Alcoholism - How do i protect our child?

[gollymolly]

we are in florida

i have to say, i was really naive in believing that a mere statement in our custody agreement saying  that neither party would consume alcoholic beverages during their time with the child.
the other parent has eow beginning with thursday and drinks heavily during every visitation. many times drinking and driving with her in the vehicle, out of state, drinking until unconscious.

this weekend, he left her with a friend told her he went out for eye drops, but went to a bar. she texted me saying that he came home so drunk that he couldn't walk or barely speak. that he had gone to a bar instead and gotten kicked out.

i fear for our child's safety. every time the police have been involved, they have been absolutely NO help.
they actually INFORM him of his rights to keep the door closed and refuse to let her go, when i have shown them all of the text messages.
all of the witnesses are his friends (drinking buddies) or from the bar and do not want to get involved.

the police don't want to do anything about it.

i have no money for a PI. i have no money for an attorney.
i am in fear every time our daughter is with him.

i don't know how to document this.
what do i do?

[wendl]

How old are the kids?

If they are scared or fear for their safety they can call 911

**These are my opinions, they are not legal advice**

[gollymolly]

unfortunately, our daughter is very protective of her father.
she would not do that.

she only calls me to come get her or texts me about everything going on.

on top of that he is very manipulative of her. when i picked her up over the weekend. she said he was saying to her 'why would you tell mom those things'


she is 11 years old.

[Kitty C.]

....if you know at a specific time and place that she is in his vehicle and he's been drinking, to call it in to local LE.  And whomever calls does NOT need to give their name.  Just give them information on the make, model and color of the vehicle (plate # would be a plus, too), the vicinity where he's been seen, and that it is suspected that a child is in the vehicle with him.  You don't even have to give his name.  Just say that you have seen a vehicle driving erratically and that you have reason to believe that there is a child in the vehicle.  BUT...if you are calling from a far enough distance away, it might look suspicious.  Whomever calls must be somewhere in or near the area where he's driving.

I have done this many times, after following vehicles where the driver appears to be intoxicated.  I'm an EMT and have ridden numerous times with deputies......I know what they look for to have probable cause to pull someone over for suspected DUI.  Usually all I have is a make and model, sometimes a plate number.  I always give my name, but it can be anonymous.  But if information is given in this manner it appears to come from an objective 3rd party, which law enforcement would probably be more willing to follow up on.

He has to be caught in the act, with her in the vehicle, in order to do anything about it.  Unfortunately, this also raises the risk of her getting hurt, but if that's what it takes for the cops to respond, then so be it.

[pandabear]

first off, I want to say that I'm so terribly sorry you and your child are living this.  However, there are many things you can do to help your baby.

First and foremost.  Accept the fact you mated with a baffoon and your child will forever know and love this person.  There's not a single thing you can or should do to keep these two apart unless there's some wicked gnarly abuse going on.  Let me explain before you decide you want to kill me.

I, too, bred with a total idiot.  I'm dealing with the alcoholism, the pot smoking, the cigarette smoking in the house, the loud obnoxious parties, the taking her to bars, the pathological lying, which, to this day is completely mind boggling, the missing in action for months (a few times years) on end, with no explanation except "You stupid bitch!  You denied me visitation!!!"

But, I had a kiddo with him.  So now I have to deal.  My child is almost 10 years old.  She hates him.  But she loves him.  She never wants to see him again.  But every other friday, she's excited to go.  Every other Sunday she says over and over how much she loves me, and what a great parent I am, yet come next parenting weekend, she's clawing to get out of the house to spend time with him. What do you do?

If your ex has every other weekend, that's 4 days a month.  This means you have 27 days to put all the goodness, the strength, the love humanly possibly so that she (or he, I can't remember, sorry) can handle 4 days of pure crap.  4 days seems like alot of time for a child to be around parties and drunken boobs, but think of it like she/he isn't around it 27 days.  She/he has to deal with hell 4 days a month, but is in a good, safe environment 27.  

A Guardian ad litem once told me that as long as there isn't physical or sexual abuse going on, let the relationship go on.  Knowing a less than stellar father or mother is far superior than not knowing him/her at all.  Kids learn from the garbage they're put through.  If you're thinking of trying for no parenting time, just know that your child will hold this man in such high regard because he/she doesn't know any better, and then hate you for it.  They won't see it as you protecting them.  You will be the jerkface who took made their other parent go away.  

Teach your child to take care of itself.  It's ok to make your own bowl of cereal or toast, then a sandwich at lunch.  It's ok to microwave a corndog for supper.  It's only 4 days a month.  It's ok that they're alone in their room while the other parent is down in the basement drinking like a fish.  Teach your child to entertain themselves.  Read a book.  Watch a show.  Draw.  It TOTALLY sucks.  But it's only 4 days.  

That was the hardest thing for me to learn.  I wasted so much time and money in court, on lawyers, on GAL's, it's ridiculous!  I thought I needed to 'teach that bastard' because he was a fool.  All I needed to do was  love my child those 27 days I have her each month.  I had to teach her that sometimes people act weird, are weird, and that includes me.  (unfortunatly she agreed on that one)  It took me almost 5 years to grow up and realize that no matter what, I'm a great parent, he's a moron, she loves us both, and I need to just take the good as it comes and roll with the bad. So does she.

Enjoy what you have.  Let your child enjoy what he/she has.  And remember, the best parent always wins in the end.  When this child is an adult, she/he will remember all the bullshit at the other parents house and all the love attention and respect at yours.

Take care,
pandabear

[Kitty C.]

Pandabear,

I could NEVER have said it better!  I, too, mated with an alcoholic.  I tremble at the thought of how often he drove drunk with our son with him.  Ours was an interstate custody battle, which did include both of us being evaluated for alcoholism and/or co-dependence.  Of course, I was deemed co-dependent...never did hear what his eval. determined, he wouldn't aloow that to be shared with me, but the judge ordered it and the judge made recommendations from it.

I, too, stressed for a long time regarding his less-than-stellar parenting skills.  But it didn't change the fact that DS loved him.  I had to put DS on a plane every summer and EO X-mas to travel by himself from IA to CA, starting when he was 7 years old.  His dad never came to see him here, and there was a time he was mad at his dad about that, saying he wouldn't go see Daddy if Daddy didn't come to see him.  But I swallowed hard and geared him up to go, telling him of all the exciting things they would do together.  I even agreed to his dad taking DS to Canada to meet his family and see where he grew up.  There were a LOT of sleepless nights on that one!

Then, when DS was 13, his dad died died while he was there for the summer.  Diagnosed with liver cancer 3 weeks after DS arrived and died 4 weeks later.  And I will be forever grateful that I never stood in the way of the relationship DS had with his father.  DS is now 19 and going to tech school out of state.  He also remembers how his father treated me and why we couldn't stay together.  He still loves his father dearly and misses him desperately.  But he had his Daddy for such a very short time in his life.

No one knows what this life will bring.  All you can do is have faith in a higher power, that your child will be watched over.  In our situation, any number of things could have happened, including DS getting killed in an accident while his dad was driving.  *I dealt with what I could and gave the rest to God.*  I feel that, if I hadn't, I would have been a candidate for the looney bin and raised a neurotic child.  DS has had enough to deal with in his life and because of circumstances, will always have difficulty in certain areas.  But at least he has the foundation of love from his parents, knows our strengths and weaknesses, and has learned a lot from it.  I couldn't ask for more..........

[gemini3]

I would like to add some insight from an adult child's perspective.  

My father is an alcoholic, and when he drank he was abusive.  My parents seperated and divorced after ugly two year battle - much of which I was privy to, unfortunately.  During that two years I had no specified visitation with my father.  I never knew if, or when, I would see him.  After the divorce was final he moved across the country, and for the next ten years my contact with him was sporadic at best, and I never saw him.  For many years I didn't even know where he lived or what his phone number was.

Did I know that my dad was a jerk, and that he had a drinking problem, and that he would hurt me when I was drinking?  Of course - I was faced with that reality every day that I lived with him.  Did that change the fact that I loved him and desperately needed him to love me too?  No -  and, as wonderful a parent as my mom is, there was nothing she could do to make up for the damage not having my father in my life caused.  I was on a self-destructive path for years, and I'm not being dramatic when I say that I'm lucky I'm not dead.  When I finally decided enough was enough, it took years of counseling for me to reconcile the damage those years caused, and the subsequent damage I caused myself.

I guess what I'm trying to tell you is that you can't rescue your daughter from her father's drinking problem, and that not being with him would most likely be much worse for her than being with him is right now.  The best thing that you can do for her is to help her learn how to deal with his drinking in a healthy way.  If you can't afford counseling for her, take her to Al-anon or Alateen, these are both excellent programs that help people who love someone who is an alcoholic.  You could benefit from the same, because even though you are not with him you're linked through your daughter, and you need to learn to deal with his behavior in a healthy way as well so that you can help your daughter.

There are very few things worse for a child than thinking that one of their parents doesn't love them, or want to be in their life.

http://www.al-anon.alateen.org/english.html

[gollymolly]

i'm glad that i did not have a chance to respond to the previous two posts that only upset me.

i am very put off when people on this board make assumptions about others. i will just make a mental note of such judgmental handles.

i do appreciate gemini3's post. however, a bit misguided on my agenda at least the approach was not critical.

i do not take kindly to persons assuming immediately that my goal is to take my daughter away from her father. that is so far from the truth.

this situation has escalated to the point that i can ignore it no longer.

it is not possible for me to describe all the details (not on this board), nor is it possible for anyone else to assume the details of our situation (please do not presume to know me from one post).

the danger our daughter has been place in multiple times is not fabricated.

i will support the relationship with her father.

that will not be at the cost of harm to our child.

so i guess i will file contempt, since i had it placed in our divorce decree that we would not consume alcoholic beverages during our possessory period.

[gemini3]

I think everyone here understands your concerns about your daughters saftey.  Many of us have "been there, done that".  Sometimes empathy is too subtle to come across in these posts, but it's there.

I wasn't making assumptions about your agenda.  It just sounds to me that you're dealing with an alcoholic.  If you turn the situation into a choice between being able to drink and being able to spend time with his daughter he will most likely end up drinking.  You will file for contempt, his visitation will be limited.  Daughter feels like dad would rather drink than see her, and there you have it.  Whether it's your agenda or not, that's what the outcome will be.  

Those kinds of ultimatums don't work - court ordered or not.  Not when it's you or the drinking, or when it's the kids and the drinking.  Not because he doesn't want to see her, but because he most likely doesn't know how to stop - but try explaining that to an 11 year old who just wants to see her dad.

It's a bad situation, and I'm sorry that you're having to deal with it.  

[Davy]

First of all most of the posters on this thread have posted here for a long time and all meant well with a difficult subject matter.  Years ago I was victimized with permanent disabilities by a drunk driver (and the drunk basically went free).  I had a similiar situation as you except the abuser was a boyfriend (and subsequent husband).  All drinking and driving is bad irrelevant to alcohol level.  

I thought Kittys's 1st message had some practical preventive recommendations.  Here are some other considerations :

All oral and written communication (by you or a third party) to everybody has to focus on SAFETY and the ills of drinking and driving.
This issue overwhelms Custody rights.
 
An 11 yr old is old enough to coach concerning the ills of mixing alcohol and driving.  Pictures, newsarticles, etc will help. In my humble opinion (IMHO) I think it is appropriate to instruct a child NOT to ride with anyone that has been drinking.    

Is it possible to have a rational but adamant communication with the other sober parent ?

I don't necessarily think that civil contempt will solve a criminal matter but realize you may not have any other choice.  All to often 'the system' only reacts poorly. (Especially in Florida) ... My personal opinion.

Wish I could be of more help.

One thing,  Several months ago there was a very bad one car  traffic accident one school morning.  I had cause to be there and was impressed how many parents (mothers) were stopping and taking pictures to show their teenagers  a car wrapped around a light pole approx. 5 ft above ground level.