Am I being unreasonable?

[BORN_2_B_MOM]

Hi all...
A little background:  I'm 28, first time and single mama to a 9 month old boy.  His father and I dated for all of 3 weeks.  2 days prior to my 27th birthday, he broke up with me for reasons then unclear to me. (still kind of unclear but irrelevant at this point) -I suppose.  In anycase, on the morning of my birthday, I found out that I was pregnant.   When I showed him the results of my test, he flipped.  He told me that I was on my own, and he wanted nothing to do with it.  He said he'd never get back together with me, and TOOK me back to the doctor to make an appointment for an abortion.
Obviously, I didn't go through with it.  I told him I would keep the baby, and that he should think about whether or not he wanted to be a part of the baby's life.  I left him alone. didn't pressure him, wanted him to be there ONLY if he TRULY wanted to.  and I've always dreamt of being a mom.  I was excited, so I asked him to please just let me enjoy my pregnancy.

That being said...my pregnancy was the extreme opposite of enjoyable.  He came in and out of my life.  Our interaction was limited, but PAINFUL without fail.  He was very authoritative and always used intimidation tactics to have his way.  While I was miserable in his presence, I for the most part just swallowed it all and tried to keep him close...not at all in hopes of getting back together, but in hopes that we could establish an; at the very least, civilized relationship.  --keeping the baby in mind, I told him we had 9 months to become the best of friends, but of course we fought everytime we spoke or emailed.  I've always made an extra effort and made it a priority to keep him involved/ aware/ and accessible to everything having to do with the baby, even when he's been manipulative, and inconsiderate.  I've never bad mouthed him to anyone.  I promised him that I wouldn't ever shut the door on him, and that I understood that he wasn't ready to be a dad and if at the time he decided that he couldn't be there, that I wouldn't hold it against him if he decided to come around later.
I haven't changed my mind about that.  I still always treat him with respect even though he's treated me so bad.  I even allowed the guy to be in the delivery room cuz I felt like somewhat of an A$$HOLE denying him the chance to witness his son's birth.  

Here's the problem:  While I've made every effort to keep him involved with his son from since his birth.  example: I thought he'd feel better about being around if he felt like he had some kind of tie to our son, so I named the baby after him, making his middle name same as his fathers. but, His father has by choice limited his visits to Sundays 2-3 hours for the first few months and recently increased to 5 hours.  He's very demanding about the times too...not flexible at all unless it's him making a request for change -

at 3 months, he requested that he get to take the baby on overnight visits.  
I said no.  My concerns were: through no fault of his own, 1. that he's not family oriented but as a result of that has no respect for women, 2. that he lives with 3 other guys (it's a frat-like environment), 3. The biggest reaason of all: He's got absolutely NO experience with children
I realize that it was unfair of me to judge him, but I didn't know him, and at that point any and all credibility had been lost during the pregnancy, I didn't trust him anymore.   So I suggested, that we work up to overnight visits.  I suggested that he come around more often, I offered to take the baby to his place, I asked that he take a parenting class, I even offered to take one WITH him.  all of which he thought was unreasonable. and so the threats of taking me to court began.    

He finally filed in December for joint legal custody w/ visitation, giving me physical custody.  He to this day has not taken a parenting class.  When he arrives to my house for visitation, he's disruptive of what ever activity our son is engaged in (sleeping, eating, playing...doesn't matter to him).  Our son CRIES the second he sees him now.  It wasn't as bad a couple of months ago... Our son was sensitive to him, a little fussy, but that behavior has increased as he's gotten older.  At first my opinion of this was simply that our son didn't recognize him, definitely didn't know him as his father, and that Dad really just didn't know how to comfort our son.  Now, our son cries 90% of the visit and I don't know what to do.  While I want to encourage them to spend time together, and leave the room so that they have time to themselves, it kills me to hear my son so unhappy from 2 rooms away.  I'm stuck in a tough place.  I dont' want to interfere with their visit, but dads parenting skills just plain suck!   That's the first issue.  The next issue is that while dad claims to want to be able to spend time alone with the baby, he's contantly asking me for help.  "..i think he's hungry" "...how do you check if the diaper's wet?"  "what's up with him, why's he crying so much?"   "how do you put the longsleeved ones on him?" It also concerns me, that his solution to the baby crying is always to head straight to the "jumpster".   the baby used to love that thing.  -not anymore-  he yells if you even walk him toward it.    
Through all of this, my requests have only been to increase the frequency of visitation and a parenting class.
Would a judge think i'm crazy for requesting supervised visitation?  OUr court date is coming up.   -we already attempted mediation, but we failed miserably.  I suggested a step up plan and parenting class, I even offered to pay for 3rd party supervision, since now all of a sudden, he doesn't want the visits to take place in my home,  but he implied to the mediator that if I were to pay for the 3rd party, then that the 3rd party could potentially be in cahoots with me and make partial judgement on him.  So the mediator suggested he pay for it since it's his time anyway.  

Whatdoido?  I don't even know why i'm writing on here, guess i needed to vent!   does anyone think i'm crazy for suggesting that he take a parenting class and that we work our way up to overnight stays?   I mean, I've always been supportive and encouraged a relationship between the two, had he taken a parenting class at 3months, he'd be having overnight stays by now, but he's fought me on everything, and now, he's saying that he's willing to battle me for custody in court since he's got nothing to lose.  He said originally that the only reason he didn't fight for sole custody was because he "didn't have time".   and another thing, he originally and by his own accord paid $350 in CS.  then he lowered it to $300.  now that he filed in court, he's worried that CS will come up and he's been trying to manipulate me into making a deal with him on CS outside of court.  I refused.   -I've NEVER asked him for a dime, I didn't want it to be about money.  just wanted him to be around for his son.  anyway, I told him that  he changed the dynamics of this whole agreement, so he needed to deal.  I actually opened a CS case through the CSS because this month he instead of sending me a check for $300 he sent me a check for $254 without any explanation.   what the hell is he deducting???

[wendl]

You cannot force a person to a be a parent, I tried and tried for yrs to get my sons dad invovled, now my son is 12 and his dad is a little more active.

Maybe the reason your son cries so much is he can feel the tension in the room, personally I wouldn't want to be in my ex's house during vistation either, no offense to you.

Going thru a supervised place is a great idea, it is a neutural ground for all parties invovled.

Also my ex was able to take our son overnight at 5 months old, yes it was a pain as I was breastfeeding and had to pump and store enough milk for the entire weekend. He learned by trial and error, but it was easier cuz I wasn't there over his shoulder, if he needed help, he asks his own mother for advise and tips on how to sooth our child, I also gave him a so called cheat list of tricks that I did in order to calm our child down.  

Also he may not know what to do when the baby cries, but it is also acward (sp) to have to ask you for help.  In time he will learn what each cry means et.

Your really need to look at it from both side, just because you have a baby together doesn't especially after such a short period of dating, their is going to be tension.  Maybe he did want you to have an abortion maybe not, remember he was going thru things while you were pregnant too.

The key here is keep it neutural so both parents are more relaxed, hell to this day I still feel weird going to my ex's house, I am always invited in and they are always nice to me, but the tension is still there and my son is almost 13. We learn to be polite and deal with it for the sake of our son, as the years have gone by it has gotten better, now when I drop off our son and if everyone is out in the garage (like they usually are) son and I just walk into the garage say hello, I update them on things and say my goodbyes.

Best of luck.

**These are my opinions, they are not legal advice**

[BORN_2_B_MOM]

I totally get that it might be uncomfortable for him.  I get that we were both going through the motions while I was pregnant.  I know that he would never hurt him intentionally.  I guess I just want to feel that I can trust him to care for our son properly.  

As far as the baby feeling tension in the room goes...I'm sure of it. It breaks my heart the his dad only has to look at him for him to start crying.  and it's harder now, because he's starting to experience separation anxiety.   Finally last weekend, I stepped in.  He came over and I stopped him in his tracks and said we're going to do this the right way.  I asked him to sit down, and handed him some toy keys.  I sat next to him with the baby in my lap and started to talk to dad.  then slowly involved the baby saying things like "this is daddy, he came to see you blah blah blah"
What's crazy is I don't hesitate for one second to talk to the baby about dad.  I bought the baby a photo album and put photos of  him and dad in there for him to look at on a daily basis, but he just isn't comfortable with him.  dad doesn't talk to the baby. just holds him.  I thought it was because the baby couldn't really interact when he was younger, but now he babbles and laughs and crawls...I don't know what it is.  It can't be cuz he's not comfortable in my home... he sits down and has dinner with my family, he engages in conversation with everyone but I chose to go to the othe room because I don't want him to say that I'm over his shoulder all of the time.  and honestly, he's never complained about visiting at my house before now.  and that's because he made it uncomfortable for himself.  He lied to my father and said that I don't allow him to visit more often, and that's why the baby sees him as a stranger.   that's just bullshit.  luckily my father has been present when i've been with him on the phone telling him he should pick the baby up for a couple of hours during the week in addition to seeing him on sundays.      but  yeah, i guess i can't force anyone to do what they don't want to.

The reasons for me wanting supervised visitation for the first few weeks (outside of my home) is because we tried to work up to larger blocks of unsupervised time in the past.  we started at 2-3 hours, where I would drop the baby off at his place or he would pick him up.   The first time, the baby had just started on solids.  like gerber stage 1.  I asked him to stop by the store and buy him a jar of stage 1 bananas & to give him half around lunch time.   I had even peeled off a label and given it to him for reference.  When I picked the baby up from him, I asked how everything went.  He said the baby slept the entire time.  I asked if he gave him the bananas and he said yes.  He had the baby for 3.5 hours that time.  I was concerned that the baby had slept the "entire" time.  so I asked him to show me what he fed him.   He fed him an entire Stage 3 jar of bananas.   The entire thing?! No wonder the baby slept the entire time.  I was upset, but it wasn't too big a deal.  I thought...ok, a little harsh on a 3 months olds tummy, but he'll live.

We repeated those visit lengths for a couple of weeks before we increased the block of time to 5 hours.  By that time the baby was 4 months and eating a lot more.  I have the baby on  schedule.  wrote everything down for dad.  provided him with everything.  :rule of thumb, when ever I pack the diaper bag, I make sure I have a minimum of 6 daipers.  he brought the baby back, food unopened and still sealed,  (you know the powder milk dispensers that hold 4 servings?)  that thing with 3 servings in it, a full bottle, and all of the diapers!!!    5 HOURS?!!  not one diaper change, not one feeding??? a 4 month old??   I was livid.  but I bit my tongue, and waited till the following day to talk to him about it.  we talked about it. and when I asked him "looking back, knowing what you know now, can I trust you to take better care of him?"   his response was "it's not like he's mal-nutritioned, it's not like he hadn't eaten in 3 days!   I made a decision and that's all that needs to be said."  --that's the kind of stubborness i deal with.    there was no excuse.  at that time the baby was fine when he took him (as in didn't cry).  it's now that he's growing that it seems to be becoming more difficult for the both of them.

After commenting on the lack of diaper change, he insisted on having his own diaper bag.  asked me for a list of neccesities. I gave it to him.  asked me to go with him to buy the stuff so he'd be sure to have the right stuff - I did.  so now he had "some things" cuz he was only willing to spend 40 bucks on the stuff.  I figure I need to pack a bag regardless cuz he doesn't have what he needs.   like food, formula, blah blah blah...    agian, he returns the baby not having eaten.   --While I don't deny him visits.  I do deny him overnight stays, and my one request is that he take a parenting class.  but i can't force him to do anything obviously.   maybe it's unfair of me but I strongly feel that my concerns are valid.   he only wants him every other weekend and he wants him from 8am sat to 8pm sun.  

I mean obviously now I know that he and I won't ever see eye to eye.  But what sucks is that while I make every effort to keep the peace for the sake of our son, he just isn't willing to compromise EVER.  You hear all these stories, of mothers who deny dads any involvement in their childrens live and stir up nothing but drama and lies about the other parent.  I've from the beginning made a special effort to be curteous and NEVER give ANYONE reason to bad mouth dad to me or in the future my son.  I don't even tell my parents what goes on, but they live with me so they've made their own judgement.   I just wish he wasn't so calculating and spiteful.  

I've always been considerate and flexible with his visitation days, he's an active guy, does bike races and such.  Two weeks ago I asked him if it's cool for the baby and I to go out of state (needed written permission) to visit my bestfriend while he was out of the country and wouldn't be exercising his visitation anyway; he denied me the permission.  Said he wasn't comfortable with me taking the baby on a plane and didn't like the idea that I would be traveling while he was away, and that I said that he needed to give me written permission and that he would not give it to me.  then he proceeds to tell me "no I don't want you taking him out of state, and i'm not giving you permission, and if you go then you go at your own risk and I'll do my best to bring it up in court. that's all."

I'm starting to REALLY dislike him.  granted, I lost a lot of respect for him during the pregnancy and especially after refusing to give the baby his last name, and guilt tripping me into making his middle name his own, but I can't even stand it when I get that one email during the week, confirming whether he'll be showing up or not.  

It's just hilarious and annoying to me that he takes all this energy,  and threatens to take my son away through the courts, cuz he "loves him" and our son "doesn't need YOU (me) in his life to grow up and be happy" but he makes no effort to spend time with him and be considerate of his needs.

I'm glad things have gotten better for you as time as passed.  Hopefully it will be the case for me as well.  All I sincerely want is for him to be more concerned with what's best for the baby.  and to stop putting all of these walls up.   I want baby to not have to think...  I can't talk to daddy about mommy or I can't take my things to daddy's cuz mommy bought them for me and daddy won't let me.    ----I don't want the baby to ever have to chose. and that's what i see happening in the future if he continues to create such animosity between us.

[wendl]

Born,

This is just what happened with my son when he was younger, my mom, grandma and sister where over, my grandmother who I have never gotten along with asked to hold my son (now at this age 5 months my son would go to just about anyone without crying) well I handed by grandma my son and he started screaming, when my mother took him out of my grandmothers arms he stopped crying.

I talked to my sons dr about this, and he told me the baby could sense that I had ill feeling towards my grandmother, and the baby picked up on that.

So all you can do is your best. That is all any of us can do as parents. Neither parent should ever bad mouth the other parent when a child can hear.

What you consider being considerate  your ex may take it as being controlling, woman and men take the same things and look at then different or comprehend them differently.


We all say and do things that we regret, maybe this is your ex's way of getting back at your for hurting him, who knows.


**These are my opinions, they are not legal advice**

[Kboeds]

Wow!
Am I getting some vibes from your post Born.

Let me start by saying although what I am about to say may sound harsh, I would just like you to see what I hear you saying.

The things you said in your post sound like my husbands ex-wife. You may not feel that you are seriously trying to control the situation or the relationship between your son and his father but you are.

Let me show you what I mean.

Born; His father has by choice limited his visits to Sundays 2-3 hours for the first few months and recently increased to 5 hours. He's very demanding about the times too...not flexible at all unless it's him making a request for change -

It sounds from your post that most of the visits for the past 9 months have been in your home with you present.
Dad is by choice limiting his visits with you. If you are forcing him to see your son in your home then you are the one not being flexible.

Born: So I suggested, that we work up to overnight visits. I suggested that he come around more often,
I hear... I suggested he spend more time with me.
Born: I offered to take the baby to his place
I hear... I offered to make him spend more time with me.

Born: I asked that he take a parenting class, I even offered to take one WITH him
I hear... I told him he doesn't know what he is doing and that he should spend more time with me.....

Born: Finally last weekend, I stepped in. He came over and I stopped him in his tracks and said we're going to do this the right way. I asked him to sit down, and handed him some toy keys. I sat next to him with the baby in my lap and started to talk to dad. then slowly involved the baby saying things like "this is daddy, he came to see you blah blah blah"

I hear... we are going to do this my way! you will spend time with me! telling a 9 month old "this is daddy"? what is that all about??? he knows that is his daddy unless someone is telling him otherwise.

Born: dad doesn't talk to the baby. just holds him. I thought it was because the baby couldn't really interact when he was younger, but now he babbles and laughs and crawls...I don't know what it is.

Dad knows anything he says you are going to criticize him and tell him he shouldn't say or do. So he and his son are not allowed to interact with each other because you are making the visit about you and not them.

Born: I chose to go to the othe room because I don't want him to say that I'm over his shoulder all of the time. and honestly, he's never complained about visiting at my house before now.
You are still there... you are still in control, watching and criticizing.
he finally got fed up with it.

it is too long to copy here so I will just reference the visits at his home when the first time you complained that he fed the baby too much, then the second time you complained that he didn't feed the baby enough, you complained that he doesn't know what types of food/diapers to use and that he must use what you provide because you know best.

Born:  I thought he'd feel better about being around if he felt like he had some kind of tie to our son, so I named the baby after him, making his middle name same as his fathers.
Born: I lost a lot of respect for him during the pregnancy and especially after refusing to give the baby his last name, and guilt tripping me into making his middle name his own

1st you make it sound like ..Look how nice I am to this man, I named his son after him.... Then you say the only reason you gave your son his name was because he quilted you into it...
Which one was it?

Born: I can't even stand it when I get that one email during the week, confirming whether he'll be showing up or not.

Yet your going to tell us that when you hold your son and tell him daddy is coming to see him, you are not passing those same "I can't stand it " feelings on to your son?

I could probably find many more examples, but I will stop with those for now. You can't stand that this man is coming over and doesn't want to spend time with you. You pass those feelings to your son and that is why he is so tense when his dad comes over. You have caused that tension... maybe not intentionally, but you are causing it.

You tell him he needs parenting classes cause he doesn't do things the way you do them... Did you take parenting classes?

Every mention of spending extra time with your son, is followed by how he will have to spend extra time with you as well.  You need to back off and realize that this is not about you and your ex... He can see his son without you there. He can learn how to be a dad on his own, just like you are learning how to be a mom... He doesn't need you to tell him exactly how everything has to be.

As much as you say you are the one trying to encourage a relationship... I see that you are the one who is actually causing the tension.

Let dad see his son.... next time he e-mails you, e-mail him back and tell him you have plans and he needs to pick the baby up and take him to his place. Ask him if he would like you to send things for the baby or if he would like to use what he has.. If your son having a relationship with his father is as important as you said it is, then let THEM have a relationship.  
Your son may not get as many bathes with dad as he does with you, or go through as many diapers, or eat the food that you specify he has to have. His dad may parent different then you and that is okay. The more dad sees that he is able to take care of his son without having to follow your strict guidelines, he will do more.
He is rebelling against you and as immature as that may be, if you quit telling him what he HAS to do then he won't feel the need to do just the opposite.

[Stepmom0418]

That was very well said!

I can see exactly where that was coming from too. My DH's ex was doing this exact same thing from the time SS was born up untill a little over a year ago! My Dh got sick of it and took it to court. I have never been so proud of him for finally standing up for his rights as a father!

It HAS to be about the child(ren) NOT the parents!!

[Kboeds]

Thank you stepmom

I hope Born can see through the anger she will probably feel when and if she reads it.

I am a mother and a step mother. I know that if I tell my ex, my daughter is not to do something.... He will let her do it before I get the last word out. He is rebelling against me. It is not a man thing, it is a human thing. If someone tells you that you are not doing things right and that there way is the only way, you as a human are eventually going to do things your way just to show them they can't control you.
Even if you agree with the way the other person does things, your going to do the opposite just to take control away from them.

[BORN_2_B_MOM]

Thanks for the feedback Kboeds and stepmom.  I'm not angry at all.  I'm the first to admit I have issues with HIM that are unresolved.  I've tried to put thos issues aside for our son's sake, to no avail.  I can't say that I'm not part of the problem.  But I can say that I've made every effort to make him feel welcome.  When I made my first post I was very angry at him and needed to vent obviously, and because I don't make my problems the problems of my friends or family, I had a lot to say.  So I can understand why it would come across as me wanting to spend time with him (because of how you broke it down) but it really isn't the case.  

My concerns are genuine.  Dad doesn't have any family (literally) nor does he have any experience with infants.  Doesn't have any positive females or motherly figures in his life.  He lives with 3 frat boys.  Him and I are strangers. (I don't say that because I want to spend time with him, he isn't exactly a joy to be around.  I say it because I lack information and by information, i mean any information you would require from your nanny or babysitter.  the basics, home phone number, address perhaps, references (personal references)- granted -I know that I'm paying the consequences for having a baby out of wedlock, and I made a conscious decision to keep this baby knowing full well that it wouldn't be easy being a single mother- but do you both mean to tell me that you would've handed your 3 month old baby over to a stranger and without hesitation?   --I know that he's 9 months old now.  But realistically, would you have done it??  and would you do it at 9 months in the same situation?  
 just to clarify:

he's file court papers, and I think it's the best thing he could have done.  
because at the very least any judge would order that he provide me with that kind of info.  and I can almost guarantee that a judge would not be opposed to a step up plan leading to overnight stays.

about him having had visits in my home for the past nine months.  Sure. Nine  months. but he's only actually made it to 18 of thirty-something scheduled visits, I just counted them in my custody tracker.

also, about my sons middle name...  it was both.  I AM NICE ENOUGH TO NAME BABY AFTER him.  :-) :D He treated me like I was just not worthy of having met him.  Would you have named your son after someone who treated you with blatent disregard? (SURE he was going through the motions, young and not ready to be a dad, resented me for keeping the baby blah blah blah. I get that. but it doesn't make it okay..part of me thought it would be good for my son to have it, especially because I didn't know if dad was going to be a part of his life, since he seemed be be confused.   I actually wanted to name him after my best friend (male) who was with me throughout my pregnancy and also in the delivery room, but dad pleaded with me...saying..."I know I haven't been there in the past, but I'm here now..."  He actually wanted him to be "Jr".  but I said hell no to that-   I did feel bad.  I was emotional.  and he seemed very hurt when I was going down my list of names.  and my family and friends also felt bad and made me feel worse.  so I said "fuck it". and did it.  but i wasn't happy about it and he knew it.  but the point is, I did it with out wanting to.  and that's being nice in my book.

I will keep in mind when I think I'm being "generous" that I'm really just being "controlling", and I will do my best to do things differently, but that's all I can offer, my best intent.  and if things STILL continue, then I'll know that you guys were WRONG about me!!! and I'll be sure to tell my son YOU were the ones that suggested I stop helping him which will also make him think i'm being an untalkative, moody bitch!!!   JUST KIDDING!!!!!! (that's totally something he would say to me).  but seriously, thanks I appreciate your advice.

[Kboeds]

Born,
    Your question about letting a stranger take my 3 month old for overnight visits is hard to answer. No offence intended, but I would not have allowed myself to get pregnant by a stranger in the first place.

Accidents happen and people find themselves in the situation you are in right now. Point is... he is the babys father... doesn't matter if you were together 3 weeks or 3 years. This is his son as much as yours and he has every right to see him and help raise him.

I can guarantee you will not approve of the way he takes care of the baby. You will probably feel that way for the rest of your sons life. That's the way it goes most of the time in broken families.  The courts don't really care about how you feel or that you don't really know the father of your son. The courts say, the two of you created a child and it is the responsibility of both of you to support and raise him.  

My youngest who is 15 now was 9 months old when her father and I split up. He immediatly started taking her every other weekend and during holidays. My dd has a disability and she would come back from her dads every sunday worse then when she left my house. She was never as clean as I kept her, she had severe constipation every time she came home... I could go on and on.. but he is her father and although he does not do things the way I do and he seems to purposly do things that are not in my daughter best interest, just to do the opposite of what I say.. She is now 15 and she is still alive.

My point is... I have spent years disagreeing with the way dad does things but my daughter survived and will hopefully make it into adulthood. (Just acknowledging that I still have the fear that he will seriously mess her up now that she is living with him) You have to grin and bear it. Unless of course there is true abuse--- which should NEVER be falsly accused.

When dd went with bf, I knew she would come home constipated... I have no idea what he was feeding her that was causing it, but it happened every time. Telling him, did nothing but cause problems and she was not going to die from a day or two of constipation so I stopped saying anything to him. I kept stocked up on Gerber Pruns and the first thing she got to eat when she got home from dads was pruns... Within a day or so she was back to normal again.. Grin :D and Bear it.

Your ex will be required to provide you with an address, phone number, employer and such, just as you will be required to keep him informed of the same. Just remember Born... a stranger is raising his son too... the two of you will have a long life ahead of you, you can either work together and make the best of it for the benefit of the child that you both created, or you can spend the next 18 years making each others, and your sons life miserable. You and ex are the adults... you both have the power to make your sons life a positive one... use it.

I'll share one more thing before I go... I have had to say this a million times. Although this is big in AA... I am not a drinker or a drug user.. Just able to apply this to life in general.

God, Grant me the Serinity to accept the things I can not change...
(HIM)
The Courage to change the things I can.....
(YOURSELF)
And the Wisdom to know the difference....
(This is the hard one sometimes.) Your heart and your head usually view things differently.

Good luck Born and may all of you find happiness in this thing called life.
KB