PAS and turning against the programmer...?

[mango]

I keep hearing and seeing some posts that when a child has been PAS'd they eventually switch gears on the programmer in the teens and start asking lots of questions.

I am curious and interested in folks stories or experiences who have had this happen to them, and I 'd like to hear some more about it. Sorta the whole Karma thing.

About what age do they start seeing it?

What if they are totally enmeshed can they break out and individuate from programmer?

What if the programmer is scary and really good at programming?

What if the programmer parent lets them do whatever, will they want to go to the stricter parent's home if they can get more with the programmer. Afterall teens do tend to be me-thinkers.

Anyone with any experience with some of the above, please post your experience.

Thanks!

[Ref]

When I was 12 my parents sat me and my older brother down and told us they were getting a divorce. I was 12 and my brother was 15. He saw it coming and I didn't. Needless to say, I was devistated. My brother went to boarding school so it was basically me and my mom dealing with this stuff (my sister was still a baby and clueless). I became my mom's best friend and my sister's second mom. My mom checked out for a couple of years. She wasn't a raging alcoholic but she did drink heavy stuff on a regular basis. She was so depressed that she would shut herself in her room and I would clean and cook and do all the "mom" things.

My dad disappeared for a while. I would see him every few months for a weekend. To be honest, he was never really hands-on when they were together and he often was away because of work.

My mom went from depression to anger. When my dad would send flowers for a choir concert I was in, she would criticise them. He was late often and she would always make a point of mentioning how thoughtless he was. She became more and more venomous as the years went on.

Later, I found out what had been bothering my mom for years. My mom told me that my dad was a "fag". My mom was never homophobic. Her cousin who we were raised around was gay and we never had any problems. Ever since then, she became horrible. Everytime a gay actor would be on tv she would call him a fag. She always commented about my dad in a negative way. I started buying it. I believed that he had hidden cameras in our house. I believed that he didn't trust me enough to tell me he was gay. I believed that he abandoned us. I believed that he was sh*t. When I was 16 I decided not to talk to him any more than I needed to.

I started realizing, shortly after that that my mom lied all the time. I would catch her trying to spin things. Not just about my dad and his family, but also about my friends (she was jealous about them too). Noone was good enough. I had horrible fights with her. I became a delinquent. I hung out with kids that went to jail, I did drugs, I drank and I had sex.

After I was kicked out of my mom's house at 17, I had lunch with my dad. He mentioned very matter-of-factly how he wanted to come out to me but my mom thought I was too young. It just made sense. It made much more sense then the tales she told me. After that, I started listening to him and questioning my mom's stories. It took a while, but at about 21, I think my reationship with my dad became very close and my realtionship with my mom went south. When I was 30 I was able to tell her to stop bad-mouthing my dad. Ever since I stood up to her things have been great.

I have been battling with my step-daughter for years to get her to think on her own.

[Sherry1]

BM is a habitual lier.  She told the skids I was a loser, a moron, stupid, etc., and they did not have to respect me when in my home.  She actually encouraged them to act up.  I knew this was going on because this is stuff that 7, 8 & 10 year olds hatch on their own.  They also had a lot of disrespect for DH and they mocked him and me behind my back.  This went on for years.  We live 5 1/2 hours from the skids so we only had summers, spring break, etc.

SD met a guy when she was 14 and he was 17, BM should have forbade that relationship, but I guess she just figured that SD would have sex, get it out of her system and break up with this guy.  BM badmouthed this guy to DH all the time and said what a loser he was, bad for SD, etc.  Since we lived in a different state so we couldn't see for ourselves.   Then SD's BF went into the military when SD was 15 1/2, and at that point, SD broke up with him, basically because her mother forced her to, and he was leaving anyway.  They were apart for 1 1/2 years and he returned when she was 17.  They immediately got back together and have been together ever since (SD is now 19).  BM badmouths and lies about this guy constantly around SD and even badmouths him to his face!  The sad thing is?  This guy is a really good guy!  He takes good care of SD and loves her to pieces.  SD has realized that her mother is a habitual lier, is unhappy and degrades almost everyone she meets.  SD has stopped buying into her mother and has apologized directly to DH for her behavior during that time and has told me she was sorry that she didn't see things for herself.

BM married someone who is more verbally volatile then she is and he started mistreating my SS's (15 & 16yo), both verbally and YSS physically.  She just stood around and let it happen.  We had to hire a lawyer and threaten her with court but she finally let YSS come live with us.   YSS told me that his mom was his mom and he will always love her, but he has lost all respect for her and there really wasn't anything she could do to win his respect back.

My belief is that eventually as the skids get older, they start seeing through the PAS, at least in our situation.