Interesting reading from FredOnEverything - Ritalin

[lucky]

AND as one of those parents dealing with the issues that we have dealt with and are STILL dealing with these issues, ANY AND ALL possibilities need to be examined.  And I think that is 4H's point.

[em]Lucky

Lead your life so you wouldn't be ashamed to sell the family parrot to the town gossip.
- Will Rogers[em]

[olanna]

And as one of those parents dealing with the issues that we have dealt with and are STILL dealing with these issues, I would hope that short of an MD or at the very least firsth and clinical research studies, would refrain from posting such things as a genuine example.  

It's troublesome and worries me that so many parents have gone through medical procedure after prodedure, test after test, and finally realize that the very thing they have been fighting, is the very thing that is going to work for their child.  So many of us because of the taboo on these drugs, delay actually trying our kids on these things, and set them back in their education and development because of beliefs like this. I know...as I was one of them.

It irritates me that so many people truly believe that parents have a little trouble with their child and set off to the Dr. Office, demanding drugs for ADD/ADHD. From what I have seen, quite the opposite is true! So many of us fight and fight it, only to discover that we bought into the lie that we are lazy or bad parents because WE had a child that couldn't learn in a normal school environment.

I would love to see this turned around.  I know I tried everything for years. I tried diet modification, exercise...had him tested for EVERYTHING you can imagine...and low and behold, two weeks on this medicine, my little boy went from a struggling C student to suddenly enjoying school, and making friends.  My son had the best report card he has ever had since he started school this school. He made 4 "A"'s and 2 "B"'s...he NEVER had a report card like before.  His self esteem went through the roof.

I also find that MOST parents went down the same road I did, and the success rate for these kids is off the charts.  If I had to do over again, I could only wish that hype like I was a lazy parent, or that I hadn't explored every medical possibility would have been written off sooner, so my son could start down the road to good grade, happiness and wonderful self esteem.

[4honor]

I am using those as examples.

Other similar conditions that create the SAME set of symptoms in children are Tourette's syndrome, depression, heavy metal poisonings, pica, caffeinism, diabetes, hyperthyroidism, brain injury (both permanent and/or temporary), concussion, chronic dehydration, malnutrition (the American diet is atrocious), vision problems, and in some very rare cases poor parenting, to name a few. Shall I go on?

What I am saying is that sometimes parents, in an effort to help (and fix) their children, put them on these medications without much forethought. Some CP's use them to give their child an edge or to make them more compliant ( I have seen both, with the latter being the case with SS). Some parents try everything else, never suspecting the problem is not psychological or behavior based, but instead part of another disease process. By the time some parents give in and allow the medication they are just relieved that the medication works and their child is able to have some sort of "normal" life. (About where you are, huh?)

Children can react negatively to any number of interior or exterior stimuli. Things in an otherwise "normal" range can be toxic for an individual child. The parents know the child better than anyone, They may have the answers, but do not know what to ask or tell the child's doctors. In the case of divorce, the problems get worse as there are increased communication problems.

We did some experimenting with SS's diet during one medication break one summer. We severely limited SS's carb count. At over 22 grams of carbs he was out of control. Below that he was on task, had no memory problems and was a joy to be around. DO I think that Sugar was his problem? No, not necessarily. He could have subclincal diabetes (as it is on both sides of his family) but with the lower carbohydrate count, he was getting other things (higher fiber vegetables - and therefore higher trace elements), he drank more plain water, and it may have been addressing a deficiency in his body.  It could have been addressing ONE PART of what was causing SOME of the symptoms and he was able to handle the rest on his own. Since then we have discovered, part of his inattention was a previously undiagnosed visual tracking problem.

As for where did I study medicine,  AMEDDC&S, and OHSU. Why, where did you?

DO I have my MD, NOPE! (No dough = no complete education.) Do I study independently what I am interested in? YES MA'AM! And I do not stop at just the PRO-drug or Anti-drug sites. A CHADD website is not going to give me unbiased information, and neither is a site that is down on ALL medication.

Any child with a decrease in the flow of water, oxygen or nutrients to the brain can display the classic ADD/ADHD symptoms. Kids with not enough sleep can have inattention problems or be squirmy in an effort to stay awake and alert in class. Kids can compensate well for a long time then go own hill rapidly.

Do me a favor, take something and wrap it around your neck just tight enough to cut down on say, 25% of the blood flow (not a poor joke, just an experiment). After several  minutes you should notice a lack of concentration, a feeling of restlessness, irritability, etc. A constricted blood vessel in a child may create the same symptoms and no amount of Concerta is going to fix what could become life threatening over time even though the symptoms are alleviated.

Now that your child is at a current stable level, use this time to further investigate the cause of the symptoms. You may find he suffered a minor brain injury at birth and nothing except these medications will work. You may find nothing for years. You may never find the culprit.

I advocate that parents treat the underlying condition(s), not just the symptoms, and that's all I was saying. (And Lucky should know, we had this discussion about 3 or 4 years ago and I haven't chaged my stance.)

[olanna]

Your post just seemed way out there to me...

Sorry no MD here either, just an MS in Analytical Chemistry.  I have been a Mom for about 27 years, and have been through pretty much every kind of thing you can imagine when it comes to my children.

I only wish that people wouldn't promote the thought that many parent's with children that are out of control or have difficulty in school are lazy and rushing to their Dr's to get meds...cuz it just ain't so!

[4honor]

I'm female.

And just because you are a responsible parent does  not mean that every parent is... According to a study done about 12 years ago (I'll try to find it and post the specifics) the incidence of children being diagnosed ADHD/ADD for the first time within 4 years of their parents' high conflict divorce is 20 times the national average for all other classifications combined. Interesting fact, considering most ADHD children are male and most CPs are female.

Some parents are just not well informed. The book I sufggested helps a parent to speak intelligently with their child's physicians to avoid possible misdiagnoses.

[jilly]

that my 7 yo SD was recently diagnosed with ADHD and has just started taking Staterra (sp?).  It's too soon to tell if it's having a negative or positive affect on her.

I find the study you referenced very interesting.  My DH and his ex had a very bitter divorce.  They pretty much tolerate each other now but it still gets heated at times.  SD was not quite 2 when they separated. Who knows how much she "remebers" from this time. I do know that she has told us things her Mommy has said about DH, such as how he has a bad temper and when he gets mad he throws things.  This statement was made after SD heard her Mom arguing with DH about CS. When I was preggers with our DD, SD asked DH if he loved me more than he did her.  The reason for this question?  Mommy dearest told SD that DH loved me more than he did her (SD) and that he would love the new baby more than he loved her (SD).  It's a truly sick person that would tell their child such a thing.

Anyway...I say all this to say that SD has always had trouble making and/or retaining friends, she has limited social skills, gets frustrated easily, highly emotional (she either gets very mad or she cries at the drop of a hat), don't even THINK about teasing her...she thinks you're being mean to her on purpose, she has NO sense of humor and, like her Mother, everything is someone elses fault.

DH's ex re-married in July of 2001.  In September of last year ex and SF separated and are divorcing.  SD had behavioral problems in 1st grade and again this past school year.  Come to find out SD has had these same problems since kindergarten.  It wasn't until she hit elementary school that we were kept in the loop on schoolwork, etc.

I really believe that with the nasty divorce between DH and his ex and the current situation between ex and SF that SD is in for a very hard life. I personally don't think the medication is going to solve the root problems.  SD is seeing a psychologist for abandonment issues/depression regarding the current situation with SF, but I think even that is putting a bandaid on an arterial wound.  DH has met with the psychologist once.  I really feel that this treatment needs to be expanded to include ALL of us because that's the only way we can help SD cope with both losses.

All children are different.  I think the bottom line to knowing whether medicaiton is the right choice is knowing our child(ren) and then standing up for their rights if we feel like the root cause is not being addressed.

[olanna]

but it is a Father's rights board and your name is not revealing of your sex!  Please excuse my mistake....;)

If you are going to post facts, please don't post a study that is 12 years old.

It's not accurate for today.  I went in with a group of people from three counties, totally about 120 kids.  At least 100 of the children had been through a minimum of 2 years of testing, both medical and educational....before they ended up on meds...just like my son.

I think there is a new, more educated parent out there, and I don't think doctor's are nearly as willing to write scripts without looking deeper.

BTW, I am both a CP and an NCP.  Being NCP is what led me to this site about 6 years ago.  My son's ADD didn't start as a result of the split. It was always there and noted by his pediatrician when he was only 6 weeks old. She pointed out some things that would eventually become very pronounced.  And we were together until he was 4.

[smtotwo]

He wasn't diagnosed until 1st grade, but I knew there were problems LONG before that.  

The first clue was during my pregnancy. Most parents are soo excited when baby moves!!  NOT ME.  I was overjoyed when he stopped, even if only for a few minutes.

He has been on different meds at different times, but Adderol is working the best, he is now 21.

I am also an adult with ADD.  When I was in school, I was lazy, forgetful,
never worked up to my potential,....and on and on and on.

When I look at my son, I see myself all over again.  And feel so sorry for him.  But for now its working, and he has NEVER had vioent outbursts from any of the meds he's been on, but then he was never on Ritalin, because after a 4 week blind ritalin/placebo test no one could tell which was the ritalin and which was the placebo.

Now my grandson who is 13 months old is showing signs of ADHD as well.  Hard to believe?  He sleeps for 3-5 hrs a night and takes between 1 and 3 20 minute naps a day.  I know that most of you think that all babys are very active, but his one NEVER stops.  My heart breaks for him and my son everyday because so many people are uneducated about ADD.

Sorry this turned into a "story of my life"  but I can also totally relate.

[olanna]

and I put the meds off for my own son due to the taboos on the drugs and waited until he was in the 4th grade to let him try it.  I hate it that I waited so long.

Thanks for sharing that.