Joint physical custody

[Kitty C.]

.....can anyone tell me the difference between taking an infant to daycare 'every work day' and having a 50/50 split with custody, where the child only has to change location/environment 'once a week'?  Seems to me that the daycare situation would be much more disruptive to an infant than a 50/50 split would be.  And I've seen many infants thrive in daycare situations.  So I figure if an infant can handle going to daycare almost every day (and there's millions out there who do), why can't they switch homes once a week?

[knoot7]

>.....can anyone tell me the difference between taking an
>infant to daycare 'every work day' and having a 50/50 split
>with custody, where the child only has to change
>location/environment 'once a week'?  Seems to me that the
>daycare situation would be much more disruptive to an infant
>than a 50/50 split would be.  And I've seen many infants
>thrive in daycare situations.  So I figure if an infant can
>handle going to daycare almost every day (and there's millions
>out there who do), why can't they switch homes once a week?

phenominal point! A child can be left at day care between 7 & 10 hours a day according to federal disability a mother has to return to work when the child is between 6 weeks of age and 8 weeks of age. To be with a parent is MUCH different than brining them to daycare. IF the daycare is institutionalized they mayy not even get the same care provider day after day!

As stated before children are VERY versitile and can overcome adversity every step of their life as long as they have the complete support necessary.  

[Sherry1]

get joint legal and physical custody, however, likely not 50/50.  You should request 50/50 but more then likely will be awarded 60/40 or 70/30.

[Jade]

>
>>A status quo has already been set. And the status quo shows
>>that the mother is the primary caretaker.  
>
>Im not  sure what your point is.
>

My response:

The mother is already established as the primary caretaker.  And you are already established with less than 50% of the child's time.



>>And an agreement that has more time built in as the child
>gets
>>older
>
>CAn I have joint physical custody with an agreement that as
>the child gets to a predetermined age the move to 50/50 is
>completed?  It almost seems like that would be harder on an
>older child than on a baby.  

My response:

Small babies need the security and consistency of one main home.  

As the infant gets older, they become more aware of themselves as a separate individual and can handle the back and forth more easily.  

My youngest is 5 and has a hard time with the EOW, she would do better with one overnight rather than the whole week-end.  And her father and I lived together until she was almost 4 years old.  He was and still is very involved in her life.  She would not do well in a 50/50 arrangement.

My son, who is almost 8, would have had the same problem when he was her age.  Now, he would be able to handle a 50/50 arrangement if it were feasible.  Maturity and the ability to handle more comes with age.  

And it depends on how close the parents live together if it would work.  Parents who live 100 miles apart aren't in a situation where 50/50 would work.



>
>>and better able to handle the back and forth between 2
>>homes is legally binding.
>
>What do you mean by better able to handle the back and forth?
>I have been hearing things like "the baby is too young for
>joint physical" and "it would be too traumatic for the baby to
>spend 50% with the father" and "maybe when the baby is older
>and better able to handle it"   What studies are the people
>saying these things referencing?  I don't want to do anything
>that would harm my daughter but I just don't see how spending
>half of her time with me would do that.  
>

My response:

I am going by my experience with small children.  And I do have a lot.  

You can find studies that support your view, I can find studies that support my view.

The problem with those studies is that it is looking at the situation in a whole, not at the individual child.  And it is the individual child that is being asked to go back and forth between two homes.  

In my state, you would not even be getting overnight visits (unless they have already been established before you went to court) until around 2 years of age.  What you would be getting is more frequent visits during the week.

[Jade]

>>.....can anyone tell me the difference between taking an
>>infant to daycare 'every work day' and having a 50/50 split
>>with custody, where the child only has to change
>>location/environment 'once a week'?  Seems to me that the
>>daycare situation would be much more disruptive to an infant
>>than a 50/50 split would be.  And I've seen many infants
>>thrive in daycare situations.  So I figure if an infant can
>>handle going to daycare almost every day (and there's
>millions
>>out there who do), why can't they switch homes once a week?
>
>phenominal point! A child can be left at day care between 7 &
>10 hours a day according to federal disability a mother has to
>return to work when the child is between 6 weeks of age and 8
>weeks of age. To be with a parent is MUCH different than
>brining them to daycare. IF the daycare is institutionalized
>they mayy not even get the same care provider day after day!
>
>As stated before children are VERY versitile and can overcome
>adversity every step of their life as long as they have the
>complete support necessary.  


That should read SOME children are very versatile.  

Like I said, those studies don't look at the INDIVIDUAL.  

Which is what this father should be doing.  

BTW, my child did have to go to full-time daycare when she was 4 years old.

She became more clingy to me and didn't want to see her father as often because that meant less time with me.  

I wouldn't go making a blanket statement that all children do well in a daycare type of situation.  Because they don't.

And before you go saying that she was used to being home with me, she was also used to her father seeing and playing with her everyday until the separation, as well.  And yet, when it came down to it, it was the primary caregiver that she preferred.  That may change as she gets older.  

But then I am looking at the situation on an individual basis.  

[knoot7]

Infants, toddlers and small children up till they become a tween have a great ability to pick up on the vibes of the situation they are put in.  Tweens - they can actually see what is up and can choose to ignore, morph or play sides. MOST children can sense when something is wrong or there is tension in the air. They have the ability to pick up on the simplest emotion even if it is being restricted to inside instead of being displayed outwardly. They have an amazing ability to learn. If they have never known anything different how would they learn their situation was "bad"? Children learn to know what is "good" and what is "bad" even by 9 months. Children pick up their parents vibes, and can act according to how their parents react.

Do what is best for your child.  I wanted to provide you with information for two different children, in two different families that did not have or display the insecurities or have any issues with living in two different homes 50/50.  I can also provide you with many more situations of small children that have thrived. There is no need to continuously justify the statements presented to you in this situation as this was an individuals experience and I certainly do not want to push you and say your wrong for wanting to take your daughter 50% of the time. I commend you for cooming here, doing your research and doing what you know in your heart is right! I also know what you are trying to obtain is what is right for a child!

This was not a study, this is my life with my SS and my nephew's life. These children now are 13 and 6 and as stated before thrive and are more adaptable to every situation than most kids are. Children are resilient as long as they are provided for in a healthy environment and have the support necessary. I mean true support, not words or actions, but support from the heart which includes actions and words and working towards what is best for the child.  There are so many studies that state to limit the child's interaction with their father is more detrimental than trucking them back and forth! There are studies which can prove or disprove all situations.

Children are resillent to change and adversity as long as the support is from the heart and is truly believed.  I am sure you comprehend that the information provided in this thread is only the experiences of others and of course everyone is different! You are an intelligent person. This is just providing you with the hope and faith that you can obtain what you are going for. That what you are going for IS what is best for a child. Being your child is so young this is the PERFECT opportunity to make a status quo right from the start instead of changing her life in the middle and trying to get her to adjust when she is 4 or something.   You understand what was presented was specifically stated exactly the situation on two different children that did not have any issues and a "hard life" living in two homes.

The parenting plan you should go for is exacly what you are going for! Know that if a child does not know anything different and has been living in two homes their ENTIRE life - it is logical to conclude that their life IS "normal" to them!  It IS harder to change as they get older, as they become aware of themselves and their surroundings, it does make change harder - much harder!  If they never have to deal with the "change" and they only know the situation they are in - they will be completely indifferent to it!

Good luck!

[Kitty C.]

I'm not making a 'blanket statement' here.........I'm basing this on the MILLIONS of infants across the country that are currently in daycare.  Whereas you are only basing your opinion on experience with one child.  I'm certainly not basing my opinion on any studies, just the fact that millions of infants are currently in daycare.....out of necessity.  And I never said they 'do well', just that they're in daycare.  But I still feel that how they adapt can be dependent on how the parents enable the situation, whether good, bad, or indifferent.  

The thing to remember is that children ARE very resilient and can adapt to change very well if allowed to.  The other thing to remember is that the younger the child is, the easier the transition can be made.  I can almost bet that the reason for your child's reaction is strictly because of her age, because she was going through that phase.

When DS was 4 (and we were living with my mom temporarily, she babysat while I was at work), he went through a period of standing at the door and screaming for me to not leave him.  But this happened ONLY because he had just been traumatized from having his dad take off with him to CA and it taking me 6 weeks and 3 trips there to bring him back.  He was dealing with severe separation anxiety.  He had many symptoms relating to that experience that lasted for up to 2+ years.  That's an extreme example only.  But children at that particular age often go through separation anxiety, just in varying degrees and circumstances.

[topnotchdad]

Just wanted to add my 2 cents here,  there is no reason why you shouldn't ask for joint physical and joint legal custody.  Especially since you've had the baby 2 days a week since she was born.  Try to get your court date ASAP, b/c you've already established the status quo that you CAN have overnights (assuming that's what you meant by having her every Mon/Tues), and that the mother had trusted you/allowed you to have those overnights.  Don't give her the time to establish a new status quo of limited visitation in the meantime.  Make sure your lawyer points out to the judge that BM voluntarily gave you overnights with the baby.

My DH had 2-3 overnights per week with his daughter from the time she came home from the hospital.  Mostly b/c the mom either wanted to go out, or wanted to get drunk, etc.  She pulled the same stunt and tried to take it away when he tried to get things "legalized."  The judge ended up giving DH MORE time, b/c DH said he wanted 50/50, and outlined his plan, etc.  (And BTW, BM used the arguement that she was breastfeeding the child, and the judge told her she would have to pump and/or supplement (as she had been doing before.  He didn't let her use that as an excuse to prevent overnights).

And that is an excellent point, that kids go to daycare every day, and in general they aren't TRAUMATIZED by it.  Lots of babies spend the night at their grandparents house on a weekly basis, and they aren't traumatized.  It will be much easier to get this set now as a baby, then to do it when the child is older.  The other poster is right, if it's all the kid has ever known, then they will be automatically adjusted.  My DSD is 9 years old now.  She's had 50/50 legally since she was 3.  And before age 3, she was usually 2-3 nights with dad, 2-3 with mom, and 2-3 with grandparents.  She was shuffled around a LOT, and she's a great, smart, well-adjusted, normal kid.

[Che]

 b/c you've already
>established the status quo that you CAN have overnights
>(assuming that's what you meant by having her every Mon/Tues),


Actually I have not had her overnight yet.  I usually pick her up mon and tues morning around 7:30 and drop her off around 7:30 at night.  BM only withheld her one week.  She let me take my baby this past week and now wants to discuss an arrangement.   She doesn't have money for a lawyer and she does not want to borrow it from her family.   I don't want to cause trouble for her and her family but she has said that if I ask for joint physical she will hire an attorney to fight it.  After reading some of the responses here however I am even more convinced that what I need is joint legal and joint physical now while my baby is still young.  I truly believe it would be the best thing for my child.  I am considering a compromise with her that I will only ask for the 2 days a week I already see my girl until she reaches a certain age if she doesn't fight joint physical.  I need to figure out a way to explain this to her so that she will understand that this is going to be benificial to our child.  Any suggestions on what to tell her so that she goes for joint physical?  I think she just doesn't want to be without her baby at all  and that may be why she wants to fight it.  (She isn't a very good communicator so it has been hard to understand her feelings on this.)

[Jade]

> b/c you've already
>>established the status quo that you CAN have overnights
>>(assuming that's what you meant by having her every
>Mon/Tues),
>
>
>Actually I have not had her overnight yet.  I usually pick her
>up mon and tues morning around 7:30 and drop her off around
>7:30 at night.  BM only withheld her one week.  She let me
>take my baby this past week and now wants to discuss an
>arrangement.   She doesn't have money for a lawyer and she
>does not want to borrow it from her family.   I don't want to
>cause trouble for her and her family but she has said that if
>I ask for joint physical she will hire an attorney to fight
>it.  After reading some of the responses here however I am
>even more convinced that what I need is joint legal and joint
>physical now while my baby is still young.  I truly believe it
>would be the best thing for my child.  I am considering a
>compromise with her that I will only ask for the 2 days a week
>I already see my girl until she reaches a certain age if she
>doesn't fight joint physical.  I need to figure out a way to
>explain this to her so that she will understand that this is
>going to be benificial to our child.  Any suggestions on what
>to tell her so that she goes for joint physical?  I think she
>just doesn't want to be without her baby at all  and that may
>be why she wants to fight it.  (She isn't a very good
>communicator so it has been hard to understand her feelings on
>this.)

To be honest, you haven't even established overnight visits.  

You may end up going to court.  Because, even if she doesn't want to borrow the money, that doesn't mean that she won't.  Do they have mediation available in your state?  

As for a way to explain why shuffling a young baby who needs continuity between 2 homes is best, I can't think of one single argument that would get me to agree to that in a small child.

Rather than trying to get joint physical now, see if she will sign an agreement that allows frequent contact now and that will move to joint physical when the child is older and more mature.  And get a judge to sign off on that.

I would also add in a move away clause that states she needs to get your permission or the court's permission to move the child away.

Joint legal is a given in most states.