped out and miserable.  Why would any judge force him to pick her up?  Its time he moved on and the mother take more responsiblity.  She is taking advantage of his schedule at work and simply doesnt want him to move on in his life since she hasnt.  Does that help?
ps yes my ex is very involved in my childrens lives but I would never expect him to go to the extremes my boyfriend does.  It just doesnt work that way in a divorce.  

[msme]

is a power struggle. He still needs to do a firm parenting plan. If not, his life will be filled with this crap. A parenting plan should never contain any wording that is not firm. The word MAY indicates that someone has to be given permission. Agreed upon, means both have to agree, giving power to the disgruntled one.

The courts may respect a well done parenting plan that keeps both parents well involved. Becareful to make sure that he does not come across as not wanting as much time with his daughter.

Maybe even ask that those hours be transfered to another day so that she can go home on her mother's days so she can rest before dinner, as she seems very tired after an active day of daycare.
Sometimes asking for things you don't really want will get you the things you want.

Good luck & God bless

You never get a second chance to make a first impression!

[ellehcim87]

Not so much a power struggle as its his ex-wifes way of manipulating and controlling his life.  I still dont understand though...can a judge actually force him to pick her up since he doesnt technically work 5 days a week?  And why cant he say he wants less time with her?  For 5 years now he has had her 5 days a week and 13 hours a day.  He has no life at all and does nothing with this kid socially.  The mom refuses to be "inconvenienced" at all since she feels dads only mission in life is to cart kid around forever.  What he wants is quality time with her.  Not to be a taxi cab driver.  What about when we get married?  Can a judge force him to pick her up everyday since the mother works?  This is just not typical of a divorced parenting situation.  He could technically ask for every other weekend and call it a day.  which in my opinion would be better since psycho mom cant let him have a life.  I dont see it as a benefit in anyway to pick her up 3 times a week for 2 hours.  Plus, the only reason mom asked for 1 saturday night a month from him was so she could go out.  He should have said no and taken her overnight during the week since she was there anyway but mom needed "alone time" and time to move on herself.  Which hasnt happened.  

[dontunderstand]

I'm sorry, but I really feel no sympathy.  My husband and I would love to be in a position to have SD 5 days a week 13 hours a day.  I highly doubt my Dh would feel like "a glorified baby sitter or a taxi cab driver" taking and picking up SD from school.  We would love to be such an influence in her life and allow her to feel that love and security the very same that I am guessing your soon-to-be SD doesn't feel at home if my spends that little amout of time with her.  I am guessing that you are the one that is feeling "inconvienced" by your boyfriend doing all of this for his X which he really isn't.  He is doing for his DD.  And everyone needs "alone time" 1 saturday night a month is more than reasonable.  Oh and by the way, a judge can make you do whatever he sees fit (within the limits of the law).

[ellehcim87]

>I'm sorry, but I really feel no sympathy.  My husband and I
>would love to be in a position to have SD 5 days a week 13
>hours a day.  I highly doubt my Dh would feel like "a
>glorified baby sitter or a taxi cab driver" taking and picking
>up SD from school.  We would love to be such an influence in
>her life and allow her to feel that love and security the very
>same that I am guessing your soon-to-be SD doesn't feel at
>home if my spends that little amout of time with her.  I am
>guessing that you are the one that is feeling "inconvienced"
>by your boyfriend doing all of this for his X which he really
>isn't.  He is doing for his DD.  And everyone needs "alone
>time" 1 saturday night a month is more than reasonable.  Oh
>and by the way, a judge can make you do whatever he sees fit
>(within the limits of the law).

I think youre misunderstanding everything here.  First of all...I dont even live near him.  Im an hour away and I have no issues whatsoever with his schedule with me.  He has put his entire career and life on hold to stay home with the child for 5 years now.  She has now started pre-school and he feels its time for him to start working more, continue on in school and allow his ex to take responsiblity for her own child.  Yes I agree that all moms need "alone time" thats what they make babysitters for.  It is not his job as Daddy to watch kid while mommy goes out drinking.  He was lucky enough to be a firefighter and works 24 hour shifts.  He bought a house this year and now can no longer afford to stay home 5 days during the week to watch her for 2 hours on those 3 days.  All he asked for was to have Mondays and Fridays free in order to be able to work more and further his education.  He is the only firefighter in his department that doesnt work a 2nd job.  He was only able to stay home that way because he had a very low rent.  He would gladly take full custody of her and I actually encourage it because it would be much easier and more stable for the child.  This picking up and dropping off everyday to the mom is terrible.  And by the way, her grandmother lives directly across the street from her preschool and would love to watch her those 2 days.  Its a power struggle on the moms part and her way of controlling his every move.   Everything Ive ever read says that its more stable for a child to be with one parent during the week of school.  The only reason the mother wants this and she has said word for word "its an inconvenience for me" to not have him pick her up.  And I still dont understand how a judge can force visitation?  Makes no sense to me.  You have to understand that this poor child is socially inept because she has been around noone but her father for 5 years.  There have been no outside social activity whatsoever.  They go to the mall or a park where other kids arent around.  Its quite sad.

[Lovingdad]

I'm sorry, but if I understand the situation correctly, your boyfriend deserves no sympathy from this site.
I am going to be in a four day custody trial October 11-14 to get shared custody, and more 'real parenting time' with my Son, including the right to keep him overnight and drop him off directly at his pre-school, rather than his Mother's house.  Father's should not be excluded from children's activeties, such as school.  Children need two parents.  Your boyfriend should be happy he picks up his child from school.

[ellehcim87]

I sympathize with you but for some reason you all just arent getting the problem here.  He cant stay home 5 days a week anymore for financial reasons or he will lose his house.  He gave up 5 years to be a stay at home Dad and now that she is older it would benefit her more for him to keep his house and not spend 2 hours a day twice a week with him just so her mother isnt inconvenienced in any way.  She can work a full week, now why cant he?  He will have her 13 hours a day on Tuesday and Thursdays and pick her up from school Wednesdays plus overnight whenever he wants.  What is wrong with 2 days a week to be able to work a 2nd job?  He isnt asking to put her in daycare as both he and the mother have parents who will gladly pick her up.  Besides, Im only here to find out if he actually was legally obligated to be her full-time sitter while mommy gets to work her job.  He has asked for full custody and I told you all that.  She wont give it because that would mean she has no control over him.  Thanks for all the info, really...I love being bashed on here for no reason.  Most dads get their kids every other weekend and he has gone above and beyond what other dads would or could do.  Find me any man who would stay home 5 days a week like that?

[jilly]

I think we can all relate to the financial problems, but when you come on here and talk about him being a glorified babysitter and a taxi driver that just doesn't sit right.

He's her Father...period.  That's what parents do.  They take care of their children and they drive them places.  It's not babysitting and it's not being a taxi driver. If he was still married to the ex he'd have to be doing these same things more than likely.

[SadStepMom]

My DH stayed home fulltime for 3.5 years with our son.  When he had to go back to work because I lost my job and then had to take a much lower paying job, he worked nights so we could keep daycare to the miniumum.

He also has two sons that he would give anything to be able to see them for 2 hours every day.

I really think you are in the wrong place.  

[wysiwyg]

If the father was so concerned why is he not here asking these questions?  I apologize but your posts come across as you are the one asking for more time.  I know of many a father that has lost atleast one home due to financial sturggles to see their child, we are a family that has lost over 350,000 to assets and another 88K to lawyers to see the child.  

I can not imagine that this father would gladly walk away from his daughter just to work more, given the oppurtunity and or choice most parents would choose to see their child.  A parents job is to structure and teach their children.  If the father is in danger of losing his home, perhaps other options need to be explored, refiance the house, get rid of some other bills, etc.  When I was a child, my father raised me and short of day care or relying on my grandmother to watch me, I went to all day kindergarten, my dad got me after school.  

Please do not pressure dad to choose between you and his daughter, or the house and his daughter, houses can be replaced a fathers love can not.  

Good luck and think things through in a positive and loving fahion to find a good solution, not a negative one.  You could be also be a good influance for this child if her mother is as you say, she needs love and attention from those that are going to be truly concerned about her.

[breezy]

I think perhaps you are writing in a context that makes it seem like he should not **have** to care for his daughter.
My SO has stayed home, switched shifts and switched jobs to spend more time with his kids. He has been a primary care giver and is now a primary bread winner while he provides for me so that I can care for the kids. I love them and would never even dream of not supporting him in any and every way I can. He has driven 100% of the time for up to 8 hours to have a weekend with his kids. We now drive over 120 miles a day to take the kids to and from school (30 miles each way 2x a day) There is nothing he/we would not do for those kids... even for 2 hours a day.
Our focus in life is a stable, happy home for them. We are typically combating the negative energy expended by BM. Stressed... BTDT. Pissed... BTDT.
Boy have we both felt used and abused by the situations that have been tossed our way by BM, however those are **OUR** feelings or resentment to deal with. Our kids never know of these feelings, nor do they ever feel like we didn't want to spent time with them... even 2 hours a day.
Reality doesn't always provide that we can be there at ever whim of BM's insane life. We are realistic and frank with the kids. If we can't we tell them that, so that they are not left feeling abandond.

I think I understand you frustration and feeling like he is a babysitter. What I think you are failing to see is that your BF has what most of the Bio-fathers on this and many other sites wish they had!!!

He certainly is not obligated to have the kids 51% of the time, he can request less time through legal channels. I just am not sure why he or any father would give this up. Most fathers are never granted this honor. Most fathers gobs of $ in courts fighting for this right and never even get half of it.

We have spent over 20,000 in legal fees. We have spent 3 years in court. We are lucky that we currently have a 50/50 plan. Unfortunately it will never be increased (doesn't stop us from fighting) The best intrest of the children is not served with this agreement. In no way do we wish to deprive BM of a relationship with her children. We do however wish that the time she spent with them was productive and benificial to the children... something that we fail to feel.

Our goal is something more like 52 us/48 her. This is to ensure the kids are with us during the week so that they suceed in school and get to participate in school activities. We are willing to give up a great deal of our weekends for what we feel is in the best interest of the children. We all (kids and ourselves) live for our weekends!! Our family time!!
Unfortunately BM has not seen fit to participate in the kids life to the extent that they need to suceed. We feel it is in their best interest to spend the school time in our care.

To answer your question though; IF there is no formal written parenting plan you BF is not required or obligated to care for his daughter for 2 hours a day after school.

What I think would be more sucessful for your situation though is to A) have a formal written parenting plan B) if there is one and it is not working, revisit and reformat it so that it DOES work for you and BM C) if the current parenting plan/court order has daughter in BF's care on the 2 days in dispute (I believe they are M and F) get day care for the additional 2 hours and have BM pick up from daycare. BM should also be required to pay half of the additional daycare cost. ----this way BF can get a 2nd job, have a life, ect....

hope that helps :)

[flewwellin]

I understand the financial sittuation and if you had left it at that it probably would have been perceived a bit differently but like most of the other ppl here have said I don't  have sympathy for your boyfriend.  

My husband is that man you think doesn't exist outside your boyfriend would be a stay at home dad 5 days a week.  If he had the option he'd do it 24/7  365 days a year.  No sympathy here for ya.  

Financially he needs a second job are you thinking part time?  He could go to school or have a second job possibly both while his daughter is at pre school.  If his hours were 13 hrs a day and he'd only be watching her 2 than that is like 11 hrs for those few days she is in school.  Sounds like a fine toss up to me.  I'd gladly switch custody/ visitaion plans with you if possible.  My DH only gets to see his kids maximum 40 days non consecutive out of 365 the kids live over 500 miles away.  My advice is butt out and let your boyfriend, his ex wife and the judge figure out what will happen.

[ellehcim87]

While I appreciate your advice and understand how sad your situation is...I cannot butt out since we are planning on living together next year and he wants me to stand by him on this.  What I think everyone is failing to understand here is that for the past 5 years of his daughters life he has been the primary caregiver for her.  4-5 days a  week 13 hours a day.ht a house in order to provide a safe, loving home for his daughter and his ex told him her preschool was from 8-5 m, w, f and that he wouldnt have her on those days.  Therefore he planned on furthering his education and working more.  The mother has told him point blank that if he doesnt watch her everyday no matter for how long when he isnt working that it inconveniences her.  That if she cant have free time than why shoudl he.  She has a mother who lives next to the school and a sister who doesnt work.  This would be like a father forcing a single mother not to work in order to keep the child at home with her.  It isnt healthy for a child to be in a house with only 1 adult everyday of the week first of all.  The ex simply expects him to never be with other kids for her and never take her to his parents for visits and to not be able to let his parents watch her if he has Dr.s appts, overtime or anything.  She has now asked for a court hearing claiming several outright lies about him because she is so pissed off that he has more of a life than her.  She has actually said these things to people so I know they are true.  If he had a normal 9-5 job this wouldnt even be an issue.  The mother sees her life as a single mom boring and unfair because she cant go out and drink at night.  So this isnt that he doesnt want to be with his daughter, in fact he gets sick to his stomach when he doesnt see her which has to do with a severe anxiety issue he has.  But rather that he wants his ex to take a more active role in being responsible for her.  She wont do this now because he has always done it.  She is a huge control freak and is determined to make his life hell.  He has asked for sole custody since the ex sees her daughter as an inconvenience but that would be too embarrassing for her and she would rather keep her the 2 hours a night and 1 day on the weekend in order to keep tabs on him as well.  She left him 4 years ago thinking she could do better and that he would just watch their daughter all the time so she could work the same job, never have to miss work because the daughter was sick, go out every weekend and basically have no responsibilities.  He could have been getting child support all this time but all he wanted was to take care of his daughter.  We are in for a long court battle now that she has made these accusations.  He is also sueing her for slander and sole custody.  All he asked for this last time was now to just have Mondays free.  Obviously her lawyer knows how much she is worth and is just in it for the money.  Luckily his Uncle is his lawyer and he pays nothing.  So, thanks for all the advice and Im sorry not many of you really understood my situation.  

[breezy]

I think many **UNDERSTAND** your situation. Most of us have BM's in our life that are hateful, useless and manipulative. Most of the BM's I know or have heard aboutare bitter and spiteful toward their EX's... especially when there is another woman in the pic. (I am generalizing here ladies so please forgive me)
What I think you fail to see is that most of us SM and some of the BM's writting you in response to YOUR post are trying to convey to you that it is suppose to be about the CHILD not the now defunct couple that may or may not have been married.
If your BF is so wonderful than why would he want to have his daughter spend time with a BM that sees her as a inconvienence. You are protraying his daughter as an inconvienence to him too. I don't think she is... and I understand wanting time. Put the child in day care and split the cost with the BM. End of subject. Then the child still is supervised by a loving environment, get most of the time with the most nurturing parent and gets the BM what she wants and off your back.

[ellehcim87]

>>What I think you fail to see is that most of us SM and some of
>the BM's writting you in response to YOUR post are trying to
>convey to you that it is suppose to be about the CHILD not the
>now defunct couple that may or may not have been married.
>If your BF is so wonderful than why would he want to have his
>daughter spend time with a BM that sees her as a
>inconvienence. You are protraying his daughter as an
>inconvienence to him too. I don't think she is... and I
>understand wanting time. Put the child in day care and split
>the cost with the BM. End of subject. Then the child still is
>supervised by a loving environment, get most of the time with
>the most nurturing parent and gets the BM what she wants and
>off your back.


This is pretty much what Im trying to say and what he wants.  The ex tells him the daughter is an inconvenience so he will feel guilty and take care of her.  I think that once he allows the mother some more responsibility she will do just fine.  She controlled every move he made up until a short time ago and now he wants her to take equal part instead of him doing everything.  
Yes he and I both believe its about the child at all times.  However, like i said many times, the mom is jealous we have a relationship, house, happy life and she is a miserable brat.  So she will try whatever she can to break us up and take any time he has away from his life in general.  What kind of a mother asks the court to force the father to stay in the house everyday and never socialize their child?  
And yes at her age 2.5 hours of daycare will not harm her.  Or both parents have retired grandparents willing to watch her.  Not sure why that makes him a bad parent.  I always thought it was the norm for fathers to be with their kids every other weekend?  I also dont know any married father who sees their kids as much as he did.  So it really upsets me that everyone on here seems to think he isnt at some point allowed to move ahead in his life and put her in an after school program.

[ellehcim87]

>>
>I can not imagine that this father would gladly walk away from
>his daughter just to work more, given the oppurtunity and or
>choice most parents would choose to see their child.  A
>parents job is to structure and teach their children.  If the
>father is in danger of losing his home, perhaps other options
>need to be explored, refiance the house, get rid of some other
>bills, etc.  When I was a child, my father raised me and short
>of day care or relying on my grandmother to watch me, I went
>to all day kindergarten, my dad got me after school.  

He is not asking to walk away from his daughter and i cannot imagine you would expect him to lose his home just to have to pick up his daughter from pre-school for 2.5 hours when there are other family members happy to help out.  This is called life!  Parents must work in order to survive and children do fine in daycare.  This isnt all day care either.  We are talking about a couple hours twice a week so that he can work.  Shoudl he ask the mother to change her hours in order to spend more time with her daughter?  Just because his job is 2 days a week doesnt mean he must be the only one to provide care and transportation.  The mother offers no help whatsoever with these things.  As I explained before...most firefighters work a 2nd job.  this is something he has put on hold for 5 years and now she is at an age where she should be around kids her own age more and not stuck in a house with an adult.  She is socially very very behind and is extremely immature.  She has no idea how to interact with kids.  I stayed at home with my children for 4 years but had them very socially involved all the time.  My ex took care of my kids 3 nights a week so I could work and when he refused to do that any more I had to take a full-time job during the day and find daycare.  That was MY obligation as their mother to make sure I found proper care for them.  I missed work when they were sick.  I have no parents to watch them as she does.  This is insane that you all think he is asking too much here.  If she truly cared about her daughter and wasnt just out to control his life than she would just give him sole custody.  Its a game to her and she is very messed up in the head.
>
>Please do not pressure dad to choose between you and his
>daughter, or the house and his daughter, houses can be
>replaced a fathers love can not.  
>
>Good luck and think things through in a positive and loving
>fahion to find a good solution, not a negative one.  You could
>be also be a good influance for this child if her mother is as
>you say, she needs love and attention from those that are
>going to be truly concerned about her.
>
>

[breezy]

> What kind of a
>mother asks the court to force the father to stay in the house
>everyday and never socialize their child?  
>And yes at her age 2.5 hours of daycare will not harm her.  Or
>both parents have retired grandparents willing to watch her.
>Not sure why that makes him a bad parent. And yes at her age 2.5 hours of daycare will not harm her. Or both parents have retired grandparents willing to watch her. Not sure why that makes him a bad parent. I always thought it was the norm for fathers to be with their kids every other weekend? I also dont know any married father who sees their kids as much as he did. So it really upsets me that everyone on here seems to think he isnt at some point allowed to move ahead in his life and put her in an after school program. I always thought it
>was the norm for fathers to be with their kids every other
>weekend?  I also dont know any married father who sees their
>kids as much as he did.  So it really upsets me that everyone
>on here seems to think he isnt at some point allowed to move
>ahead in his life and put her in an after school program.

1st off no court will allow the mother to force him to stay home. If they order him responsible on specific days he can put the child in day care and be financially responsible.
Our kids go to school more than 20 min away from us. We have and EOWeek. We paid for day care every week so that if traffic inhibits us from being there on time or we had other obligations we had day care **IF NEEDED** We rarely use it, and do not consider it a waste of $.
It doesn't make him a bad parent to desire the mother to be involved. It *in my opinion* does make him a bad parent to try to force mother to be responsible. In doing so it makes this more about her then about the child. Do what you need to to make life work for you. Leave it to the mother to decide to be involved or not.
We can't seem to get more than a 50/50 arrangement. The children suffer. Their homework is not done on weeks w/her. They are sick and do not get taken to dr. They sit all weekend babysat by the TV or the pool with no parent or adult supervision. Most days they pack their own lunch for school and open their own cans to nuke for dinner. These are K-5 kids... not teens.These are frustrating, however the court has awarded her this time to parent the children and there is nothing WE can do at this point except document.
The norm once upon a time was EOweekend. This was found through studies and fighting the system to not be in the best interest of the children. I think this is why so many are upset by your post. It seems you feel this is the way it sould be.
Most of us fight for more than the EOweekend plan. Some win (like us) and some don't and are furthur frustrated by our legal system. We continue to be frustrated as the childrens best interest is not met by being cared for by an uninterested BM. I would never wish for my SK to spend more time with that unstable and detached person. In my heart of hearts home is w/us and we continue to do everything to make it stable and healthy.
I still don't understand why he is bucking the system and trying to MAKE mother accountable.... it will never happen until he moves on with his life.
Get the 2nd job, put DD in daycare. Then mom will have to figure out if she wants DD in daycare or with her. The ownes is then on her, not You.
Take away her power and get on with your lives.
P.S. most Firefighters do have 2nd jobs and make awesome $ at both.
(I am wondering if he has made all his payments for the last 5 years as primary caregiver for DD why now he *might* loose his house.... what has changed, and who's decision was it to make that financial decision?)

[ellehcim87]

>>>1st off no court will allow the mother to force him to stay
>home. If they order him responsible on specific days he can
>put the child in day care and be financially responsible.

WOW, I never actually thought about it that way!  That is brilliant.  If he has her on those days than indeed it is up to HIM if she attends after school care isnt it:)  
I guess I feel that it is more stable to be with one or the other parent during school week.  I dont think its good to go from house to house every single day.   most fathers that i know are too busy and cant handle full time childcare like mine can.  I think its extremely bad for this child to have mom and dad see eachother on a daily basis and see no communication whatsoever on either part.  They dont share info on her at all.  
I dont understand what reason (other than money) your husbands and my boyfriends ex have for just not giving soul custody to them.  Is it pride?  I mean, obviously they dont care about their needs if they dont take care of them.  



>Our kids go to school more than 20 min away from us. We have
>and EOWeek. We paid for day care every week so that if traffic
>inhibits us from being there on time or we had other
>obligations we had day care **IF NEEDED** We rarely use it,
>and do not consider it a waste of $.
>It doesn't make him a bad parent to desire the mother to be
>involved. It *in my opinion* does make him a bad parent to try
>to force mother to be responsible. In doing so it makes this
>more about her then about the child. Do what you need to to
>make life work for you. Leave it to the mother to decide to be
>involved or not.
>We can't seem to get more than a 50/50 arrangement. The
>children suffer. Their homework is not done on weeks w/her.
>They are sick and do not get taken to dr. They sit all weekend
>babysat by the TV or the pool with no parent or adult
>supervision. Most days they pack their own lunch for school
>and open their own cans to nuke for dinner. These are K-5
>kids... not teens.These are frustrating, however the court has
>awarded her this time to parent the children and there is
>nothing WE can do at this point except document.
>The norm once upon a time was EOweekend. This was found
>through studies and fighting the system to not be in the best
>interest of the children. I think this is why so many are
>upset by your post. It seems you feel this is the way it sould
>be.
>Most of us fight for more than the EOweekend plan. Some win
>(like us) and some don't and are furthur frustrated by our
>legal system. We continue to be frustrated as the childrens
>best interest is not met by being cared for by an uninterested
>BM. I would never wish for my SK to spend more time with that
>unstable and detached person. In my heart of hearts home is
>w/us and we continue to do everything to make it stable and
>healthy.
>I still don't understand why he is bucking the system and
>trying to MAKE mother accountable.... it will never happen
>until he moves on with his life.
>Get the 2nd job, put DD in daycare. Then mom will have to
>figure out if she wants DD in daycare or with her. The ownes
>is then on her, not You.
>Take away her power and get on with your lives.
>P.S. most Firefighters do have 2nd jobs and make awesome $ at
>both.
>(I am wondering if he has made all his payments for the last 5
>years as primary caregiver for DD why now he *might* loose his
>house.... what has changed, and who's decision was it to make
>that financial decision?)
>
>

[MYSONSDAD]

I have been following this post. The court would see a parent's care over a after school/daycare environment.

Your BF is one very lucky dude. Most here would give their right arm to just have 50/50.

He should be documenting all the time he has with his daughter. Even if you feel, it does not matter, just take a calendar and write down the time she is with him. If this should ever come up before a Judge, it will give you some ground  to stand on.

Not many here will favor the "soul custody" issue you posted. We prefer a true 50/50. Kids need and want both fit parents. Except when drugs, neglect or abuse are in place.

"Children learn what they live"

[ellehcim87]

I am a child of divorce and I cannot imagine having to go back and forth between my parents for 50/50 time.  To me, that sounds like its more for the parents benefit to be able to see them, not to the childs benefit.  Unless both parents live in a small town which most do not.  That means going back and forth between homes, not having your friends from the town in which you go to school, different rules.  All that sounds extremely unstable as opposed to living in 1 house for the week and seeing Dad eow and once during the off week.  What about sports and after school things?  What about step parents and siblings?  I personally would have hated that arrangement even though I loved my father.  I just dont see how second families work around that type of arrangement as well.  Noone on here has really said what the kids would want?  Does everyone have small children who dont really know what they would want?  My son is 12 and he hates going to his Dads.  He has no friends around there and it doesnt matter how many fun things his Dad does with him he would rather be here in his neighborhood with his friends.  Im only giving my experience on this growing up and what I know of my friends and relatives and how they work their parenting time.  Ive read studies and even both my boyfriends therapists speak of how important it is for a child to have one home during school week and not to be tossed around.  
Kim

[breezy]

Kim, WOW. All the new studies and data show that children suceed better in establishing relationships and growing to responsible adults with a more or less 50/50 custody arrangement.
Our children are all under 12. BM had prime custody until the youngest was about 5. They failed to thrive.
By this I mean, potty training, school studies, handeling stress. Emotional turbulance was a way of life for them.
Having a stable and predictable relationship with both parents has helped to settle things down for them.
A 50/50 agreement (where do-able) allows the children to establish friendships at both homes.
We support their friendships from school by driving to pick up friend and drop them off. We plan play dates and take them to play dates.
We live apx 30 miles apart. We do all that we can to keep life *normal* and on an even keel.
I understand that your experience colors how you see this. However I do not think it is healthy for a child to one see a parent 4 days a month. How are they to have a relationship?
We work our tails off to keep the children as a priority in our lives. They know this. If you were to have asked them 4 years ago they would have told you they desired more time w/Daddy. Today they would tell you they love the EOW schedule.
We are the primary care givers in our situation. We make the homework rules and they know the consequences. We make and take them to the Dr.s We volunteer at the school. We are active in before and after school activities. We make sure to have an established relationship with the school and teachers.
My opinion of BM is not that she is an active participant in the childrens lives. This in my opinion and my experiance.
I don't think that and EOWeekend scheduele allows for the children to establish friendships with other children in the neighborhood nor the NCP. Is this fair? Is it fair to think that any child would enjoy this arrangement?

[ellehcim87]

Can someone explain the difference between sole custody and joint physical custody?  In the papers that the ex has filed complaining that my boyfriend is being a bad father by wanting 2.5 hours free on one day a week, she turned around and asked for sole custody with visitation and child support.  This after the original paper her lawyer sent saying he must pick her up everyday.  The whole thing my bf's lawyer said is a scare tactic since she would never win any of this and its very contradicting since its not only based all on lies but first she wants him to have her than turns around and asks for sole custody.  Its very confusing.  

[breezy]

sole custody: one parent has legal physical custody and is entitled to make all desisions re:child/ren

joint physical and legal: shared responsibility between parents that is recognized by the law

if you are going to court you might as well fight for what you feel is in the best interest of the child. you stated that you did not think this every other day arrangement was. if you ask for it, you would more than likely get an every other week arangement.

sole custody is typically enacted if one parent is beyond unfit. sole custody is rare. the only other instance is if one parent gives up their rights. this is typically agreed outside of court, as courts prefer a joint arrangement.

go back as far as you can and track your bf care of child. download and use the tracker on this site. give it to the lawyer and use it in court.

[speciallady]

"sole custody is typically enacted if one parent is beyond unfit. sole custody is rare. the only other instance is if one parent gives up their rights. this is typically agreed outside of court, as courts prefer a joint arrangement. "

Thats not necessarily true.
Family court is a fickle animal with many gray areas so one can't assume anything in regards to what is ordered.

My husbands ex has sole legal/physical and it has nothing to do with him being "unfit". I suppose it made sense to a mediator to recommend this due to the children living 3 states away.

Each case is different is my point :)

[MYSONSDAD]

What does your BF want?

If this BM is willing to work something out with him, have him make a list of what HE wants, work out a Parenting Plan they can both be happy with. Ask for more and leave room to negotiate. Keep the child at the forefront.

It might be a good idea to have him come to this site and ask questions directly.

Do everything possible to get Joint/Legal/Physical.

As far as lies, it is common place. Most of us face them everyday.

"Children learn what they live"