Question/advise on emancipation in NY

[socrateaser]

First, you need to get the issue of lying out of your head. In court, EVERYONE LIES! The question for the court is ALWAYS: Is the lie offered as evidence that tends to prove or disprove a material fact at issue before the court? In other words, is the lie relevant (material falsification)?

If the lie is a material falsification, then you could move for contempt and ask for sanctions made payable to you. You can also use the lie to show that the witness/party has a habit of lying, and therefore, that his/her testimony should be considered suspect, generally.

But, the court will not alter the outcome of an issue before it, such as child support, simply because the other party is lying, unless the lies go to the facts and the facts will cause a finding in your favor as to the issue, which is, emancipation.

Frankly, based on your facts, emancipation is the threshold issue, because if your daughter is emancipated then custody is irrelevant and child support will not be ordered, otherwise custody and support are fair issues and the court will be forced to rule on them. Now, let's look at your facts...

>My daughter filed one petition stating that her mother is
>sending her child support payment to SCU and that I am keeping
>them for myself. I have proof that is a lie (I have hard
>copies from SCU stating my X's last payment was for August and
>that she is in arrears). In this petition, my daughter is
>asking for her mother's CS payments be sent directly to her.

If you can prove that your ex didn't pay support for which she was legally obligated, then you will be awarded a judgment of arrears, and she will have to pay. This amount may be credited against any amount that you might be ordered to pay, should a support order be entered against you. And that is ALL there is to discuss about this issue. The fact that your ex might be lying is pretty much irrelevant, in and of itself.


>Also, in re to my Xs petition - the third one, she claims she
>can give my daughter a safe home. That is untrue.

The threshold issue for custody (other than emancipation) is whether there has been a substantial change in circumstances affecting the child's best interests. If there has, then custody changes can be made. If not, then no custody change can be made.

The fact that your ex can give your daughter a safe home is irrelevant. The relevant question is: Is your home UNSAFE? If it's not, then there is no substantial change in circumstances affecting the child's best interests, and no reason to change custody. So, proving your ex's home is unsafe is a waste of your energy and the court's time. Don't go there.

>This is my X's fourth husband. He is also her second Internet
>husband. The first Internet husband turned out to be into
>teen-porn... My X didn't find this info out until after she
>married. But then again, she only knew the guy for three
>months...She eventually divorced him. So, my X is not stable.

Once again, the fact that your ex may be unstable is largely irrelevant. What matters is whether or not YOU are stable, because YOU are the custodial parent. As long as you are stable, then the court cannot change custody because there is no substantial change in circumstances.

>
>MY X also claims in her petition that our daughter has been
>"living from place to place with friends and relatives".
>That's a lie.

This is actually in your FAVOR, because it leads to the conclusion that your child has actively sought to break her dependence on you, so GET OVER THE LYING, because you may be able to use some of it to your advantage. Your PRIMARY goal is to prove that your daughter is emancipated. If you succeed -- game over -- you win all the marbles.

If your ex lies, and the lie acts to improve your case, then you want the court to treat the lie as the truth. And, people are presumed to tell the truth in court, until they are found lying, so don't go fighting a lie that helps your case just because it's a lie, because that is just plain DUMB!

Court is not about the truth -- it's not about right or wrong -- it's about one thing and one thing only: W I N N I N G ! ! !

"To the winners go the spoils" -- Anonymous

>This all started because I found drugs in my daughter's room.
>She refused to come home to discuss it. All my daughter had to
>do was come home to talk. She moved right into her boyfriend's
>home.

This could be relevant to show that your daughter deliberately broke away from your control and custody. The fact that drugs are involved is not especially material, and it could demonstrate that you are not a very good custodian, so I'd be careful about advancing this theory.

>In regards to my daughter being economically dependant on her
>parents, she had a job that was giving her 40 hrs a week. She
>quit it because "they were giving her too many hours".... She
>applied to another job, had to take a drug screening test. She
>claims she got the job, but turned it down "because they
>wouldn't work around her college schedule". The job was for
>Best Buy. They DO work around college schedules... She just
>doesn't want to work. She wants to sleep all day and party all
>night.

This is better stuff. You need your subpoena your daughter to bring all of her work records, and you need to get her to name all of her employers, then, if there are employers who she does not bring work records for, you can ask for a continuance and ask the court to permit you to subpoena the various employers that your daughter does not have records for, so that you can ascertain a clearer picture of her work record and employability.

Remember, your ONLY goal is to (1) show that your daughter is capable of supporting herself, and (2) that she has affirmatively resisted any control asserted by you as her custodian.

If the court finds either of these circumstances exist, then you WIN. Nothing else matters.

>My X just remarried and bought a $500,000 home. I live in a $75,000 home. Not because I want to, but because I have to.

A $500,000 home in CA can be a 1,200 sq ft. 3 bdrm, 2 bth, built in 1958. I recommend strongly that you do not emphasize the value of the home, unless the issue of need arises in regards to an award of equitable attorney fees against you. And, even then, unless the home has a huge amount of net equity that can be borrowed against, you'll be wasting your time.

Pleading poverty is mostly a waste of time in a child support hearing, because the court MUST award support based on your actual income or earning capacity, and you have already admitted that you have actual income and earning capacity.

You need to concentrate on showing that your daughter is emancipated. If you can't do this, you will be paying support. PERIOD. So, clear your mind and prepare for battle.

[socrateaser]

>Can I relinquish my parental rights?

No. Forget about it. Don't even bring it up, because the court will view you as trying to escape your support obligation and that is the FASTEST way to lose a support hearing. You could offer no worse testimony than your desire to disconnect yourself permanently from the situation.

You need to focus on the exact opposite, i.e., how much you care about your daughter's welfare. That makes you the preferred custodian, and even if your daughter is shown to be unemancipated, she will be ordered back into your custody, which means no child support.

I hope you're getting it. BTW, you need a lawyer.

[PaulG]

>The fact that your ex can give your daughter a safe home is
>irrelevant. The relevant question is: Is your home UNSAFE? If
>it's not, then there is no substantial change in circumstances
>affecting the child's best interests, and no reason to change
>custody. So, proving your ex's home is unsafe is a waste of
>your energy and the court's time. Don't go there.


>Once again, the fact that your ex may be unstable is largely
>irrelevant. What matters is whether or not YOU are stable,
>because YOU are the custodial parent. As long as you are
>stable, then the court cannot change custody because there is
>no substantial change in circumstances.

Ok... My daughter is 19 years old... Can my daughter decide that she wants to live with her mother? What if my daughter tells the courts that she doesn't want me to have custody of her, that she wants her mom to have custody? Will the courts grant my X custody?

[socrateaser]

>Ok... My daughter is 19 years old... Can my daughter decide
>that she wants to live with her mother? What if my daughter
>tells the courts that she doesn't want me to have custody of
>her, that she wants her mom to have custody? Will the courts
>grant my X custody?

The court will give your daughter's wishes substantial weight, but that is not the whole story. The question is whether she will actually be within the custody of either of you.

You need to try to show that this arrangement with her mother is intended to make it appear that your daughther cannot support herself, and that the reality is that your ex has coerced your daughter into living with her for the sole purpose of punishing you.

This is a delecate manuver, because you can't make it appear that you are just crying sour grapes, otherwise it will blow up in your face. You need to disect the pleadings and use their words against them. Just don't cry poverty, because that will kill you.

[PaulG]

I wasn't sure how to post an update to this post...

I went to court on Jan. 6. All three of the cases were tossed out. My ex still owes the arrears, yet now the order to SCU is cancelled. She has my daughter in CA with her. My daughter was dismissed from her community college because her GPA is now .925 because she couldn't be bothered to go to class.

Now my ex needs to have her lawyer petition the court so that she can receive child support. I was told be her lawyer "way, way, way off the record" that I may have a shot if I claim that my daughter emotionally abandoned me. Now that she lives with her mother, who constantly harasses me with bogus lawsuits, I cannot contact her. She has a cell phone, yet I do not have the number.

Since Sept. my daughter has only returned my calls when she wanted her things... My daughter hasn't been in touch with me since Dec. 14, and that was only because she wanted to remove her belonging from my home.  I was reduced to mailing her a certified/return receipt/restricted letter. It turned out that she moved to a different address and never let me know. I had to go to the Post Office to find out were my daughter was living!

Out next case in court will most likely be March (I haven't received the petition yet.). I highly doubt that my daughter will call me while she is at her mother's. Her mother is actually encouraging my daughter to have no contact with me....

Is this considered abandonment?

The only reason why I am fighting this is, as I said in my previous posts, they are two con artists. When I did not have custody of my daughter I paid my CS religiously. My daughter just doesn't want to work or go to school. She wants to retire at the age of 19...

Thank you again,
Paul