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Author Topic: Child Ditches Me - Cops Are Barriers  (Read 6015 times)

ilovemysd

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2006, 09:20:57 AM »
>>and your sarcasm is noted and will be ignored.
>>
>>Mainly because it seems as if you'd rather complain here
>than
>>take action.
>>
>
>I appreciate your responses but they have not answered the
>questions about abuse of the process.
>
>I sincerely believe that causing people to return to court
>over problems that should have been forseen is a disgrace to
>everyone, especially to those they claim to protect.

Actually, she is answering your questions.  The abuse of the process is the disgrace, and it is something that each and every poster at the site has dealt with.

Judges sign unenforceable orders every day.  Sometimes it is because they expect people to behave like grownups, sometimes it is because lawyers write up bad orders, sometimes it is because they just don't care.  Judges are not mind readers, and cannot predict that someone will argue over a preposition in an order, or that a situation that was not anticipated in the original order will develop.  They have next to no statutes which actually deal with what they are to decide, and therefore are left without a policy, without a procedure.

Our orders say that ncp has phone contact w/dd two specific days a week, starting at a specific time, and states that dd must pick up telephone and talk to ncp.  Of course, there is nothing in the order saying that dd should be at home for the call, in a quiet place where her family members are not interrupting her, telling her to get off the phone, where there aren't distractions that are more fun than talking to ncp.  We've called and had them be out to dinner at Friendly's, out shopping for a new coat, at the movies with friends... The order is straightforward, but doesn't provide for cp to play games if she wants.  

Order says ncp is to have dd EOW.  So, the police know what every other weekend is?  Sure, the order says EOW, but it could be from three years ago, with mutual agreement make-up time included, so how do the police know whether the EOW is still the way it was at the signing of the order?  

Vacation time is almost always arranged between parents with given amount of notice... how do the police know what the entire path of correspondence was?  So, you've got a letter stating your intent to exercise... how do they know that you're not hiding a letter you sent that says you changed your mind?  That you request another date...?  The only way to find out is to knock on your child's door and question the cp... now you've got your kid square in the middle of a situation, the kids get the idea that cops are there to tear them away from the families, and that they are the bad guys...

Trust me, as a sm whose sd was kept from the family for 6 months on false allegations of mental (not physical) abuse, I understand how frustrating it is to go to police and not have them enforce an order that seems to be straightforward, but they are there to protect all parties, ncp, cp, and children, and it is close to impossible for them to do that when they have make value judgements on what is right and what wrong...  a police officer is there to keep the peace.

The answer to your questions is not to moan about how wrong the system is, the answer is that you need to file a motion to clarify everything that you are having problems with.  The police have told you that they cannot easily enforce what you are showing them - come back with something better.  They have told you how to help them help you and you steadfastly refuse to do it, instead arguing about how they _should_ do what you want them to...

So, you have options... file the motion, contact your legislators, and seek to improve the system.  This is what the people here have chosen to do... they do not sit on their tushes complaining about how life is unfair... while you do that, your kid, and all of our kids, suffer.



Samson2005

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #21 on: May 25, 2006, 01:25:02 PM »
how vague is this: "Father chooses four weeks of the summer break and notifies Mother in writing by May 15 each year." that is how summer beaks are decided. When I choose the first week of june, last week of june, first week of july, first week of august. Is that being vague? When I miss thos times, they refuse to enforce it.

MixedBag

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #22 on: May 25, 2006, 05:08:33 PM »
Because how is a cop supposed to know that she received the notification?

You have too many documents to put together and then how is the cop supposed to know that you're working off the most recent order?

Go back to court and file a motion to show cause for missed time with your children.

When you don't get your time this summer after notifying mom, file another motion for missed time and make up time.


smtotwo

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #23 on: May 25, 2006, 07:05:52 PM »
DH's order is VERY specific.   Right down to pick up and drop off times.

Guess what??  We havent seen his kids for 5 FIVE 5 weeks.  

Mommy dearest moved AGAIN, 3rd time in last 12 months with no notice to DH.  

We cant even have her served papers for contempt because we  dont know where she is!!

Samson2005

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #24 on: May 25, 2006, 07:46:21 PM »
<"Because how is a cop supposed to know that she received the

Your opinion of the police's duties are VERY blurred into the judge's.

With an approach like that, EVERY rule and law could easily be broken "legally."  

If our police interpreted every law that way, this could be an unsafe place to live.



smtotwo, You are in my prayers.


MixedBag

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2006, 07:37:44 AM »
point is that this original poster needs to file in civil court and do something at this point.

He's saying that the cops should/could enforce his order because IL statutes cover this....but his order isn't specific.

Most cops won't enforce and keep divorce which is civil separate from their duty which is to enforce criminal.

As for your situation, if there are kids, aren't they in school?

And there are procedures in most jurisdictions in place to still proceed.  If I remember correctly, it takes longer and it involves posting a notice in the newspaper.  But as Soc, he's always the best person in this area.


maid marion

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RE: O.K., NOW you're getting real argumentative
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2006, 07:40:22 AM »
This is a really long string and I hope I took it all in and recall it all properly as I write this.
Quick background. We had jointustody with placement of our child with him. I had a more stable work history than him so I went back to work after she was born. 1 year into it though, things got real tight finacially. I was working 50-55 hours a week to pay his child support to his 1st ex, paying his attorney fees while he fought with her in court, supporting a household of 4 here at home and supporting his other 3 children when they were here which was quite often. I for a year I asked him to get a part time job to help out but he refused. Needless to say he ended up with placement of our child in the divorce because he was considered the stay home parent not me.
After the divorce I put up with 2 years of him bullying me around and doing whatever he damn well felt like doing. Each time I asked myself....is what he's doing having a negative impact on our child?
A few examples......
He made me provide all transportation to and from visits. Fair? Absolutely not. But It gave me more time with my child,as I knew that I would be gettting her at the right time each visit.(Not sitting around waiting for him to take his sweet time to drop her off) No negative impact.
Enrolled her in preschool against my wishes. I wanted to wait 1 more year so she was a bit older and could tell us if she was being abused or neglected. No negative impact. Education is a good thing.
Refused to let me go to her doctor visits with them. No negative impact. I just called the doctor periodically and got a report.
On and On for 2 years.
Then he started to get out of control.
Attempted to cut into our time together. Negative impact? you betcha! took him to court and won.
Switched her schools because he couldn't get along with the staff. Negative impact? Yup! Took him to court. Judge said put her back where she was.
refused to allow me to be her daycare provider when he wasn't available. Negative impact? Damn right! No need for her to be with sitter and rack up child care expenses when I, her BM am available. Took him to court. Judge said I could be her daycare provider.
On and on he went and on and on I took him to court if I felt that his actions were affecting her negatively.
Eventually he tried to move to another state and the jugde said no. He left anyways and now I have sole custody and he is in prison facing felony child snatching charges.
The point is this.........Don't waste your time and money going to court if what's happening is only impacting you negatively. We all know that lifes not fair so why waste effort time and money trying to make it fair. Eat the principal bullet and go on.
But if what is happening is impacting your child negatively then get up off the couch and find some resourses and try to stop it. Even if you can't your soul will rest easier knowing that you tried to right a wrong.
Keep looking at your child and as long as she/he is smiling back then things are o.k. no matter what in justice has been done.
Good luck to you all,
Maid Marion

Samson2005

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Mixed Bag, Please do not respond to this.
« Reply #27 on: May 30, 2006, 02:04:22 PM »
Mixed Bag, I hope you do not respond to this because you have been diluting this thread with nonsense from the beginning.
_________________________________________________ ________

My order is specific about me making the schedule for the summer. That schedule is to stand as the summer schedule. This has happened before and I have gone to the police with the statute "Unlawful Visitation Interferrence", the Court Order, and emails stating denial of visitation, with no result other than a written report.

This year, I again made the schedule and delivering it on time. I recieved the email of denial from the mother saying that I can not have our child because of other plans.

They have plans for the entire summer and I may see my child it becomes convenient for them.

There is a remedy to this in the criminal statutes.

I have gone the civil route for 10 years while unaware of the criminal remedy. Obviously the civil route has allowed this Interferrence to continue this long.

My order is NOT vague about summers. Civil court has not provided any relief after 10 years of trying. There is a criminal remedy on the books, but it is diluted and ignored.

Can somebody give me advise about how to stop this interferrence? Or, if I can't have my child when I am supposed to, help me understand how to recover damages that have happened.


maid marion

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RE: Mixed Bag, Please do not respond to this.
« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2006, 05:51:14 PM »
Don't know if it's a viable route but you could look into sueing in civil court for pain and suffering or maybe breach of contract. Probably a long shot but if you brought all your evidence from the last 10 years it might have some weight.
Good Luck,
Maid Marion

MixedBag

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Go ask Socrateaster your question
« Reply #29 on: May 30, 2006, 06:32:11 PM »
and see what he says.

You're looking for the correct legal avenue and he's our resident legal expert.

 

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