For those of you who won or even lost custody, a few questions

[whippertizzy]

After reading a thread on the mothers without custody board, I was wondering if a few things were true.

I noticed a few people said they either lost custody because they did not have the money to pay the lawyers fee's, or that they won custody because they had money to keep paying for the lawyers fee's . Does money really have that much more to do with custody battles as opposed to the well being of the child/ren?

I could see how it might have something to do with it if one parent had more money than another parent, but is that the rule? She or He with the most money wins?

And what about the well being of the child? How much does that REALLY factor in, and what is considered in their best interests? I am seeing alot of grey area's that I don't even know if it matters or not. Such as education, who the children are surrounded by, how the CP is taking care of them versus how they could be taken care of. I guess I am rambling now but I would really like your opinions on this.

[DecentDad]

Hi,

It's important to understand how family law works if you're about to enter into custody litigation.

First, keep in mind that the mother's attorney is bound by law to advocate for what the MOTHER wants.  The father's attorney-- same deal.

So, each attorney is going to try to convince the court of what each PARENT wants, and argues the perspective of each PARENT's idea of best interest for the child.

Because there are many tactics and strategies that can be employed by attorneys, an attorney with a large budget will have a better shot at convincing the court than a layperson with no budget.

In terms of what "best interest" means, that in itself isn't defined by what a layperson may consider.

There is a threshold that each parent must beat to be a "good enough" parent.  A good enough parent is one who knows that kids need to eat, sleep, get dressed, and attend school.

The court isn't going to quibble over which parent is BEST, but it will probably first ask itself, "Has the child been living primarily with a parent who is 'good enough'?"

Then it may ask, "Has this parent been letting the kid see the other parent reasonably?"

If the answer to those questions are YES, then it doesn't really matter how much better the second parent may be.

Status quo carries much weight in these decisions.

If there is no real status quo, or if the status quo is not in a parent's favor; then such parent will likely need a huge war chest to convince the court that his/her perspective is the right one for the kid.

DD

[hisliltulip]

Ok, with DH and me we have three scenarios...

OSS - There was some fight between Mom and Dad on who should be custodial parent.  Neither were making any headway, because there really wasn't anything "wrong" with either parent.  Therefore, they finally settled to split custody 51% BM, 49% BD.  Dad paying child support and helping in daycare costs.

DS - There was some fight between me and Ex.  He spent about double what I did, but I ended up with custody.  Basically because he has (documented) mental issues, and left the state when ds was 3 months old, not returning to see ds until his first b-day.  And, we settled, never went to trial.

YSS - Was a pretty messy battle.  And yes, our attorney bill came in pretty high.  BM did not pay for anything as she had a lawyer from financial aid.  HOWEVER, money is not why DH won custody.  He won because BM would abandon SS for extended periods of time, and then hide him from DH for extended periods, she ignored the custody evalutator for weeks, did not feel that she had to follow the temporary court order, became hostile on the stand, and admitted to using meth since SS's birth...  etc. To be perfectly honest, had she tried a little harder, DH would never have won, no matter how much money he threw at the problem.  

And, he didn't really "win".  Yeah, he has physical custody, but her visitation has her at almost the same amount of time with child.  Which would normally be ok, but this child is quickly going down hill, feeling split in two.  BM badmouthes DH to ss consistantly, "Daddy is a liar, don't ever trust him."  "I love you more than anything, don't you love me more than Daddy?"  "Daddy is an asshole"  "Daddy is so mean to me, he always makes Mom cry"...  

He is having difficulty in school because of the visitation schedule.  He needs more stability than what the Judge ordered.  But, DH is bound by the court order, and hopes that some day life will settle down for YSS.


Now, I am not saying that the women on the Mothers' board are not being truthful.  I am just giving you insight to our battles.



:-)

[Peanutsdad]

In my case, the war chest wouldnt have really mattered, but it helped anyhoo.

There were just too many documents going against her ,,,,police reports, failure to protect, suicidal issues, and a custody eval that didnt go her way....duh.

[maxwell]

I suspect that sometimes this is just a excuse (i.e., the money thing). Like you say in the last paragraph, I would hope so also. But then again I have limited experience. However as you may already understand, people who post may not give you the 'complete' picture so there may be many other variables that end up affecting the decision.

[SLYarnell]

Why do you think the system is set up like it is?  There is a HUGE dollar amount in a "custody battle"  There is the amount that the state collects for every dollar they collect in child support awards ( hence the out of line with what the child needs support awards)  There are dozens of judges and associated court staff in each and every county in each and every state that get paid when they have a full court load.  There are lawyers, therapists, legal staff, heck even janitors that earn a living due to the number of cases currently in the system.  The more money a lawyer charges you and the longer he can make your case last the bigger car he can drive.

We spent in excess of $75,000 on a custody battle and lost to people who were not even a parent to the child.  We were planning to go back to court now on our own and were told "It isnt a good idea, we do things our way here and you cant win" We are going to do it anyway, because it is "in the best interest of the child"  but I truly believe it will be a miracle if we manage to fight the system and win.

But,  I believe in miracles so here we go once again...

[DecentDad]

How's your son doing?

Saw your post to Socrateaser.  Aside from getting the mother healthy (a long shot), it seems you and your son have been blessed with the next best option.

DD

[Wi-Mom]

Imagine the things you could do for your child with the money that you spent in attorney fees! What a shame!

When we wanted to change custody of DH's son.. he was paying full child support for both kids (his daughter and son) . For 5 months we had his son living with us and he was still paying her full child support for him until we could come up with $500 for a stipulation and order to change custody and stop the CS. She wouldn't send back a dime. We had to pay an attorney because CSE wouldn't help us .. they'd be STOPPING it.

Now.. she's got his son.. and I am absolutely certain she will get the same stipulation & order created and served free of charge by CSE's corporate counsel attorneys because it is an opportunity for them to COLLECT child support. Same order... very different price. She will not have to spend a dime.

[ChevyMom04]

Dh and I (sm)went into court fully prepared each time. With no LAWYER. We got full legal and physical custody. Bm only gets visitation if she completes child care anf anger management classes.She had a High paid lawyer that didn't do a thing for her.And she i still paying him by the hour when she calls him to complain about us. But he still does nothing for her. Everything we had on BM we prepared for a year ahead of time. Preperation is Everything.

[Lawmoe]

Money can be an important factor.

There are many, many things that canb be done ina custody case to improve a parent's chances, including hiring outside experts such as psychologists, custody evaluators, parenting consultants and more.  

Unfortunately, people generally do not have unlimited respources and that does put them at a disadvantage. Often a lawyer must figure out how to fit a ten pound case into a five pound box when considering  the client's finances.