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Author Topic: Get this....bias with a plus  (Read 5935 times)

MYSONSDAD

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antonin

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RE: Get this....bias with a plus
« Reply #1 on: Mar 23, 2005, 09:08:38 AM »
This needs to go to Glen Sacks...this is nonsense.

cinb85

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I guess I don't see what you are talking about.
« Reply #2 on: Mar 23, 2005, 09:29:21 AM »
Please explain what you mean by "bias with a plus"

antonin

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RE: Get this....bias with a plus
« Reply #3 on: Mar 23, 2005, 09:58:23 AM »
mysonsdad: you might also want to alert the following group to this pack of of stereoypyes and lies:http://www.mediaradar.org/

cinb85

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I don't think that the letter was biased.
« Reply #4 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:06:53 AM »
The letter talked about women more because Fashion Bug is a Woman's store.  Did you not read the line (and I quote):

"domestic abuse is a serious problem for both women and men around the world."


Brent

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RE: I don't think that the letter was biased.
« Reply #5 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:16:10 AM »
>The letter talked about women more because Fashion Bug is a
>Woman's store.  Did you not read the line (and I quote):
>
>"domestic abuse is a serious problem for both women and men
>around the world."

YES, but ONLY in the context of "men beating women", there is NO mention that women commit DV as well. The letter is biased.

cinb85

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The line that says
« Reply #6 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:17:59 AM »
"domestic abuse is a serious problem for both women and men around the world." shows that the letter was not intended to be biased.  

I think that you are making a mountain out of a mole hill!


MYSONSDAD

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If you can't see it, I can't help you...
« Reply #7 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:33:44 AM »
This is so directly targeted toward men. The entire letter is extremely bias. If you can not see it, I can not help you.

"Children learn what they live"

MYSONSDAD

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Both have been contacted, THX (nm)
« Reply #8 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:40:27 AM »

"Children learn what they live"

Brent

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RE: The line that says
« Reply #9 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:48:01 AM »
>"domestic abuse is a serious problem for both women and men
>around the world." shows that the letter was not intended to
>be biased.  

No, actually it's quite the reverse. She's saying it's a problem for men because they're abusive, not because they're abused too. Only women are abused, men are shown as the perpetrator and no referenc3e is made to the fact that women commit domestic violence too.

>
>I think that you are making a mountain out of a mole hill!

I was merely responding to the post with my opinions. I'm not making anything out of anything; I'm just calling them as I see them.

Brent

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RE: If you can't see it, I can't help you...
« Reply #10 on: Mar 23, 2005, 10:54:57 AM »
>This is so directly targeted toward men. The entire letter is
>extremely bias. If you can not see it, I can not help you.

Exactly.

I was, to be honest, a bit surprised when cinb said she didn't see anything wrong with it.

It's the same ol, same ol "men are batterers and abusers and women are their victims" stuff.

I mean, come on, it's 2005. Do people still really believe that only men commit DV??

And for the record, NO, a woman is NOT battered every 9 seconds in the US. That's another BS statistic that ranks right up there with the myth of DV "skyrocketing" during the Super Bowl.


jilly

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Nuff Said
« Reply #11 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:00:54 AM »
Posted on Wed, Mar. 23, 2005
 
Woman slain by estranged boyfriend

Man then turns gun on self; family said woman tried separation

KYTJA WEIR

Staff Writer


PINEVILLE - Janet Martinez had many dreams, and she finally fulfilled one of them Thursday when she bought a BMW.

But within hours of getting the used car, the 42-year-old mother and grandmother lay dead in her bedroom, two bullets in her chest.

Police said her estranged boyfriend, Reginald Ragin, 46, burst into her Willow Ridge apartment around 3:20 a.m. Friday, brushing past her 72-year-old mother and the couple's 8-year-old daughter.

As police arrived, he shot her with a 9 mm Glock handgun, police said, then turned the gun on himself. He died next to her.

"She was strong. She wasn't strong with him," Marianet Martinez, 36, said Tuesday. "That was the only weakness and it killed her."

The two had troubles since the day they met, her sister said. The woman's friends kept telling her to get help. They would take Janet Martinez (who sometimes used the last name Diaz, from a previous marriage) to get a restraining order.

But at the last minute, her sister said, she would back down.

Marianet Martinez, sitting on a bed one room away from where Janet Martinez was shot, urged others not to make the same mistake.

"Tell someone before it's too late. Don't back down. You've got to see the signs," she said. "She saw them, but she ignored them."

Pineville police released the names of Martinez and Ragin on Monday, and said it was the town's first homicide in at least seven years.

Last year 80 people were killed across North Carolina through domestic violence, according to the N.C. Coalition Against Domestic Violence. That doesn't include the 18 accused killers who then committed suicide, the coalition said.

Two weeks ago, a Mount Holly couple died in a similar shooting. On March 13, police said, Neiko Michelle Eller, 30, called 911 after her husband, Christopher Michael Eller, 28, shot her about four times and then killed himself. She died later that day.

The killings usually follow warning signs, said Marie Brodie, an N.C. Coalition Against Domestic Violence training coordinator, though people often mistakenly explain them as coming from the heat of the moment.

"The person is not snapping," she said. "The person probably has a long history of battering partners."

In Martinez's case, the couple had problems, but Martinez's family never thought they would turn deadly. Martinez never took out a restraining order against him, her sister said.

"She never felt he was going to hurt her the way he did," her sister said. "He kept hurting her because he wouldn't let go. She just wanted to him to accept the fact that they couldn't be together."

But the man stalked Martinez, her sister said, turning up everywhere she looked.

Still, she wanted Ragin to stay involved in their daughter's life. "She would try to let him be a father and communicate with him," her sister said. "But he wanted more than that."

On Dec. 26, Pineville police were called to the home during an argument between the couple, said Detective Sgt. Bill Connell. No one was charged in the incident, he said.

Ragin was charged three times with assaulting a female in 1987, 1988, and 1989, N.C. court records show, but it appears all the charges were dismissed. The alleged victims of those charges were not listed.

Marianet Martinez doesn't want to talk about Ragin. Instead, she wants people to remember her sister, outspoken and determined to work toward her dreams.

She was born in New York City but moved to the Charlotte area about 13 years ago for a better place to raise her two sons, now grown with children of their own.

She loved cooking, sharing her favorite Spanish dishes with her neighbors.

She also loved to salsa dance. But she rarely had time for it between her busy work schedule in customer service at Time Warner Cable and caring for her daughter and her mother.

"She always told everybody, `never say you can't,' " her sister said. " `Think positive, you can do whatever you want to do.' "

Martinez herself had a long list of things she wanted to do. In June, she planned to move to a larger apartment with an extra bedroom for her aging mother. She also had planned a trip to Puerto Rico to visit family. Eventually she hoped to buy a house in Florida to be closer to the sun.

And there was her dream car.

Martinez used to point to BMWs whenever she saw one on the street. " `See that car,' she'd say, `I'm going to have that car in the future,' " her sister said.

A medium blue, shiny BMW sedan stood outside Martinez's apartment Tuesday night, untouched in the spot where Janet Martinez had parked it the night she was killed.

10 Warning Signs of Abuse

1. Withholding approval as punishment if you say something partner doesn't like.

2. Making derogatory comments about your family and friends.

3. Pressure to be intimate too soon with premature declarations of love.

4. Playing "games" to exercise physical and/or emotional power.

5. Battering behaviors in previous relationships and family history of violence.

6. Poor coping skills, alcohol and drug use, blaming others for problems.

7. Constant questions about your whereabouts.

8. Criticizing you through jokes, insults and other passive-aggressive behaviors.

9. Ignoring or minimizing your thoughts, feelings and goals.

10. Damaging or destroying your property when angry or upset.

SOURCE: Mecklenburg County Women's Commission, Stop the Violence and the Justice Department.

cinb85

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I don't believe that is what she is trying to say.
« Reply #12 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:02:46 AM »
Perhaps you should write to her and ask her to explain herself.

I know that there's alot of bias about men when it comes to fatherhood, custody and child support.  I just don't think that this particular letter was intended to be biased.  We are all entitled to our opinion

Brent

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RE: Nuff Said
« Reply #13 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:07:06 AM »
Murder by Mercedes?      
   
Prosecutors say Clara Harris, left, with her lawyer, ran her husband down last July after confronting him with his mistress at a Houston hotel.

By Matt Bean
Court TV

A Texas jury began Wednesday to deliberate the case of a Houston woman who ran down her adulterous husband with a Mercedes last July, with attorneys from both sides urging them to consider the defendant's intent at the time of the accident.

Clara Harris, 45, allegedly hit her husband in the parking lot of a Houston hotel on July 24, 2002, after confronting him in the hotel lobby with his mistress. If convicted she could face life in prison.

Lawyers had their final say Wednesday morning, with prosecutors calling the killing deliberate and her defense attorney focusing on the affair Harris's husband was having Gail Bridges, his receptionist.

"His body was run over at least two times, two different directions," said prosecutor Mia Magness.  "There was impact, and then there were crushing injuries."

The proximity of Valentine's day was not lost on Harris' defense attorney, George Parnham, who reminded jurors during his hour-long closing argument that Harris, 45, married her orthodontist husband on Valentine's day 1992.

The avuncular lawyer recounted in detail the marital history of David and Clara Harris, which turned sour when David Harris strayed.

"They were all together until somebody knocks on the door of the home, and somebody knocks on the heart of that family," said the lawyer.  "Gail Thompson Bridges is a home wrecker.  I don't care how you slice it, she is a home wrecker."

The jury of nine women and three men deliberated into the night before retiring.  They have a number of murder charges to consider, but could also find Harris guilty of the lesser charges of manslaughter or criminally negligent homicide.

Prosecutor Magness reminded jurors that numerous witnesses, from hotel employees to bystanders, testified that Harris ran over her husband at least three times.

Lindsey Harris, David Harris' daughter from another marriage, was in the car with Clara Harris that evening.  She told jurors the defendant exclaimed, "I'm going to hit him" before running over her husband.  She then "stomped on the accelerator and went straight for him."

Harris' testified during a tearful two-day stay on the stand that she was aiming for the SUV of her husband's mistress — which she had "keyed" earlier that evening — when her car went awry and hit her husband.

On Wednesday, she again shed tears as her lawyer described the hotel lobby confrontation with her husband and his mistress.  As she sobbed silently, her eyes closed, her tears dripped onto her green velvet suit coat.

Parnham himself even appeared to choke up as he summed up his closing argument.  "I want this jury to acquit her," he said, trailing off.  "Pardon me."

Prosecutor Magness, in closing, asked jurors to set aside the marital strife that Parnham focused on during their deliberations.

"If a man is cheating on you do what every other woman in this county does—take his house take his car take his kids, take his respect in the community, make him wish he were dead—but you don't get to kill him," said Magness.  "But we're not talking about a divorce.  We're talking about a killing."

The jury, which is sequestered, will return Thursday to resume deliberations.

cinb85

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The letter is geared towards women because the company sells
« Reply #14 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:07:41 AM »
clothing to only women.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think that the author intended to say that only women are battered!  You are I both are reading that one particular line totally different.

When she says that this is a problem for both men and women, I read that to mean that BOTH men and women are battered and this is a problem in this world.

I KNOW that there are women who commit DV everyday!  No one deserves to be abused!

I was just trying to understand where you were coming from.  I like to hear all sides!



Brent

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RE: I don't believe that is what she is trying to say.
« Reply #15 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:10:08 AM »
>Perhaps you should write to her and ask her to explain
>herself.

Why? Here's the first line of her letter:

Did you know that a woman is physically abused every 9 seconds in the United States?

Gee, I think that explains her viewpoint pretty well. What's to misunderstand?



>I know that there's alot of bias about men when it comes to
>fatherhood, custody and child support.  I just don't think
>that this particular letter was intended to be biased.  

I don't care what she intended, the point is that this letter perpetuates the notion that only men commit DV, and it does it in a very emotional way.


>We are all entitled to our opinion

No way, we're all entitled to my opinion.   ;)



cinb85

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I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.
« Reply #16 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:17:48 AM »
The point being this particular letter (only).  Don't get me wrong!  I realize that domestic violence affects both men and women.  I think that there is an increasing volume of DV against men by women.  It IS a problem.  

MYSONSDAD

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I wrote a BIG letter
« Reply #17 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:32:02 AM »
They heard from me loud and clear, sent information from the Government agencies that have done the reach and found women just as capable.

Give them a little food for thought.

"Children learn what they live"

cinb85

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Who did you write a letter to?
« Reply #18 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:33:38 AM »
Just curious.

MYSONSDAD

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RE: Who did you write a letter to?
« Reply #19 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:36:23 AM »
The CEO of bias

respond to: dorrit@fashionbug.com

"Children learn what they live"

cinb85

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Let me know if she responds. Please?
« Reply #20 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:38:46 AM »
I would be curious as to what she says.

MYSONSDAD

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You just described my ex...
« Reply #21 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:43:10 AM »
10 Warning Signs of Abuse

1. Withholding approval as punishment if you say something partner doesn't like.

2. Making derogatory comments about your family and friends.

3. Pressure to be intimate too soon with premature declarations of love.

4. Playing "games" to exercise physical and/or emotional power.

5. Battering behaviors in previous relationships and family history of violence.

6. Poor coping skills, alcohol and drug use, blaming others for problems.

7. Constant questions about your whereabouts.

8. Criticizing you through jokes, insults and other passive-aggressive behaviors.

9. Ignoring or minimizing your thoughts, feelings and goals.

10. Damaging or destroying your property when angry or upset.


"Children learn what they live"

MYSONSDAD

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AMEN, AMEN
« Reply #22 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:45:06 AM »
Well said....
"Children learn what they live"

MYSONSDAD

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RE: Let me know if she responds. Please?
« Reply #23 on: Mar 23, 2005, 11:47:27 AM »
People like her, will not respond.

I placed it with the "Right People", to do with what they will..

"Children learn what they live"

HeavenSent

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Thems the facts
« Reply #24 on: Mar 23, 2005, 12:49:43 PM »
I see nothing biased about the content.  The author is trying to help abused women.  Period.  She makes no derrogatory comments about men as a whole, nor does she make any assumptions that ALL men are abusive.  There is nothing in the letter that presumes the only abusers are men.

I don't know a lot of statistics, but I do know that this is true:

1. Women are abused by men.
2. Men are abused by women.
3. Women are abused by women.
4. Men are abused by men.
5. The number of men who abuse women is more than any other combination.

All of those statements are FACTS; not opinions, not biased, but FACTS.  So in order to help the most number of people at one time, you would single out women who are abused by men.  Not due to any personl predjudice against men, only because that's what the numbers are.  That is the way it is, like it or not, its fact.  More men abuse women.  

By the way...I also believe that the number of men who treat women like goddesses, and who would give thier left nut for thieir woman, FAR outnumbers the ones who resort to domestic violence!....HMM... perhaps I'm biased...



MYSONSDAD

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RE: Thems the facts
« Reply #25 on: Mar 23, 2005, 01:01:07 PM »
Please feel free to post your "FACTS", resources and statistics. I am curious on where you receive your information. Mine ARE quite different...

Please feel free to quote from the letter where this person quotes 'men as being abused too.'


 
>A message from our chairman
Dear Friend,

Did you know that a woman is physically abused every 9 seconds in the United States?

The issues of power and control are at the heart of all domestic abuse situations. Whether a man repeatedly beats his girlfriend, uses intimidation to make her feel afraid, or denigrates her consistently to convince her she has no worth, domestic abuse is a serious problem for both women and men around the world.

Domestic abuse is usually thought of as physical abuse. However, there are many other types such as sexual, verbal, psychological and emotional, economic and social abuse. Each of these forms of domestic abuse can be just as harmful as the next.

The effects of domestic abuse are far greater than a black eye or a broken bone. Women and their children suffer from the pain of abuse, psychologically and emotionally, well beyond the abusive act itself. The statistics surrounding domestic abuse are terribly alarming:

Medical services for battered women total an estimated $857 million dollars every year.
Battering is the leading cause of pregnancy complications.
Domestic violence is the leading cause of homelessness for women and children.
I believe the problem of domestic abuse is one that can be solved if we recognize it for what it is. The first step is raising awareness. For that reason, I will devote a series of letters to the topic of domestic abuse and what you can do to recognize and stop the cycle of abuse. I have provided additional resources for you online at http://www.charmingvoices.com so you can become well informed about the issue and learn where to get help if you or someone you know is in an abusive situation. To call for help now, the National Domestic Violence Hotline is 1.800.799.SAFE.

As women, we have the power to accept domestic abuse or stop it now. Become informed. Become an advocate for women. I encourage you to stand up and let your voice be heard. Speak out against domestic abuse and make a difference.

Sincerely,


Dorrit Bern <

Please show me one phrase that does not show men as the perpetrator.

"Children learn what they live"

HeavenSent

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friendly debate only...
« Reply #26 on: Mar 23, 2005, 01:13:48 PM »

The letter says nothing about men being abused too, I agree.  Nor does it mention the women who are abused by thier female partners, or any other abusive situation.  That is not the authors goal.  She is only addressing women who are abused by men.  

She is not trying to help everyone in every situation.  I don't think there is anything wrong with that, since she is not denying other forms of abuse or trying to degrade any group (gender) as a whole.

Like I said, I don't have any statistics or resources.  I'm writing from common knowledge only.  

Do you believe one of my 5 statements to be untrue?

MYSONSDAD

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RE: friendly debate only...
« Reply #27 on: Mar 23, 2005, 01:28:45 PM »
No, I base my findings on FACTS...

The authors goal is pretty direct, that is based on my "common sense"

"Children learn what they live"

Brent

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RE: friendly debate only...
« Reply #28 on: Mar 23, 2005, 01:42:39 PM »

>She is only addressing women who are abused by
>men.  

Isn't that kind of sexist? Are only women deserving of help in DV situations? If not, why didn't she take a gender-neutral approach? You and I both know that her letter portrays women as victims and men as perpetrators. Period.


>She is not trying to help everyone in every situation.

Ummm, I think that was the point.



>Like I said, I don't have any statistics or resources.  I'm
>writing from common knowledge only.  

In other words, ,from your own personal point of view, which really sort of sets the stage for what you perceive and believe, right?


>Do you believe one of my 5 statements to be untrue?

Does it matter what I believe? Your mind seems pretty well made up.

Everyside

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WOW!.....
« Reply #29 on: Mar 23, 2005, 02:50:19 PM »
10 Warning Signs of Abuse

1. Withholding approval as punishment if you say something partner doesn't like.

2. Making derogatory comments about your family and friends.

3. Pressure to be intimate too soon with premature declarations of love.

4. Playing "games" to exercise physical and/or emotional power.

5. Battering behaviors in previous relationships and family history of violence.

6. Poor coping skills, alcohol and drug use, blaming others for problems.

7. Constant questions about your whereabouts.

8. Criticizing you through jokes, insults and other passive-aggressive behaviors.

9. Ignoring or minimizing your thoughts, feelings and goals.

10. Damaging or destroying your property when angry or upset.


I  personally heard or saw my husband's exwife do 9 out of 10 of these things while they were married.  Hell, she still does the same 9 out of 10 of them and they've been divorced over 8 years.

ivehadit

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RE: friendly debate only...
« Reply #30 on: Mar 23, 2005, 08:56:18 PM »
Although I agree with you that violence against men is not recognized as it should be - there is something to be said about "target audiences" too when it comes to things like this.

The letter was not on the editorial page of the Chicago Sun Times written for the entire public to see, or in the Sears catalog flyer which is seen by both men and women, this letter was addressed to consumers of Fashion Bug - those consumers being women.

I've been an unfortunate male stuck in a "Bug" while my wife shopped. It's a harrowing experience of pastel colors and no where to sit. Men have no business in a FB store as far as I'm concerned, so it shouldn't be expected that they be a focus of any letters, articles or otherwise.

It is not the CEO of Fashion Bug's job or responsibility to educate the consumers on the full issues of domestic violence. It's enough she even brings the subject to the table. Just because she only mentions men in passing does not mean she isn't aware of DV against men, but when you are looking to touch the hearts (and the wallets) of your primary consumer, you write your letter, article, advertisement, etc. to appeal to them.

There is no reason to go half cocked over a letter that mentions DV when it is really only being used as a marketing tool, and not an educational one. Sure she quotes a statistic, but look at it for what it is, an eye catcher - just like the "buy one get one free" posters they put in the window.


MYSONSDAD

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An issue you forgot to mention...
« Reply #31 on: Mar 23, 2005, 09:32:12 PM »
I do not feel it appropriate considering the age ranges of most of their customers. It is a store geared toward young adults, teenagers and I am bothered by the message they are sending to so many daughters out there, who have fathers.

You need to look at the overall picture....

Rakkasan

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RE: I don't think that the letter was biased.
« Reply #32 on: Mar 24, 2005, 10:46:22 AM »
Please re-read the letter.  You are correct in that she did say "...domestic abuse is a serious problem for both men and women.", however the opening sentence in the letter is as follows "Did you know that a woman is physically abused every 9 seconds in the United States".  There is no mention of the rate at which men are abused and I doubt that statistic even exists for that would require some organization or angency to care enough to track these events.

Ms. Berns' bias is confirmed not only in the first sentence, but in the first part of the sentence that you quoted which reads "Whether a man repeatedly beats his girlfriend, uses intimidation to make her feel afraid, or denigrate her consistently to convince her she has no worth, domestic abuse is a serious problem for both men and women."  

Additionally, para:4 sent: 2 states "Women and their children suffer from the pain of abuse, ...". Not only does this sentence further establish her bias, but it implies that children are the domain of women and men have no interest in, concern for, or right to the children.   Further along in the letter Ms Berns state 3 statistics (without sources)

Medical services for women total an estimated $857 million dollars every year.

Battering is the leading cause of pregnancy complications.

Domestic violence is the leading cause of homelessness for women and children.


Finally inthe closing paragraph she writes "As women, we have the power to accept domestic abuse or stop it now."

The Rak

 

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