To go to trial or not? All Opinions Welcome

[backwardsbike]

Hi All--All opinions are welcome

I have four children.  Two that I see only EOW( DS1,15 and DD1,12) and two living with DH and I full time( DS2,6 and DD2,2)  So I am both a CP mom and an NCP mom.

The kids who only visit have been having a real hard time lately.  DS1 is suffering mild depression.  DD1 is lying and stealing.  Both are starting to have issues with school.  My relationship with both is suffering due to the long separations.  As well as difficulties with telephone access in CP's home.  Where once we were very close now we have drifted apart to the point that I feel less like family and more like an inn keeper.

The children now lie without batting an eyelid. They are disrespectful. They are not the children they once were.

CP frustrates my legal custody and is very disrespectful to me in front of the children and others.  He blocks mt access to school and medical info as often as possible.  In short I feellike I am no longer a parent.  Or more precisely that if things continue as they are I will loose the kids forever.

I lost custody after 22 months of joint 50-50 due to my DH going to jail for a probation violation.  He had had a long legal history before I knew him.  He has since been clean, sober and out of legal trouble for 5 years.  

The CP knew of his history and had no problem withit while he was dating and his new wife was working long swing shifts.  He let me have the kids for daycare and sick and snow days.  We never had a problem.

That was until the property settled and I moved to a different school district.  Att he time both kids were in school in this district where I purchased my home due to being enrolled in a private school.  At the same time I bought my house the CP's new wife lost her job and wanted to care for the children.  That is when my custody nightmare began.

My question now is do I fight for Primary custody knowing that DS1 is angry at being dragged into court all the time?  I have almost no relationship with him now and fear if the status quo continues I will loose touch with him all together.  DD1 really is aloof as well.  She doesn't even remember livng with me.  Both kids told a custody evaluator they "wanted things to stay the same"  then both admitted they lied and witheld info from the evaluator.

I feel really torn.  I worry about the children both physically ( CP does not believe in docotrs and will give OTC meds instead of taking to doctor) and mentally.  Yet I know there is a real possibility that I could go through a trial,  upset my kids even more and loose anyway.  

I know there is a lot of wisdom out there among all of you.  Please help.

[joni]

Given their age, I don't think you just gaining custody will solve any problems.  Your family could benefit from family counseling.  You have to sort out whether your son's depression is psychological or medical.  Also, you'd need to address your daughter's stealing.

I think that should be your first step towards custody is emotionally healing these children.  Your Ex should be part of it as well as it would be family counseling.  Alot of issues could be addressed in this scenario, including his interference.  One result may be your gaining an advocate in this counselor in order for the counselor to recommend that you have custody.

[backwardsbike]

Hi!  My ex will absolutely NOT engage in conversatiom with me let alone counseling.  The Judge will not order him to either.  

We have had a rather pathological set up where the kids were seeing an individual therapist of dad's choosing.  He would not work with me.  He continually sided with the dad as that was who was paying for him.  He broke the kids confidentiality and shared everything with BD abd SM would not even allow DH into his office space and told me never to bring him back.

MY DH, me and all four kids see an art therapist once per month for family therapy.  BD has threatened to sue her if anything at his house was discussed by the children in therapy.  She refuses to really work on any individual issues with the kids or to do any work with BD/kids/me because of her fear of him(legally).

Way back at the begining we had a mediator who was an MFT.  She was great and the kids did really well.  At first custody eval BD claimed she was biased toward me because she believed me when I told her things and the kids liked her and were not afraid of her.  Anyway, that first evaluator got rid of this therapist just by saying she was biased.  Since then dad has had complete control.  I later learned from the mediator that this evaluator had had her removed form our case for bias without ever having spoken with her.  The mediator was also threatened with legal action by BD abd refused to be involved in any capacity with any of us again.  She told me, " Just tell your kids they can come and see you anytime it is mutually convienitt because BD has people hepling him and you will loose your time, money and sanity if you fight him"  I have been wondering if she was right.  Oh, did I mention that the threapist on dad's payroll was placed on our case by this first evaluator?

I don't see any chance of any emotional healing as long as these kids are exposed to this type of control and brainwashing.  I hope by having them with me I can at least keep them from having to hear every detail of the court proceedings.
  I worry for thier mental health every day.  They will say and do whatever SM abd BD tell them to.  They told the last custody evauator they were afraid of Dh.  he did a home study and confirmed they are definitly NOT afraid of him.  Yet he declined to list PAS or to change custody in any way.

I feel very beaten down right now

[joni]

Then it looks like a custody challenge is the way to go.  But if the judge won't order family counseling, how open do you think the judge will be to change custody based on undiagnosed mental issues?  It's a nasty catch 22.

[shawneetears]

It is a tough descision to make. As yourself this....are you prepared to lose? You have to be very careful what you ask for.  I know you have been documenting.... you are going to have to have very specific incidences of CP not doing a good parenting job....and proof of adverse affects...  If you can find an attorney that is versed in PAS you will stand more of a chance but that is going to be difficult at best.
You have said that DS1 is angry and both kids have lied before.....it is quite likely they will do so again either to get back at you for "putting them through this" or just to appease BD.
I really hate to discourage you; I know you love your children and are only trying to keep a relationship with them.  And going to court is probably the only way to change this situation at this point but are you prepared to deal with things if they don't go well?
Maybe instead of primary you need to focus on shared physical custody....a modification...  then other issues can be addressed... DS1 might not be as threatened if you explain that because you and BD can't seem to come to an agreement that you are going back to court to get things clarified....
As to counseling....  I dont' know what your religion is but sometimes pastors/reverands/ministers...etc will offer counseling to families in crisis...and this sure seems to qualify.  Don't look at it in regards to being able to use it in court...just a way to turn around the children....  Just a thought.
Like I said...it's a tough choice... give it alot of thought.
wish you all the best life has to offer!  :)

[backwardsbike]

Hi Everyone!

Hope all of you are ready for the holiday.  I also hope everyone who can see their kids have the best t ime possible and that those who can't see their kids can find peace and contentment somehow.

I have continued to reflect upon all of the advice you all have so generously provided.  God, I wish I had the wisdom of King Solomon.  But I am a mere mortal and a NCP mom with a broken heart so I am about the least objective creature God made.

My attorney tells me the Judge will not order any conuseling for the family or even for BD and I.  I had thought Joni's idea was they way to go but this Judge never seems to do what makes sense then crys from the bench, "You people take up too much of the court's time."  It is really frustrating!

A modification would be great.  I would seek more parenting time with the kids.  In NOvember and now this month I end up with them three weekends in a row.  Things with the kids are starting to improve slowly.  I honestly beleive it is just due to the extra time.  However, my attorney tells me that I have to have a full custody hearing just to get a modification.  This is my conudrundum.

I am seriously afraid to make things worse with the kids again so soon after the custody eval this summer.  As soon as BD gets wind of any court action the PAS will escalate again.  But if I do nothing then nothing will change.  After Christmas I will go back to only seeing them four days per month and our relationship will again suffer as it does when they are gone for long periods.

My goodness, the hardest thing ( except for missing my kids like crazy) is having to accept that BD PAS the kids, disobeys court orders, lies. maipulates. seeks out every loophole in the order and gains from it everything he wants and gets away scott free with all of it.  Meanwhile my relationship with the children sufferes.  Their relationships with their half- sibs suffers.  And the court turns a blind eye to all of this.  And on top of that DS1 is starting to do that whole anti-social loophole finding in order to gain thing just tlike BD.  Very unhealthy IMHO.

Yes, the kids will be angry if I choose to go to court.  But they will be angry in part because he will again make life unbearable for them.  In short then I am prevented from going to court by the very thing I want to go to court to protect the children from.  This is a hellish place to be.

My attorney thinks I have a decent case as there is alot going on that is contrarty to "best interests of the child"  I have multiple experts who can testify for me and are willing to do so.  But I am worried about the effect on the children.  And we all know that going to the Judge is a crapshoot at best.

I feel my best option would be "open" mediation but of course they don't do that here.  That is the story of my life.  This county will go on and on about how it has never seen a case as difficult as mine before but will try no novel ideas no matter how much sense they may make.  

Yes, I'm venting.  It is just unacceptable for me to have to just pay my support and the go away and shut up when I feel my kids are being harmed by thier CP's actions and lack thereof.  And being denied reasonable access to me.  If anyone has any ideas for me please post them.  I do appreciate each and every response.

[backwardsbike]

Hi Everyone!

I want to thank all posters.  Your advice has been so helpful.  Ihave decided not to fight anymore.  I just don't think I have a snowball'schance in hell.  The Judge thinks Dh is a sexual offender.  Even though he has a copy of DH's clean child abuse background check.  Seems delusional to me but this man gets to make ll the decisions in my life and that of my kids.  The first custody evalyator place such restictions on DH that it took almost three years to undo them.  He was at first not allowedon the property when the kids were here.  I wasn't allowed overnights.  Then he was allowed in thier presence but needed supervision by me.  Then could be with them for only one hour unspervised.  Now all of that is gone and he is just like any other step dad except that we cover our backsides as ex likes to make false allegations and we are waiting for him to play the trump card.  

SO we will not fight.  My children will never again live with me.  They will continue to be PAS by SM and BD and these people will use the court orders to malign us and to abuse me every chance they get.  They system won again!

Good luck to all of you in your respective fights for time with your children.  If you ever want to know what not to do drop me a line.  If anyone knows how to move on from this I am all ears.

[backwardsbike]

Hi Everyone!

I want to thank all posters.  Your advice has been so helpful.  Ihave decided not to fight anymore.  I just don't think I have a snowball'schance in hell.  The Judge thinks Dh is a sexual offender.  Even though he has a copy of DH's clean child abuse background check.  Seems delusional to me but this man gets to make ll the decisions in my life and that of my kids.  The first custody evalyator place such restictions on DH that it took almost three years to undo them.  He was at first not allowedon the property when the kids were here.  I wasn't allowed overnights.  Then he was allowed in thier presence but needed supervision by me.  Then could be with them for only one hour unspervised.  Now all of that is gone and he is just like any other step dad except that we cover our backsides as ex likes to make false allegations and we are waiting for him to play the trump card.  

SO we will not fight.  My children will never again live with me.  They will continue to be PAS by SM and BD and these people will use the court orders to malign us and to abuse me every chance they get.  They system won again!

Good luck to all of you in your respective fights for time with your children.  If you ever want to know what not to do drop me a line.  If anyone knows how to move on from this I am all ears.