Proof of Deceit

[desperado]

While cleaning out some moving boxes after my STBX filed for dissolution, I discovered some legal notes and e-mails that prove:
 
1)  my STBX was directly coached by her attorney to LIE on 10 specific points of her declaration in an attempt to discredit me and get temporary custody of the kids  

2)  she in turn sent e-mails to 15 people and told them how to incorporate the same lies into their declarations.
 
I made copies of those notes/instructions and I have 14 declarations that are full of untruths by 14 people who perjured themselves.  Not to mention her attorney who is guilty of "fabricating evidence" and "tampering with witnesses".

My attorney says to just sit on this stuff until trial.  

I feel like I want to shout it from the rooftops and report the opposing attorney's slimy behavior and report the perjury to the District Attorney's office and get a skilled litigator and sue each and every one of these idiot people for harming me by lying to the court.  But my attorney says to just relax and sit on it.  We are just starting a custody evaluation and I think this is important information that the GAL should have.

How would you suggest that the information best be used?

[mistoffolees]

Your attorney is right. Don't say a single word to anyone. Not even your closest friend (I've learned that information has a way of finding its way back to the ex).

After everything's over, you'll have plenty of time to turn the other attorney over to the state bar and or ask that your stbx be sanctioned for perfury. But at this point, your goal should be to get the best result possible out of the dissolution and keeping that information quiet until your attorney uses it to impeach the witnesses is the best thing to do.

Don't let your desire for revenge get in the way of your real objective - getting good terms from the divorce.

[notnew]

Why wouldn't the GAL need to know about what lengths the opposition is going to to sway the court and the CE?

Presenting it to the GAL wouldn't require disclosure to the opposing side and it could be discussed and shown the paperwork during home visit. JMHO

I agree to keep mum on the information and use it as after you get your settlements.

The lawyer is violating ethics and should be reprimanded.

Perjury? Hardly likely the court will do anything in my opinion. However, Lil Kim went to jail for perjury but I think that was just a high profile case and they were trying to send a message.

[mistoffolees]

>Why wouldn't the GAL need to know about what lengths the
>opposition is going to to sway the court and the CE?
>
>Presenting it to the GAL wouldn't require disclosure to the
>opposing side and it could be discussed and shown the
>paperwork during home visit. JMHO
>
>I agree to keep mum on the information and use it as after you
>get your settlements.
>
>The lawyer is violating ethics and should be reprimanded.
>
>Perjury? Hardly likely the court will do anything in my
>opinion. However, Lil Kim went to jail for perjury but I think
>that was just a high profile case and they were trying to send
>a message.

I'd be inclined to stick with what the attorney says.

If the GAL finds out about it, several things could happen that would weaken the OP's position:
1. They could let it slip that something is up - even via innocent questioning. That would give the opposing side time to respond.
2. I wouldn't be surprised if in some jurisdictions that there's some obligation to notify the court if the GAL knows of fraud - which would again give the opposing side time to respond.

Even if neither of the above applies, there's no real benefit to letting the GAL know since the GAL can't make a decision on custody, etc. All the GAL can do is present the case to the court. When that happens the the OP shows that the GAL's recommendation was based on lies, then the GAL's recommendation goes out the window, anyway.

Even if you tell the GAL and they use that information to recommend something favorable to your side, that doesn't help you because it's meaningless until the judge rules.

There's nothing to be gained by letting the information out early and a lot of potential harm.  It's best to think of this as war. You NEVER let your opponent know your strategy in advance no matter how strong you think you are. Nor do you let third parties know unless there's some very, very strong reason to do so.

[notnew]

You are right Mist. I got caught up a little in the injustice of it all. Shame on me, I should know better. After dealing with a deceitful lawyer and ex for many years with no consequences to date, this is one of those things that gets to me.

You are right. It is best to hold this information until after the fact and use it to the best advantadge. Letting it out early will only give them an opportunity to put their spin on it and make it look like something else.

I do suggest though that if these are e-mails, if they end up using this information, they may need to supbonea the e-mail records from the service provider to prove they haven't been altered in any way. Just a thought. I have heard of cases where e-mails were accepted as evidence and others where they were not.

Thanks Mist for bringing me back to reality.

[wysiwyg]

yup keeping quiet is the thing to do, we have found that the more people you put faith in to do the right thing, the more wrongs come out of it.  Use it to YOUR BEST advantage when the time is right, and sit on it until then!

[desperado]

I talked with my attorney again this afternoon and she said that if She put the information into a communication it would have to be disclosed, however, if I "leaked" the information to the GAL it would not have to be disclosed to the other side.  

I can ask the GAL (who is a child advocate attorney) to not mention the tampering/perjury information  to the other side until we can complete the psych evaluation and investigate the abuse, change the order and make sure that my children are safe.  I have strong evidence that the Mom is emotionally and sexually abusing my son and she suffers from DID and drug abuse.  Strangely, her attorney is a flamboyant lying defense attorney who does 25% domestic relations and works the other 75% defending Baby Rapists and Drug Pushers.  (I'm not kidding).

Property and Support issues are minor.  This case is all about CUSTODY and what is the safest environment for the kids, and how can Mom be held accountable and be compelled to get treatment.

I feel it is is imperative to impeach the trustworthiness of the Petitioner Right Now when the custody evaluation is just starting.  If I can show that she willingly lied to the court (with her attorney's blessing) then I can discredit her declarations and those of her "friends" and so defuse the untruths and the further crap she is going to be slinging at me.

If I lose the GAL's endorsement at this stage, I will never get custody, no matter how many thousands I want to spend at trial.  I really feel I have to use this neutron bomb now, before she can start to build her case and heap even more lies upon me.  The gender bias in our county is extreme and Dads have a very hard time getting custody.

I appreciate your comments and advice to sit on things, but I'm a bit desperate and very concerned about my son's safety.

I think I can spin this information in such a way that she won't be able to return the serve, no matter how she tries to cover up her lies.

Desperado

[notnew]

Well, if you have faith in your attorney's advice (which he/she is right about the GAL being required to disclose if the information comes from an attorney), then you must go with what you feel is best.

We'll be praying for you and your children.

Let us know how it comes out.

[mistoffolees]

There's no right answer, but just make sure you understand the risk both ways.

While the GAL has no obligation to disclose the information if you are the one to tell him, I'd make sure that he can't disclose it if you ask for it to be in confidence.

The other side is that the longer the status quo goes on, the more likely the judge is to allow it to continue. Who has custody on a temporary basis? If she has temporary custody and if the trial is scheduled far into the future, that argues for telling the GAL.

Also, you didn't mention drug abuse and sexual abuse in your earlier message. In my view, that changes things immensely. If you have strong evidence (actually, I'd be more interested in whether your attorney considers it to be strong evidence because parents tend to be biased), then I would say that you need to disclose it to the GAL in order to get immediate action. If the evidence is strong enough, you should let child protective services know - either directly or anonymously (consult your lawyer).

One other thing to consider is that if you DON'T tell the GAL and he learns about it only at trial, is he going to consider you to be dishonest? If it were simply a matter of evidence of perjury, I think you'd be OK. But if you have evidence of sexual abuse and drug use and don't tell the GAL, I suspect you'd make him very angry and he might well consider you to not have the kid(s)' best interests at heart.

Again, I'd stick with your attorney's advice. If he's telling you it's OK to let it slip to the GAL, then I'd do so. Furthermore, I would make sure you and your attorney are completely on the same page with the sexual abuse and drug use. If you can prove it, that's your neutron bomb - not the witness tampering. If you can't prove it, they can turn it around to make it look like you're making false accusations. No one here can guide you since we don't have the facts, but it sounds like your attorney's on top of it.

Finally, be very, very careful with the way you phrase things. For example, you state "I think I can spin this information....". First, you never know if your stbx could find out that was from you. Second, a comment like that could slip out in court. You don't want to even think about spinning information with a GAL. You want to make simple, clear, factual statements and no need to spin anything- particularly since you're accusing the other side of distortions. If the facts are as you say, you should come out OK, so don't worry about spinning things. Focus on telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - even where it can reflect negatively on you.

Good luck.

[gemini3]

As I'm reading the posts I keep thinking that the GAL is concerned with the best interests of the CHILD.  For that reason, I don't think you should share it with the GAL.  I think you should sit on it until you get to court.  The reason is that, while her lawyer is slimey and deserves to be reprimanded as does she for lying and perjuring herself, it affects YOU - not the kids.  As hard as it is to swallow, I am finding that there's a huge difference between the two.  A person can treat you like the lowest piece of you know what and cause you a multitude of problems, but unless it's harming the children no one cares.  How did her actions affect the children?  They didn't, they affected you.  That's why it needs to wait until court.  

Bringing it out in court could negate all of her testimony, and the information she gave to the GAL because she will be shown as dishonest and someone who's willing to break the law in order to promote her own agenda.  After that the judge probably won't believe much of anything she says or told the GAL.  If you let it out before then you give the opposition time to run interference, and they will.  

My opinion is to sit on it.  Good luck.