Maintaining a Relationship With Kids

[speciallady]

"... unlike simply making things up which seems to be advocated by a number of people here."

I'd like to know where that came from?


"A very large number of situations involve one parent with a very high income and the other parent working for quite low wages. Whether you want to blame the low wage parent or not, the child would see a huge drop in his/her standard of living under your scenario. I simply argued that it is not intrinsically fair for the child to suffer unnecessarily. You seem to disagree."

Blame for no one--every person has the same opportunity to "better" themselves. I'd like to see stats regarding a child suffering under a split custody agreement and no support exchanged. I'd also like to see stats regarding one parent having a VERY high income and the other one quite low and by what standards are we talking about here?


You have yet to understand that stats and studies are subjective and not real proof of anything. I, like many here, go by the experiences we've had and shared--you seem to negate that as no proof. I strongly disagree.
I'll say it again--you're defending a system that seems to be working for you right now. Watch what happens when you don't meet the criteria of this system.  

[Kitty C.]

You need to stop putting words into my mouth, Mist.  I NEVER said opinion, only giving evidence of what has been told to me, either in first person or otherwise.  NONE of what I've said is my opinion and, for all you know, my actual opinion could be vastly different from the information that was given to me.

Read ALL of the information in posts........don't just pick and choose what you want.  We have a religious sect in this area whose elders only allow their flock to read certain sections of the Bible, not the whole.  And, in doing so, it skews and severely narrows their belief system.  I have found it's amazing how one's perspective can change if you only know parts and not the whole of anything.

As for the truth in studies, do you believe there's global warming going on?  There are some studies out there (that Bush has obviously taken as the absolute truth) that say no.  If you put your trust and faith into 'studies' that can be easily tampered with, I feel sorry for you.  One thing you may not know or cannot get access to, is how many of those so-called studies that say the system works fine are funded by NOW and those ilk.  They have a vested interest in the results.

Studies are like legislation..........it all depends on what PAC's and organizations are willing to put up the money to have it done, which means it wouldn't be published (or passed) unless it came out in their favor.

[frzrclan]

When I mentioned in one of my previous postings that the bias against fathers is, in part, due to the child support industry, what I ment was that the system has been using the DBD excuse to line the pockets of all involved at the expense of fathers. The reason that you have been unable to get the support you are entitled to is because of an industry that owes its very existance to discrimination against fathers. I know another father who has his kids for 10 months each year, yet HE is the one who has to pay child support!

Someone also mentioned that getting an attorney is useless. This is because even the attorneys we hire to represent us are part of the system which is fueled by both attorneys and judges. When I was in court the first time, I was expressly told by the judge, during the trial, that I would loose my case because I was representing myself and that I needed to get an attorney. Only problem was that I am an attorney and, at the time, I had numerous other clients that I was representing in family law matters. As a result, when I did get an attorney to fight for more time with my children, he did nothing for me.  

I have talked to other father's whose attorney's have been conditioned into complacency by the system. As a result, the only means of making a change is through legislation which, thankfully, some states are starting to adopt. I am starting an organization that would focus on local father's and children's rights issues but am interested in further discussion on what would be involved in a national organization as you suggest.

[mistoffolees]

>Personal attack, no?  I was challenging your ridicule.  Once
>again, not reading the sentences.  Your two cents are a poor
>investment, for they are worth nothing here...  

Nothing but more personal attacks. Thanks for proving my point.

[mistoffolees]

And, yet, no one has been able to produce a single study which shows that the system fails most of the time. If it's so easy to get the result you want, why do all the studies agree with me?

What you've given is nothing more than anecdotes - which are useless in making policy.

[Kitty C.]

You're NEVER going to find a study like that, don't you realize that?????  You'll never find one, because it means taking money out of the pockets of those who profit from it!  If someone had the time, money (and it would have to be personal, because no feminist group would want its' existance known), and especially the balls to do the research, then you could, COULD well get very different results.

Like I said, if you put that much faith and belief in studies, then you can't possibly know the actual reality of what they're even talking about and I feel sorry for you.  Those studies ONLY tell you what THEY want you to know, nothing more and nothing less.  

[mistoffolees]

In other words, your mind is closed and you'll come up with endless excuses as to why the facts don't agree with your opinions.

[mistoffolees]

>Can anyone explain my situation then? Custodial dad not be
>paid child support in over 4 yrs, yet the court has allowed my
>motion to be sitting for over 14 months. I think the system
>SUCKS and we need to fight this mockery of a court system to
>prevent this from happening to future generations. I'd like to
>see someone step up and get a national organization together
>so we can fight the court system full force.
>

Yes, the court system moves slowly in some cases.

But it's interesting that you ignore the other side of the story. How many times has your ex tried to take you back to court for custody? It seems like every month or so you're writing about another attempt on her part. Yet the court has given you custody and hasn't budged on that.

If it's so biased, how did a NCP father manage to take custody away from the mother?

[Kitty C.]

Closed?  All I've done is listen to what others have to say!  Like I said, you don't even have a CLUE as to what my ACTUAL opinion is, all the info I've given is what I've been told of true experiences of others.  NONE of it is my opinion, just passing on observations.  Excuses??  Fathers telling me what happened to them in court is an excuse?  I guess I've been living in a cave, because I or the fathers that I've talked to have never been told the court orders that were handed down to them were 'excuses'.

'In other words, your mind is closed and you'll come up with endless excuses as to why the facts don't agree with your opinions.'

Now, if that's not opinion, I'll eat my shorts............


I wasn't going to interject this, but for the children, the point has to be made.  I had an opportunity a week ago to speak to a presidential candidate one-on-one.  I will not go into who or even what party (tho the party would blow some people away, I'm sure) because politics doesn't belong on this forum.  I told this candidate that what was needed to save the children of divorce and custody battles was to ELIMINATE the adversarial atmosphere of the current family court system nation wide.  When parents know GOING IN IT that they will equally be involved with their child until age of majority (which includes being involved with the other parent as well), it eliminates the majority of the battle.  Right now, family courts have 'winners' and 'losers', but the only losers are the kids.  There should be NO winners or losers and, as long as a parent is not proven unfit, joint legal and physical custody should be the norm.

This candidate that I spoke with is very strong supporter of children and they told me they were 'surprised' that I, AS A WOMAN, would care about this issue.  Now, anyone could very easily say that was a political tactic, used to gain my support.  But I ask you all this:  that may be true, but why else would this candidate say something like that unless they actually KNEW the issues and understood themselves that the system is biased against fathers???  

More importantly, this candidate agreed with me 100% and thanked me profusely for caring about the children.  Bottom line, that's what it's all about..........

[olanna]

K,

there are plenty of political views and published books telling how the system is corrupt and falling under it's own weight.

May I suggest scrolling and ignoring?  This board may only represent a small part of the divorced population but there are enough numbers here to prove the system isn't working. (Think about the size of the population and how few people exercise their right to vote).

with warm regards,

Olanna