question for jurro

[tulip]

I have read some of your posts referring to a communication notebook. I think this would be a good idea for my dh to try with his ex, so I wanted to know how it works for you. Is the use of it written into your parentin plan? Are there any rules about removing pages from it, or has this ever been a problem? Do you use a spiral or loose leaf notebook? Is it exchanged when your children are exchanged? Do the kids bring it back and forth, or do you hand it to her personally?
My dh is working on setting up a joint custody agreement, but would like as little personal contact with bm as possible. He doesn't want to talk to her unless he absolutely has to.

[jurroppi1]

"I have read some of your posts referring to a communication notebook. I think this would be a good idea for my dh to try with his ex, so I wanted to know how it works for you. Is the use of it written into your parenting plan?"

In a word, yes. But in all reality, it is in one of the numerous court orders in regards to our case.

"Are there any rules about removing pages from it, or has this ever been a problem?'

No, there are no set rules about the notebook per se. The order basically states that it is to be used to communicate items of interest or importance, or something to that effect. There hasn't been any problems on my end with pages being removed, if I write something important, or there's something in there that the ex wrote that I know I want for evidence, I copy it with my scanner immediately. So, even if a page or more was to come up missing, I have it all on CD. I would suggest anyone that using a notebook like this, should spend the 100 bucks or so to buy a decent scanner and learn and understand how to use it effectively!

"Do you use a spiral or loose leaf notebook?"

We started out using a notebook with the perforated pages, but left them in there, but that has its own set of problems - numerous pages start to rip out simultaneously from simple day-to-day use, etc... We've tried spiral bound also, but that's hard on the glass in the scanner, so I prefer not to use those at all, plus they have all the problems of the aforementioned type of notebook. We now use a spiral bound notebook with loose-leaf paper. The problem with them is that they tear out easier than any of them in the beginning, but that's easily remedied with hole reinforcers, it's just a tedious job.

"Is it exchanged when your children are exchanged? Do the kids bring it back and forth, or do you hand it to her personally?"

Yes, it is exchanged when pick-ups/drop-offs occur. My child brings it back and forth, we don't personally hand it to each other. I make sure my child has it when I pick him up, and when she comes to pick him up. Generally speaking, on her end, I'm sure my son has to remember it himself.

"My dh is working on setting up a joint custody agreement, but would like as little personal contact with bm as possible. He doesn't want to talk to her unless he absolutely has to."

Don't even hint that to any judge, or they'll be reluctant to award joint anything. They'll see you as the bad guy for wanting to avoid what will most likely be confrontation, but they (the judge), will see it as not being able to set aside your differences and co-parent with the mother.

 They will never see her as the cause of friction, unless you can prove by some sort of righteous measure, that mom is really the one that causes friction.

Taped phone conversations will make them suspicious of you; many judges will try to claim that you're goading her into making defamatory remarks when taping so as to use it to malign the mother in court, etc...

Bottom line: you need to be careful how you use your evidence. Generally speaking, solid documentation of visitation denials, denial of parental decision making authority/ability, and documentation of confrontational/argumentative communications between the two of you (mom and dad usually), will be more readily viewed as proper ways of documenting such things, but recorded conversations can be helpful under the right circumstances, as can a communication notebook.

In my situation, the communication notebook has more or less deteriorated into nothing more than a complaint book, so I rarely write anything in it anymore unless something needs to be requested or stated immediately, and I want it written and dated for posterity. Things like requesting changes in parenting time (since one of our most recent court orders requires written agreement to changes), and things like he needs this, or he wants to do that.

I'm sure you get the gist.

[tulip]

Okay, thanks for the info. I assume that you child or children go back and forth pretty frequently, for that to work. What we were trying is Sunday to Sunday, so it would work for listing appts and such, but day to day things would mostly have to be over the phone, I guess.

I think the joint custody idea is falling apart. DH is most likely going to end up back in court, going for full. They had court on the 10th, when they both told the judge that they were agreeing to joint 50/50, and would go to mediation to work out all the details. The judge said "great, joint custody it is then. Go to mediation and work everything out." Told dh's atty to draw it up and get it signed. We just got the order from him yesterday. We're pretty sure xw isn't going to sign it, and she cancelled the mediation appt, which was on Wednesday.

I just thought if they could use this notebook to communicate mostly, she would be calling and ranting and raving a lot less. I'm kind of concerned about the kids bringing it back and forth though, because if she used the notebook for her lunatic ranting and raving, they might read it and be hurt by it. (Not that I don't wish they'd figure out what a nut-job she is, but I really don't want them caught in the cross-fire, if you know what I mean.)

[jurroppi1]

It looks like about tge only way to deal with the day to day stuff that needs to be communicated is to either deal with her directly, or to make her wait / deal with whatever it is yourself at the time of the occurrence. Generally speaking, joint phsyical placement would more-a-less require that anyhow (parental decision making authority when the children are in your care, and likewise when in her care for her).

It's pretty well impossible to do otherwise, especially when things are as acrimonius as they seem to be. Believe me when I say this; I understand your pain!

As far as the kids seeing her rantings, you could ask the judge to order that the children also be allowed to write in it if they choose, this way she will know of the possibility they might read it. If she goes off the deep end while writing something in the notebook, then I guess she'll have no one to blame but herself if the kids see it, but at least she would've been alerted to that possibility.

[tulip]

We are going back to court. The judge is not going to allow joint custody when she sees that they haven't been able to get along even long enough for this order to get signed. This is pretty scary, because now dh has to go for full custody, or leave things the way they are, which is not acceptable. She is definitely going to fight him in any way she can, this is going to get ugly.

As far as the kids seeing her rantings, see we are the only one that care about her ranting in front of the kids and hurting them. She WANTS them to see it, because in her twisted mind, she thinks she can just blame dh for "turning her into this". She is unbelievable.

She blew off their mediation appt last week, and the very next day called dh and told him she had reserved tickets for her and the kids to fly to AK on Xmas day! She begged him to let her take the kids, after the judge had already told her she can NOT take them on Xmas. She's been pretty much insane ever since. Now the kids are here for the week, thank goodness, so they don't have to be around her anymore for awhile.