anyone ever been here?

[John-J-Jay]

My child recently left for her mothers for the thanksgiving break. My child spoke to her mother eariler in the week expressing the desire to leave closer to thanksgiving so she could spend some time at home. My child called her mother a 2nd time the day she was suppose to leave and again expressed her feelings. When my child arrived at her mothers apparently her mother grilled her and talk to her about her feelings.

I rec'd a email from my ex claiming i told my daughter to tell her mother "I don't want to come can i come later during the week". In my ex's email she claimed i put my child up to it and if she didn't say this to her mother I would be mad at her and now she's claiming emotional abuse.

I never told our child anything other than to talk to her mother about it to see if she would be agreeable to let her come later in the week. However, i alway encourage a relationship between the two and have never denied any sort of phone contact or visitation.

What do i do that now i think she is coming at me with emotonal abuse?
is this a he said she said sorta of thing that the court could careless about?

I have many of expert witnesses that say now manipulative and lying my ex is. So she is distorting the whole situation to her benefit.

[Ref]

but I have to say, I don't think it is a good thing that you asked your child to negotiate visitation with her mom.

In my opinion, she shouldn't be encourged to ask for flexibility. If she expresses the desire to have more time with you, I think you should have an adult negotiation with your ex OR if that is impossible (like between DH and BM), let her know that you will spend some extra time with her at a later point and plan something special for that time with her.

I can actually understand why your ex is upset. Dh has had to have his heart broken several times becuase BM has SD ask DH to give up time with her for her to hangout with her friends etc. It is heartwrenching.

My first thought about BM saying that SD told her that you made her ask for less time, was that SD lied to her mom to avoid having her mom be angry or disapointed in her. Kids do this all the time. I don't think she was intentionally throwing you under the bus, but she was probably too scared to take the blame herself.

This is why it is bad to have kids negotiate their time. You are really asking them to do something that will hurt the other parent and take the consequences for it.

As far as a lawsuit goes, I wouldn't worry. You don't seem like you did this intentionally and if you adjust your way of dealing with this in the future, I doubt a pattern of this behavour could be established.

Good luck with everything
ref

 

[John-J-Jay]

thanks for the response. My whole take on this situation is if I was to ask my ex to adjust the schedule she would say the thought is from me and not our daughters wishes. It's the only time that this has happned but i'm sure my ex will claim it happens all the time.

When i did speak to my ex i told her it was our childs wishes and not mine. My child see's a psychologist and they have advised me to let our child voice her thoughts and opinions to both parents becuase if it only comes from me, the ex wouldn't believe it.

But i do agree with you that my daughter probably lied to her mother to aviod the consequences. My ex and I have a very bad line of communication. In fact my ex gives the school H3LL all the time as well as our childs dentist and doctor so she has a history of giving people problems.

[Ref]

DH and BM can not communicate without fighting. She thinks everything he says is a lie, because she is a habitual liar.

The way I see it, your daughter is too young to factor in consequences. Because of this, I think she can't really know what she wants completely. By the way she responded to her mom, I would think that now that she knows the consequences, she probably would have rather not said anything and saw her mom than to upset her mom. That is a very loving and selfless thing for your daughter.

As adults we do this all the time. We may not want to see our inlaws for dinner, but we know that if we don't we would hurt people we love, so we make the most of it and keep our mouths shut. This is something everyone has to do and a good lesson for kids to learn.

I really feel for your daughter because it must have been really upsetting to know she was responsible for upsetting her own mom.

I still think, in the future, you should simply state that you understand how she feels so you will make sure she has some extra time with just you and her when she gets back. Let her know that there are times she wont get exactly what she wants, but she can figure out alternatives that are just as good.

Best wishes,
Ref

[olanna]

as it put the child in the middle far too much.  

It's not up to your child to decide things like this.

Next time, email your ex, listing the request. Or better yet, just pick up the phone and call. If she isn't agreeable to the change, so be it.

[mistoffolees]

>thanks for the response. My whole take on this situation is
>if I was to ask my ex to adjust the schedule she would say the
>thought is from me and not our daughters wishes.

Then in that case, stick to the court-ordered schedule 100% without fail.

If the two of you can't even discuss slight changes to visitation, then you're going to end up back in court (again) if you try to change it.

It's never fair to put the kids in the middle, but it's even less fair to put them in the middle of a situation where even the adults can't discuss something reasonably.

Stick to the schedule and tell the daughter you'd love to spend more time with her, but you have an order from the court. Or that it's important for her to spend time with her mother, too. Or whatever. But don't change the schedule.

[John-J-Jay]

Mist,
do you think the court will view me as "BAD" because i had our child ask rather than me? I don't want to be seen in the court as negative. I have never put our child in the middle because it would harm the child emotionally. what's your thoughts?

Thanks
John

[greatdad]

My situation is slightly different, but has a lot of the same emotions. My stbx cancelled several EOW visits completely and then last few times has not come to the meeting point ( inter state visit), instead she has sent one of her family members. The children have refused to go with them, stating that they don't want to take that long ride unless their Mom is there to get them, that their not comfortable with the family members without their mom there. This has happened twice now and each time I have given family members over 15 minutes to try and talk kids into going.The children spoke to stbx on phone and told her same thing, that they will go if she is there to get them.They have a 5 1/2 hr ride and first night of visit id entirely in the car ride, so if stbx doesnt show, they don't even see her till next day.Order says that "the parties" shall meet at X time at X place. I am always there,stbx is not. I feel that I am complying with the order and that children should not be forced to go if the mother is not there, as that would be very traumatic to them ( both 7 and under)

[olanna]

I get very irritated when my wife in law sends messages through the boys.  Things like, "oh yea, we have to go home early because Mom's friend's grandmother is having a birthday party at 10 am on Sunday."

I really wasn't referring to things like what you speak..but the fact that two people are allowing the child to negotiate their time or dictate to the other parent what and when they are going to do things.

 

[mistoffolees]

>Mist,
>do you think the court will view me as "BAD" because i had our
>child ask rather than me? I don't want to be seen in the court
>as negative. I have never put our child in the middle because
>it would harm the child emotionally. what's your thoughts?

I guess it would depend on the judge.

I'm not really concerned about what the court will think because I don't think it's that serious a matter from a legal standpoint (not a legal opinion, though). I just think it's a bad thing from a child-rearing POV.

If the parents can't even discuss a topic, there's no gain to be had by having the child discuss it.  It's going to hurt the child and not going to accomplish anything.

If the parents get along OK and are willing to work together, then it's not an issue. On occasion, my daughter will ask to do something and I'll have her ask her mother if she minds me taking her somewhere if I have my hands full. In our case, it's not a problem (although I generally ask BM directly). But even when it's not a problem as in our case, it's better for parents to address those issues directly rather than having the kid in the middle.

IMO, kids shouldn't have to worry about custody, visitation, support, etc. They should be told what the schedule is and then they can live their lives around that schedule. If the parents agree to a change, let the kids know, but don't get the kids involved. They're kids.