Psych says that stepson is intimidated by men

[mshall]

What to make of this.

DH's oldest son is in therapy for what his high school counselor suggested is depression. He's had 2 sessions with his psychologist and it has been determined that (A) he does appear depressed, and (B) he is intimidated by men...including his father, and psychologist saying he was born being intimidated by men. Psychologist is also a man.

Therapy started only after mom rec'd her copy of filed paperwork (see below). Psychologist is telling DH he is 'wrong for taking legal action and mom has done nothing illegal' (that's what he said). Have also found out that psychologist is a patient of the dentist that mom works for.

DH was not included in initial parent session w/mom and psychologist, even though he requested. Only informed of son's solo appts. Had the above very skewed conversation w/psychologist this week after son's appt.

Short background: Stepson (14) and his younger brother (13) live in Florida w/mother. DH and I live in Georgia. DH gets report cards in late February for both boys. Oldest has a 'D' and 'F' - has always been 'A' and 'B' student. DH begins communication w/mother about grades. 3 weeks later, and after repeated requests, no communication from mother about grades. Only communication generated from mother are requests for money. All communication is via letters, email and voice mail since she won't talk to DH on phone (been this way for years now). DH contacts school directly and finds out that oldest has been truant (38 days of school missed b/t January 12th and March 4th). Mother was sent letter after 10 and 20 days. She also rec'd phone calls (proof that attendance clerk spoke directly w/her on 2 occasions). Mother never contacted DH about situation. DH spoke with counselor who said she had mentioned to mother back in November 2008 and again more recently that son seemed to be depressed. Mother said she would 'think about counseling'. DH finally confronted mother on phone about truancy and the counselor's concerns. Mother told DH that the issues were resolved now that son was back in school, and she 'might consider therapy for son.' At this point, son stopped ALL communication w/DH; then 2 weeks before Spring break son emailed DH saying that he was not coming and that he hated DH. Up to this point DH and son would talk/text each other 2-3 times/week. Mother says it's an issue that DH and son have to resolve b/t them; she's not getting involved.

Younger brother did come for Spring break and told us (he initiated this discussion) that brother had become a different person in past months - had lost his sense of humor, angry all the time, yells at mom and stepdad, best friend is a 'loser.'

DH's attorney has filed motion to have GAL assigned to ensure son seek therapy and continue therapy. Other filings include the non-communication issue. Waiting now for day in front of judge.
 

[hallegere1]

You should do some research on the Net on Parental Alienation and Parental Alienation Syndrome. There is a differentiation between these two terms. One involves bad behaviour (Parental Alienation) and the other involves mental pathology and directly involves the child, i.e. the child is an active and seemingly willing participant. Take careful note of the term seemingly.

Cheers

Hal

P.S. I would seriously question the validity of someone "born" intimidated by men!!!  Sounds like a radical feminist creation.

[Waylon]

One involves bad behaviour (Parental Alienation) and the other involves mental pathology and directly involves the child, i.e. the child is an active and seemingly willing participant.

One often morphs into the other; that is, the "bad behavior" can escalate and become central part of the parent's core behavior. Sometimes it tends to dominate the things they say and do with respect to the child. Don't tell me it isn't real; I've seen it more times than I can count.

Parental Alienation is real; whether or not there's a point at which it becomes a "syndrome" or not is largely irrelevant.

Some therapists and psychologist miss the whole dynamic and end up labeling a child as being "afraid of men" (or women, but rarely).

[mshall]

You should do some research on the Net on Parental Alienation and Parental Alienation Syndrome. There is a differentiation between these two terms. One involves bad behaviour (Parental Alienation) and the other involves mental pathology and directly involves the child, i.e. the child is an active and seemingly willing participant. Take careful note of the term seemingly.

Cheers

Hal

P.S. I would seriously question the validity of someone "born" intimidated by men!!!  Sounds like a radical feminist creation.

At someone's suggestion, DH and I have both read the book, "Divorce Poison." It addresses both, parental alienation and parental alienation sydrome. Not sure what to think of our situation. A little of both we think. Problem with being a state apart and limited parenting time (8 weeks/year) is not having the ebb and flow of daily interactions.

How effective could this male psychologist possibly be for a child who is supposedly intimidated by men? Plus a mother who has exposed said child to physical violence, but is completely innocent in this intimidation (this also according to the psychologist - said exposure of son to mom being beat has nothing to do with it). Really cannot wait for the judge to get ahold of this one.

[Kitty C.]

There is something else I think you should explore.  You mentioned that the 13 y.o freely mentioned to you that the 14 y.o. 'had lost his sense of humor, angry all the time, yells at mom and stepdad, best friend is a 'loser.'   It is entirely possibly that the 14 y.o. might be involved with drugs, as these symptoms are almost identical.  Personally, I would be doing drug testing on him, just to make sure.

As for the whole 'born with intimidation of men', I would get another psychologist fast.  If and when you get to court, request a psych eval. and allow the court to choose the professional.  That way, if you and Bm were ordered to agree on one, it's practically guaranteed that she will turn down every referral you make.  Also make sure that there is a deadline, or the BM will drag this out as long as she possibly can.  And it sounds like this kid needs help NOW.

Suggestion:  ask for a pediatric psychologist.  Very different from an adult one and would understand children's issues better.

[mshall]

There is something else I think you should explore.  You mentioned that the 13 y.o freely mentioned to you that the 14 y.o. 'had lost his sense of humor, angry all the time, yells at mom and stepdad, best friend is a 'loser.'   It is entirely possibly that the 14 y.o. might be involved with drugs, as these symptoms are almost identical.  Personally, I would be doing drug testing on him, just to make sure.

As for the whole 'born with intimidation of men', I would get another psychologist fast.  If and when you get to court, request a psych eval. and allow the court to choose the professional.  That way, if you and Bm were ordered to agree on one, it's practically guaranteed that she will turn down every referral you make.  Also make sure that there is a deadline, or the BM will drag this out as long as she possibly can.  And it sounds like this kid needs help NOW.

Suggestion:  ask for a pediatric psychologist.  Very different from an adult one and would understand children's issues better.

The drug testing is something we will request of the judge, as well as an overall physical and psych evaluation. Mom will do NOTHING that DH requests of her, so must be forced to do so by the courts.

Thanks for the suggestion of a pediatric psychologist. The psych that mom chose counsels "...from 2.5 years to 89..." as he proudly proclaims on his website. 

What needs to happen to get the courts to see this case sooner? Paperwork was file with the courts on March 27th. The attorney says that the courts will send her paperwork to complete, at which point she will file an objection.  Doing so will get her and DH in front of the judge directly so they can present evidence and concerns and plead for urgency. I guess unless DH has solid proof of drug use or something more concrete, it won't get pushed through any quicker.

[Kitty C.]

Do you have any contact with the school?  If so, ask them about any changes in behavior.  What you need to prove to the court that something might be going on is a 3rd party objective view.  Someone who doesn't have a personal stake in the matter.  If the school has any information, you should investigate the possibility of having a teacher or counselor, someone who has personally worked with the boy, to testify on his behalf.

I hope you can get the court to act quickly on this, as it sounds like this child is crying out for help.  I just hope you can get help for him soon enough..........if he is into drugs, he's living on borrowed time.

[ocean]

Going to be VERY difficult to make the counselor switch... Best bet is to ask the counselor for a phone session (have him bill it..) and let him in on what has been going on. Remember that he is basing his diagnosis with what BM is telling him. I would have a script in front of me..so you remember key points, what the court visitation schedule it...etc.

Then after that meeting, I would type up a summary with a copy of the custody orders and send it to the therapist to be put in his file...(maybe with some happy pictures of the two of you..lol)

See how the phone meeting goes, and suggest ways of keeping contact or ask him how you can keep contact. That you would be willing to be available by phone for any session do discuss issues so this can be addressed and dealt with.

[mshall]

Going to be VERY difficult to make the counselor switch... Best bet is to ask the counselor for a phone session (have him bill it..) and let him in on what has been going on. Remember that he is basing his diagnosis with what BM is telling him. I would have a script in front of me..so you remember key points, what the court visitation schedule it...etc.

Then after that meeting, I would type up a summary with a copy of the custody orders and send it to the therapist to be put in his file...(maybe with some happy pictures of the two of you..lol)

See how the phone meeting goes, and suggest ways of keeping contact or ask him how you can keep contact. That you would be willing to be available by phone for any session do discuss issues so this can be addressed and dealt with.

DH has had a phone session with psychologist already, but seemed to be very one sided. I had the benefit of hearing conversation only because DH could not figure out how to turn off speaker on his new cell.  This man's main concern was that DH was taking legal actions against the mother, and not the basis of issues with son.  Each and every time DH would begin to ask a question or make a comment, the psych would cut him off. Not productive at all.

DH is scheduled to be at son's next appointment in May, as well as a follow up solo session with psych immediately afterwards. Hopefully that session will be more insightful and productive.

[Kitty C.]

Then the FIRST thing I'd be asking this guy (and I would ONLY do it face-to-face) is that, if the child is SO intimidated by men, why isn't he intimidated by the psychologist and if he is, how can the psychologist even know that's what the problem is.  I would think that if the chld was truely intimidated by men, he would hardly open up to the psychologist.

I still think this guy is full of crap and that there could very well be drug issues with the child.  If this guy wants to continue along this line of thinking, tell him that you want a second opinion to confirm his diagnosis.  If he balks, then he's hiding something.  And if you can get a drug test done on the child, I think that would be enlightening.  I would strongly recommend doing this with a hair follicle test, as that has the best results for long term use.  And getting hair is much simpler then obtaining any other sample.........