extracurricular activities & visitation....

[BehindBlueEyes]

A little background....I have physical custody of my 8 yo daughter.  She has EOW, fall & spring break, and all but 1 week w/ her father who lives 3 hours away (we meet halfway for drop off/pick up).  

At the final hearing last year his lawyer addressed the issue of extracurricular activities because at the time our daughter was playing basketball & said that it wouldn't be good to sign her up for things just to interfere w/ visitation; but that as she got older she would have her own agenda on what she wanted to do & that we had to go with what she wanted.  Which, is only fair to her.  

Well, she came to me wanting to play soccer.  There is a city wide league in the spring & fall.  They play 7 games over an 8 week period (skipping spring break week).  So, I signed her up.  I notified her dad before hand that I was signing her up at her request and that some of the games would be on his weekends.  He never said he objected.  I then gave him the schedule after I received it & again he never objected.  Well, this weekend turned out to be the first game on his weekend.  She's already had 2 games that both fell on my weekends because of skipping spring break weekend.

Anyway, her dad called Thursday evening to let me know his wife would be picking our daughter up on Friday at the usual time.  I said that our daughter had a game & he said she could miss it.  I told him no she couldn't because she made a commitment to the team to play & I told her in the beginning if she didn't play all games she couldn't play at all because of it not being fair to the rest of the team.  Of course that just turned into me threatening her in his eyes.  But, there was a girl out on the team today & it made it so much harder on the other girls because they couldn't take as many breaks.  And it made our daughter realize how important it is to be at every game for the team's sake.

But, ultimately she told her dad she wanted to play.  How do you deal with this?  I don't sign her up to play any sports or do anything else unless she comes to me and asks to participate.  I also explain to her before she signs up that this will cost her time w/ her dad on his weekends.  Both for basketball & soccer she knew this & still wanted to play.  

She's already expressed interest in wanting to play soccer again in the fall league.  So, I know there's going to be issues again then as well.  If she wants to play a sport or get involved in something while she's at his house in the summer I wouldn't expect her to miss every other event for my weekends.  I would just pick her up late.  And it's not like her dad is missing the whole weekend.  I dropped her off as soon as the game was over.  

And that's a whole other issue in itself!  He wanted me to drive further than half way since he didn't have her the whole weekend.  Eventually I said I would but that I would be an hour later getting there because of driving time so he'd be losing another hour because I was doing good to get to the normal meeting spot by the time I told him I would.  

We left from the game right after it was over & went straight to the meeting spot.  For me to have drove the extra distance would have meant another hour driving.  He reluctantly agreed to meeting at the regular spot when I told him I'd be an hour later getting there & he'd just be losing another hour of time with her.  I did ask him if he wanted to meet an hour later on Sunday to drop her off to give him an extra bit of time.  I know it's not much; but it's better than nothing.  His reply..."Whatever."  

He doesn't come to any of the games.  He only came to like 2 or 3 basketball games.  I realize it's a long drive; but it would also mean a lot to our daughter if he was there.  

Sometimes I feel like it's a no-win situation no matter what.  And I know he probably wouldn't get anywhere in court with it.  The soccer games are only going to interfere w/ 3 of his weekends.  And it just cuts them short...not takes them away completely.  And in another 5 weeks it will be time for her to go to his house for the summer.  

She'll be there until the week before school starts.  I just feel like I'm the bad guy because I'm letting her participate in what she wants to do.  If she hadn't come to me and asked to play I wouldn't have signed her up.  Anyone have any advice?  I'm not trying to take his time from him.  I would never do that.  He just doesn't see it that way.  

[nosonew]

I went thru this with my ds, his dad was 3 hours away, and we met half way too. My son is very active in sports, is now 15, makes his own schedule with dad, which is more time with dad actually, (we get along great), but in the earlier years, he too wanted to play soccer, baseball, etc.  He did the guilt trips to me and son, but eventually figured out that his son wanted this sooo bad.  I gave extra time, any weekend there wasn't a game, he went, every spring break instead of every-other, additional time in summer (it was split in half), extra time at holidays, etc., to try to help make up for time missed.  

Perhaps you can try the same thing.  The important thing is this: He needs both parents involved in his life, and he also needs to grow socially, academically, and physically.  Sports is just something that is a normal part of most kids' lives, and if you take the initiative to show dad you aren't trying to interfere with his time, by allowing extra time throughout the year, he will see that.  Just make sure you follow thru on what you say, and he can meet you half way, having you drive farther just takes more time away from him.  Doesn't make sense to me.  Good luck!

[BehindBlueEyes]

I do try to make up any time when at all possible. But, until soccer is over it's going to be hard because there is a game every weekend.  I did make it up during basketball if there wasn't a game on my weekend we would just switch weekends.  I just hope eventually he does see that this is something our daughter wants to do and not something I'm having her do to just keep her from him.  I wouldn't do that.  I know she loves him dearly.  It's just so frustrating at times, ya know?

[gipsy]

Look for solutions . not the problems , I here in your post ,worry about how hard it is for the other teamates when a member is missing etc , I would say the same consideration for missing members of the family are more important then soccer , But I also understand kids , Ands their desire to play sports ,I also Hear That you are  both arguing the point by hours of driving time , I also know what reality is , And I know why there are court orders , I have all the similar problems , I am the Dad And I have visits and the Mother always finds the difficulties in every visit , I also have a large enough family and circle of friends to know that when you are the custodial parent , you don't spend all the free time with the kids , You have work and bills and a life also ,SOO My point is , Give a little to get a little , I hate to be in  the position you are talking about when it comes up , SO I go by the parenting plan line by line and mom knows it , The reason I don't give is because she doesn't , All though My son wants to be with me more she won't budge , the way I see it ,the custodial parent has the MOST flexible time to spare , And except for My CHERISHED COURT ORDERED TIME  I have zero control over how much time I get , So I take what I paid an atty to get for Me ,AND NO LESS!!!  SO My two cents is give him and extra weekend , Be nice once and say hey . I'll give you extra time no sweat , This is cutting off some of your time and I'll make it a better deal , So pick a week end or special event and you got it ! If you give a little , I feel because if it happened for me , I would think hey Mom is starting to get on with it and being cool , I don't have to stress so much about my CHERISHED TIME  !!!!!, And I would be willing to negotiate ,better yet Tell him , You come here and get the child and take her to the game and I'll go all the way there and pick up ! then You can be part of this childs game and fun and see her play , Maybe she would like her dad to see her in the game , I have a great atty , that constantly tells me Make all these stupid things into good things , Its hard to change My thinking , Honestly, but when I take his advice it;s better ,  . A known fact is that us non custodial parents alway's  worry about our time with the kids , ,, Those that love our kids , , Let Me tell You the worst side of the coin , The worst effect I see on the kids I know ,Is My step daughter , Her Dad And one other person I know , Has the non custodial that does not show up , Ya want to see your kid cry , It happens every time , Its a terrible thing that I see with My step daughter , She is Hurt angry indignant rebelious and , It is known through Me, My wife and the counselor that she takes her anger out on Me , with a rebelion , that Is a big part of My  Wife and I are divorcing , Trust Me kids want there other parent , It is far more important than , Arguing driving time, or giving up an extra weekend ,  You mentioned three more weekends , sooo , Give one of yours up to dad and say its a peace offering , you can actually get extra time , I garuntee I want every minute I get with My son and I am always sad when he goes home , I love to here the pitter patter of his feet as much as any mother does , the best thing you can do is try to  get a happy kid out of this and forget about dislike for the other parent ,
 My poor little son gets stressed when I have difficulties with the mother , Ands he is asked to make choices , so I have to go By the parenting plan and Not deviate , No negotiations work with the Mom ,You are Asking for help on the net , that means You are not so stuck on stupid that You refuse to consider options , I believe you are considering better options thats why You are asking ,

[nosonew]

I hear ya gypsy.  Although my situation with ex is different than anyone on this board since we get along, my dh's son's mother is like most bm's we hear about on this board.  

She actually coached little league soccer one year, and didn't hold one practice that wasn't on our weeknight visit!  She signed up for coach just to interfere with dad's time, not because she wanted to be moty (mother of the year).  

I think each persons situation is different and unique to their situation, and as both a bm and sm, I am proud of the way my ex and I have worked things out. Have never ever gone to court for anything, and both do nothing except what is truly in our son's best interest, and thus, he is a very well adjusted child.  

I agree, when there are difficulties, you have no choice but to go by the parenting plan in place, too bad your ex won't negotiate and allow extra time so the kid(s) can participate in activities they wish to.  Kids aren't possessions, they have hearts and souls and dreams.  Good luck!

[BehindBlueEyes]

I would gladly give him an extra weekend here or there to make up the time.  I did it in basketball.  But, until soccer is over that's not possible.  There's a game every weekend between now & May 22.  And the next weekend starts summer break after that which means she's with him 2 mos straight.  Except for the every other weekend she'll be with me during that time.  And if she gets involved in sports down there during the summer I wouldn't expect him to make her not go on my weekends just so that she can come here.  I would just pick her up after the event...even try to go to the event if I'm able.  I know that my being there would mean the world to her.  But, I do understand his point that it does take away from what little time he has.  If it weren't for her asking to play this wouldn't be an issue.  But it was a choice she made to participate.  He doesn't see that tho.  I just want to find the fine line there of everyone being happy.  Is that at all possible?  

[gipsy]

sometimes Some people will never be happy , The thing I can only hope a CP could understand Is , As An NCP We want our time ,I would hate to miss ANY time with My son, And two weeks, too Me is a long time , So Missing one visit would mean Four weeks , I already said why Don't you tell the ex to take her too the game thats part of parenting , I know when this type of thing comes up it won't be a question , I have gone to His school events when , Mom And her boy friend are there ,I don't care . I show up !!   I see the problem, Kids like sports . Can You even have a civil conversation with the dad , If You can you are better off then I am, the Mom won't cooperate ! Hopefully You can just talk , Maybe a letter ,My case is very different , I pretty much just go By the plan And there is no other questions , Thats the way It is , I don't have 2 months in the summer , I would be happyer with that , Sometimes we just have to accept that  people CAN"T negotiate , But try Giving a little To get a little , Isn't there a day off from school or something That You could give up?

[mango]

It hurts to think that an activity could be more important than seeing the parent. Especially when your the parent that sees them less.

I think some make-up time can be added to the mix. If the mother gets some weekends in the summer, then cough up those weekends as a trade off. As long as it evens out. Sounds like you both are willing to work it out. He might say whatever, at first but I bet he be willing to take one your those summer weekends.

I am a Step mom  my DH's ex is constantly trying to interefere in our parenting time. She enrolled my SD in a year round swim club, that practices everyday, and has out of town meets on all the weekends. The father (my husband) has 3 out 4 weekends per month, plus a full week. Which would mean her would be required to do the travel for the meets. Furthermore he has his own family who would prefer not to spend every single weekend in a hotel and swimming pool in a foreign town. The whole family pays the price for what? an activity?

It means the other kids do not get to do camping, and snow skiing, or family picnics, none of the things we noramlly do. We are bound and tied to go to out of town swim meets.

I think the value of family and bonds go a lot further then a missed practice or an acitivity. If there is a way to work it in it should be. But not at the expense of other people having all their weekends spent at an activity year round.

Kids can also learn to give and take as they will need to do so in the long run.

Needless to say we are fighting this in court. First I do not feel the ex has a right to plan activites on teh fathers time. Especially all of his time.

[BehindBlueEyes]

If he wanted to come take her to the games; by all means I would let him.  But he doesn't want to make the 3 hr drive to come to them.  During basketball I gave him make up time on weekends she didn't have games.  We would just switch weekends.  I switched weekends to give him make up time when he didn't want her one weekend because he & his wife separated.  I'm not unreasonable about that.  Until soccer is over tho there's no weekends she doesn't have games.  And the last soccer game is the weekend before school lets out which means the next weekend starts his 2 mos of summer.  I think it makes me angry because I know he would have a fit if she got involved with something down there on the summer that interfered w/ my weekend & I told him that she shouldn't.  Ya know?  

[BehindBlueEyes]

DD called her dad tonight because she wanted to attend a party at her soccer coach's house after the game on Saturday.  I told her she had to clear it with her dad as it was his weekend and that if he said it was ok that I would just meet him after the party & that he could have her next weekend as well (after the soccer game).  

He asked her what she wanted to do & she told him go to the party.  Then he said something about going camping again & she wanted to do that.  So, I got on the phone at this point & told him that she wanted to go camping instead to just never mind the party.  It was her choice.  I wanted her to do what she wanted to do.  No biggie.

Then I told him that I would give him one of my weekends during the summer to make up for the missed time during the soccer games.  There are 3 weekends of his that were cut short because of games.  His reply?  "What good is it going to do then?"  (She'll be at his house during the week on summer & w/ me every other weekend.)  I couldn't believe it.  I really don't understand it.

The conversation just went downhill from there & I wound up just hanging up to save arguing with him over it.  I'm tempted to just keep her out of all extracurricular activities just so I don't have to deal with the issues w/ him.  I can't allow her to sign up for sports & not show up for half the games because they're on his weekends.  And if I try to compensate he doesn't appreciate it.  It seems like such a losing battle.