Update....

[junkyardflower]

So I get a text message from the baby's father saying I have mail at his house (Used his address for medicaid - big mistake I know.). To which I simply replied 'ok'.

About three or four days later, I get a voicemail from him saying that since I didn't go pick up the mail (which he never asked me to do nor offered to drop it off here),  he opened it.

I sent him a message stating that it is a federal offense to open someone's mail, to please not do it again, that since I was not staying there anymore and we weren't going to live together I was having my address changed, and that if any more mail arrived there addressed to me to please not open it. I ended the message with a thank you.

Shortly there after I receive a voice message saying that since I don't take his calls and only communicate through text messaging, he "has no choice" but to contact a lawyer and take me to court. I asked him repeatedly to just leave me alone for now because the constant arguing and yelling is too stressful and I want to have a healthy pregnancy. (Many people have told me that I shouldn't get upset and therefore shouldn't deal with him at all right now.) But I NEVER once said he couldn't see the baby once it's born. On the contrary. Numerous times I tried telling him that we could work something out and it doesn't even have to even end up in court. And we could do activities together with the baby. I tried telling him about a friend of mine who has an out-of-court arrangement with her baby's father where he gets it every weekend and she has it during the week. To which he screams "I don't care what they do!" and starts yelling at me. What else am I supposed to do!? He won't reason with me. And the stress/fighting is not healthy for anyone, especially a pregnant woman. It's 3 am, and I am currently unable to sleep because this all has be quite upset. I don't know what else to do but not talk to him right now.

Honestly, he doesn't seem to even have a grip on reality and can't seem to follow a simple conversation. When I tried discussing arrangements with him, I mentioned that I thought holidays should be split evenly, with each of us being with the child for half of the day... he starts yelling that the baby won't know his side of the family. I'm like HOW do you get that out of me saying I think holidays should be split!!?? Not to mention, he has said a bunch of times how he doesn't talk to anyone in his family except mom, sister, and brother. When I bring those facts up.... he again says that I'm "using stuff against him". Something is seriously wrong with him......

And then when HE calls threatening to take me to court.... I bring up the fact that he has a DUI amongst other things on his record, mental health issues, anger issues, a history of pot and alcohol abuse, etc (NONE of which I have)..... and he gets mad saying that I'm just "using things to make him look like a sh*thead." I mean am I not supposed to respond to him saying he'll take me to court? And is that what he'd say in front of a judge... oh she's just bringing up these things to make me look bad!!?? Then he starts cursing at me calling me an a-hole and what not.

He went on to include a list of things to use against me in court: that he has just started going to AA meetings, quit pot, and has made a list of the things he's done for me........ making me sandwiches and calling a doctor to make an appointment for me. Never mind that he and his friends smoked pot around me (I left the room. And eventually the house.)...... already putting the baby at risk before it's even born!!!

I feel the AA thing is just for show as he never before decided to do anything about his drinking before..... just when he decides to take me to court... but I also know my opinion is just that.... an opinion.... and is probably best kept to myself.

So then I mention that I don't want his mother left alone with the baby and that I feel supervised visits would be best for him because I don't feel he can provide a stable environment. Of course, he throws a fit. But given their histories, I don't know what person would want them alone with a baby..... =/

Then he claims he doesn't feel I can provide a stable environment either, bringing up the fact that I will be going to school (which is only 3 hours, 4 nights a week) to get a 10 dollar an hour job. What is wrong with that, I don't know... especially coming from someone who's only had a job (as a waiter) for a few weeks and couldn't get another job because of stuff on his record. Plus, with this job (in medical transcription), I will be able to work from home and be with the baby.

I really think the whole lawyer/court thing is simply out of spite.... since I HAVE said over and over that I want him to visit the baby and I want the baby to have a father.... why else WOULD he take me to court? Unless it's just another scare tactic to get me on the phone with him. And he also says every time that I do get on the phone that he refuses to leave me alone and won't stop calling.

He also says if I say the baby can't be alone with his mom, then he'll say the same thing about my dad. My dad however is NOT bipolar and has NOT overdosed on pills and does NOT lock himself in the house with doors locked/ phones unanswered. He also does NOT harass people on the phone. Again, this just seems out of spite. But her history is of concern. He has even told me himself how unstable she is and how no medication seems to work..... would you want her alone with your child???

Just more reasons as to why I don't feel he's mature enough to care for another life. He is just playing games and using this child as a pawn. Which  seriously disgusts me.

So what should I do?
Do I HAVE to talk him?
SHOULD I talk to him?
Do you think he would get unsupervised visits? Because the more I think about that, the more it really scares me.......

[Giggles]

what did I tell you to do in my other post?  Do NOT worry about what HE'S doing....you need to concentrate on you and YOUR actions!!

Simply explain to him that you would rather keep communication at this point to E-mails and to please not call you unless there is some sort of emergency.  If he continues to contact you, then file a Restraining order and use any verbaly abusive voice mails as grounds.  Threatening court action is a form of verbal abuse.  This also is a way to guarentee supervised visits at a later date :-)

I would invite him to participate in your Dr. visits but be sure to bring someone else with you (friend, mother, etc).  This is a way to have controlling behavior documented.

If he does call and starts going off again..simply say "I'm unable to continue this conversation" then hang up.  The thing to remember is to ensure YOUR actions are not "RE-actions".  If he threatens you with court, then simplly say "Do what you feel is necessary".

He's trying to control you and you need to take back that control and concentrate on what you do...not what he's TRYING to do.  If he does file for court, then you take it from there.

[4honor]

You are pregnant with the child  of a man who does not have the stability of a stable relationship (whether by choice or what-not I have no facts).

This makes most men who WANT to have a relationship with their child a little nuts. You are pregnant and hormonal and he is going to appear WRONG  no matter if he gets it right... that is just the way it FEELS even under the best situations -- which this isn't.

You need to understand that not all mistakes are "fatal flaws", his past does not necessarily dictate his future, just as your "unblemished past" does not necessarily guarantee you any measure of success. You are basically on equal footing right now.

Men who were lousy significant others (SOs) can see their child for the first time and fall in love... the love of a parent. Guys can become the man you always hoped they would be for the sake of their children.

He is on rocky ground. He knows it. He knows he has a lousy past and some serious issues -- both in his own life and with you.

When he says "I am going to take you to court" you need to hear him also say "I don't feel like I can trust your word right now and I think this is all out of control." He might also be saying, "we are having such a hard time trying to agree now and the baby isn't even born. Lets get the agreement on paper with a judge's authority behind it."

He is very likely scared to death of being no more than a walking wallet where his child is concerned. Granted his lack of work experience makes him not much of a wallet, but the fear is there and it is real.

(Oh, and the medical billing from home -- BTDT-- schooling looks good on paper, but becomes alot of running around and selling your skills to doctors and picking up forms -- not worth it. You might choose something where someone else's financial stability is not dependent on your experience level -- it is easier to get a job if you already have one.)

Settle yourself down. You sound so young. First baby?

You have both the freedom of speech and the right to remain silent. However, I think you SHOULD talk to him. Not over the phone.... but in person in a public place. Men are very visual. If he sees you are looking well and taking care of yourself, he may listen more to reason.

You would have to have PROOF - like he goes into court and admits he was doing pot last night, or he shows to court drunk to get supervised visits. Don't plan on it.

Stop worrying about what could happen and work on placing REASONABLE boundaries into a plan of action. You have some time, think about what kind of position you would like to have if you were the non-custodial parent. Do you think two days a week would be what you want?

Honestly, it is unrealistic to think either one of you will not be holding down a full time job. Working from home is pie in the sky  and may EVENTUALLY work, but what are you going to feed yourself and dear little one until Eventually comes? Self employed persons have to buy their own health insurance.  It is Extremely expensive. And without a court order, the baby's father will not be made to carry insurance for his child IF it is available through his employer. Or were you planning on using America's hard earned tax dollars to fund you and your child's medical needs? Your own medical insurance will not be covered.

If his work schedule has him working weekends, then he likely will get a few holidays and weekdays off. Think about it from his perspective. He thinks you are only trying to offer him time when he can't spend any awake time with the child. What good is that? You might as well be telling him to kick rocks as far as he is concerned.

This is not about trying to control you. It is not about using your child as a pawn. It is about being in a bad situation with someone who cannot communicate on the same level and the miscommunication is flying.

When he tries to escalate, consider offering mediation. All that cooperation you are offering him after the baby is born, you should be offering him now. Find a way to get through to him in his dialect, on his level. After all, men are from Mars, and women are from Venus.

I am not trying to tell you that he is a great guy and you should take him back, or that you are all wrong, but I am telling you that having come through a pregnancy and motherhood alone  from age 19 on ... having met and married Mr. Right (with the baggage of ex-Mrs. wrong in tow behind his son) and having battled to maintain a REASONABLE relationship with a child that was fed HORRIBLE lies for years by a mother who "had concerns" and thought she was "doing the right thing" and in her eyes "never kept" their son from his father... I think you need to rethink your position. BTDT.

My dear daughter (DD) is 24. My step son (SS) is 17. I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. My only regret is that I didn't sacrifice more so that my husband could have gotten an iron clad parenting plan early on... it would have waylaid arguments, kept the constant "renegotiation" and the resentment that brings to a minimum.

The Lawyer/Court thing is a necessary evil. But it does not have to be the only thing. You each want certain things. Get an agreement on paper of the things you actually agree on - do it face to face so long as there is no possibility of there being violence. Then do the negotiating. You give alittle, he gives a little.

Leave child support alone until after the baby is born. Money is a sore subject for anyone. You want to make the most progress NOW, before the little one is born.

So tell your hormones to go to heck and start thinking of this as a business arrangement. Your "product" is baby. You want the best product on the planet, so start learning to work with your co-worker, the baby's father. If you stop worrying about who is meeting their half, and instead, both give 100% effort to baby, you can't lose, and neither can baby.

[junkyardflower]

I know!!! You are right!!! It's just so frustrating!!!

I asked him to keep in touch through email.... he refused that.
So all I can do is what you said......
Stay calm. Stay focused. And concenrate on my own actions.

"The thing to remember is to ensure YOUR actions are not "RE-actions" " - That's a great way of putting it!

Thanks again for the advice!!!

[junkyardflower]

I'm sorry, but I disagree. I don't feel we are on equal footing right now at all. For someone to smoke pot around a pregnant woman and not understand why she wouldn't want to be there shows that he doesn't grasp the seriousness of the situation. A baby doesn't have the ability to say "I don't wanna be around this" and leave.

Yes, we all make mistakes and can look back and realize we should have handled things differently. (Obviously myself included.) But we don't all throw things at people (Which he has done to me. While pregnant I might add.), kick things, punch things, etc. This is behavior that continues. HIS friends are telling me that he's only getting worse and that THEY don't think he should be left alone with a child either.

I really don't see why supervised visits are too much to ask for. He meets the criteria for requesting supervised visits.... Substance abuse, violent outbursts, parenting concerns, mental instability....

I'm sure the mental illness is documented somewhere.... as is his substance abuse history via his criminal record.

Also, I've not mentioned child support once in my posts. Nor have I to him. So...... I don't really see your point there. When he says "I'm going to take you to court" I hear.... "This is how I'm going to be spiteful. And this is how I'm going to get you on the phone." I've given him no reason to take me to court. Asking him to give me space instead of fighting with me... that's hardly a reason.

And no offense, but you don't seem to know what you are talking about in terms of a medical transcription job. It is not at all what you described. I personally know people who do this. It does not become any type of running around or picking up forms. It is simply typing stuff up and putting it into the system. It is also not dependent on experience level... you either have the degree for it or you don't. It is also different than self employment. You still work FOR the place. And get all the benefits of doing so.

I will be able to complete about half of the schooling while pregnant. They allow you to go back at a later date to finish the rest. Until then, I have the support of my parents and can get a part time job now to have some money saved up for when the baby arrives.... would have gotten one sooner but couldn't due to medical issues.

I also disagree with your take on court. The lawyer/court thing is NOT a necessary evil. Unless people want to make it one.  This is a baby... a person. Not an object. But hey let's fight over it like it's the last piece of pizza and use it to get what we want. I never once said I didn't want him to be a part of his child's life or would ever try to keep him from it. I just want to make sure my baby is safe. And if I'm wrong for that, then I guess I'm wrong.

Plus I like how you KNOW what he is thinking. "Think about it from his perspective. He thinks you are only trying to offer him time when he can't spend any awake time with the child. What good is that? You might as well be telling him to kick rocks as far as he is concerned." ...Because you know his work schedule, what has and hasn't been offered, and what goes on in his head?

I HAVE tried to think about it from his perspective which is why I NEVER mentioned child support, NEVER said I would try to keep him from the kid, NEVER insulted his new job as a waiter, and said I would NEVER say anything bad about him in front of the child.

But really... I don't owe him anything right now. HE had the opportunity to be there and wasn't. So now, If he is not willing to cooperate and talk to me in a civil tone and like an adult... but rather just threaten me, insult me, and blame me for HIS actions (After all it's my fault he's an alocholic)... why should I continue talking to him? That's just like pouring salt in a wound. Doesn't make anything better. Only worse.  And I don't want to have a miscarriage because I'm upset over arguments that don't even need to occur.

I sound young? YOU just sound like you WANT to be wise beyond your years. Now I can take some constructive criticism.... but...... saying things like "or are you planning on using America's hard earned tax dollars to support your child?" is just insulting and not helpful.

[lucky]

I'm sorry, but I disagree. I don't feel we are on equal footing right now at all. For someone to smoke pot around a pregnant woman and not understand why she wouldn't want to be there shows that he doesn't grasp the seriousness of the situation. A baby doesn't have the ability to say "I don't wanna be around this" and leave. And you did have the ability to leave - which you did.  You don't have the ability to control anyone else's behavior nor should you - everyone is free to make their own decisions, right or wrong and everyone has their own beliefs as to what is right or wrong - and sometimes conflicting beliefs are BOTH right or BOTH wrong.

Yes, we all make mistakes and can look back and realize we should have handled things differently. (Obviously myself included.) But we don't all throw things at people (Which he has done to me. While pregnant I might add.), kick things, punch things, etc. This is behavior that continues. HIS friends are telling me that he's only getting worse and that THEY don't think he should be left alone with a child either.

I really don't see why supervised visits are too much to ask for. He meets the criteria for requesting supervised visits.... Substance abuse, violent outbursts, parenting concerns, mental instability.... He may meet the criteria in your opinion, but it's the judge whom you have to convince - some will require hard proof, some will take your word for it.  If he is being violent and threatening, then you were already advised to get a restraining order - do so.

I'm sure the mental illness is documented somewhere.... as is his substance abuse history via his criminal record.

Also, I've not mentioned child support once in my posts. Nor have I to him. So...... I don't really see your point there. When he says "I'm going to take you to court" I hear.... "This is how I'm going to be spiteful. And this is how I'm going to get you on the phone." I've given him no reason to take me to court. Asking him to give me space instead of fighting with me... that's hardly a reason.  You may be right as to your interpretation of what he's saying, however, 4H may be right as well or it could be somewhere in the middle.  It is your job to attempt to be objective and not make assumptions that he means the worst because after your child is born, that attitude WILL carry over and your child will "get it" guaranteed, even if you never directly say anything bad, it'll color your tone of voice, expressions, body language, etc.  BTDT from ALL sides (CP stepmom, NCP stepmom, CP biomom AND NCP biomom).

And no offense, but you don't seem to know what you are talking about in terms of a medical transcription job. It is not at all what you described. I personally know people who do this. It does not become any type of running around or picking up forms. It is simply typing stuff up and putting it into the system. It is also not dependent on experience level... you either have the degree for it or you don't. It is also different than self employment. You still work FOR the place. And get all the benefits of doing so.  I believe that BOTH you and 4H are right on this one from my research into it in the past.

I will be able to complete about half of the schooling while pregnant. They allow you to go back at a later date to finish the rest. Until then, I have the support of my parents and can get a part time job now to have some money saved up for when the baby arrives.... would have gotten one sooner but couldn't due to medical issues.

I also disagree with your take on court. The lawyer/court thing is NOT a necessary evil. Unless people want to make it one. This is a baby... a person. Not an object. But hey let's fight over it like it's the last piece of pizza and use it to get what we want. I never once said I didn't want him to be a part of his child's life or would ever try to keep him from it. I just want to make sure my baby is safe. And if I'm wrong for that, then I guess I'm wrong.  Unfortunately, the lawyer/court thing IS a necessary evil when the parents cannot talk civilly and agree on things.  Even child support is governed by a court order.  And, if you are seriously considering supervised visitation for dad, you will have no choice but to go to court as you can't make that decision yourself unless dad agrees - which I can't see happening under the circumstances.  A judge will have to order it.

No, you're not wrong for wanting to keep your child safe, just be careful that you do so with an open, objective point of view.  You MUST control the emotions in this situation or you can appear vindictive in front of the judge and any other person (like a GAL or FOC) involved.  If he's as bad as you're saying, let HIM appear vindictive, not you.

Plus I like how you KNOW what he is thinking. "Think about it from his perspective. He thinks you are only trying to offer him time when he can't spend any awake time with the child. What good is that? You might as well be telling him to kick rocks as far as he is concerned." ...Because you know his work schedule, what has and hasn't been offered, and what goes on in his head? I don't think 4H was saying that she knew what he was thinking - she was just throwing out some of the thoughts that her NCP DH had during all of their dealings with this type of situation.  Maybe dad IS thinking this, maybe not.  Again, you need to be objective and keep the emotions out of it.

I HAVE tried to think about it from his perspective which is why I NEVER mentioned child support, NEVER said I would try to keep him from the kid, NEVER insulted his new job as a waiter, and said I would NEVER say anything bad about him in front of the child. Again, your attitude will color your tone of voice, body language, facial expressions etc., unless you learn to get control of it now and remain calm and objective.  That is just as bad as saying it out loud - HOW you say things is just as important as the words themselves.

But really... I don't owe him anything right now. HE had the opportunity to be there and wasn't. So now, If he is not willing to cooperate and talk to me in a civil tone and like an adult... This is an example of what will come out to your child - you believe that he isn't acting like an adult and my bet is that you're treating him that way.  Maybe he's got it coming, but NOT from YOU.  You need to do everything possible to be calm and objective. but rather just threaten me, insult me, and blame me for HIS actions (After all it's my fault he's an alocholic)... why should I continue talking to him? That's just like pouring salt in a wound. Doesn't make anything better. Only worse. And I don't want to have a miscarriage because I'm upset over arguments that don't even need to occur. Change your phone number and get it unlisted if you don't want the arguments, voice mails, etc.  Get a restraining order if he's violent and abusive.  There ARE things you can do to minimize this stuff.  DO them.

I sound young? YOU just sound like you WANT to be wise beyond your years. Now I can take some constructive criticism.... but...... saying things like "or are you planning on using America's hard earned tax dollars to support your child?" is just insulting and not helpful.  4H is a very, very wise person.  She's been through all of this and understands very well.  Also, those of us who have had ex's or our dh's have had ex's who have used the welfare system for support rather than getting a job and supporting themselves have a really bad taste in our mouths about that.  We work very hard for our paychecks and frankly, I resent anyone who won't do the same but expect my taxes to pay their bills.  I believe that 4H made this statement based upon her knowledge of transcription jobs - in her experience, those jobs don't pay health insurance & can't meet the medical bills of the magnitute that pregnancy, childbirth and early childhood appointments will incur.

[junkyardflower]

Yes, I had the ability to leave and did... all I was saying that a baby doesn't have that ability... so if left alone with him... has no say in what happens or what it is subjected to....

It just seemed like 4honor was making statements based on things that were never even said or issues that were never even addressed... such as him thinking I'm only offering days/times when he is unavailable.... when that never happened at all. Or that he is just scared of being viewed as a wallet.... when money/child support was never even mentioned. Or telling me I won't have medical insurance without even knowing who I'll even be employed by.

I mean..... this person doesn't know anything about the situation other than the little that I've posted on here.... so for her to make such assumptions just seems a little.... well like I said, not helpful. Though I'll say, it is possible I just read things wrong... or read too much into them.

I could type on and on about how the baby's father is not behaving like an adult.... and how I have tried to reason with him..... not only would I sound like a broken record... but the bottom line is you guys are ALL right..... I just need to do the things I've been told to do in order to minimize such instances.

Yes, I could have handled things better in the past. Yes, it takes two to fight. I have realized this. And when I make an honest effort to keep things calm, reasonable, rational, and fair..... and get the kind of response I get.... it just gets frustrating.

"Unfortunately, the lawyer/court thing IS a necessary evil when the parents cannot talk civilly and agree on things."
Agreed. That's pretty much what I said.... or tried to say........ it's not a necessary evil UNLESS people want to make it one. If people are willing to work with each other, they make make their own arrangements... that's all I meant.

"Also, those of us who have had ex's or our dh's have had ex's who have used the welfare system for support rather than getting a job and supporting themselves have a really bad taste in our mouths about that."

-This is another assumption. Until she knows that that is what I plan to do...... she shouldn't try to criticize me for it. That's the same as you telling me to keep my emotions out of it and be objective. Just because she has dealt with people in the past who have done this, doesn't mean I am one of them or that she has to get worked up about it with me. Especially when it wasn't even a point of topic.

Furthermore, I have never been nor plan to be on welfare. The only reason I'm not currently working is because I was in college when I found out I was pregnant. I was going for writing. And would still have to complete 2 more years to get a degree. So... I decided to go for medical transcription instead to make sure that I COULD get a decent paying job much sooner to take care of my child WITHOUT expecting a free handout. I WANT to work. I figured this job would be good because I wouldn't have to stick my child in daycare with strangers.... but I'd still be making an honest living.

"in her experience, those jobs don't pay health insurance & can't meet the medical bills of the magnitute that pregnancy, childbirth and early childhood appointments will incur."
Her experience in those jobs must be minimal or none then.... because medical transcription people ARE employed by a company, hospital, or doctor's office and they DO pay health insurance. My mom works in a hospital (medical records office) making 10 dollars an hour. She said all the transcription people work from home and make a lot more than she does. And there's no reason I can't get a part time job if need be.

Also some people DO just need extra need help. It IS possible to work, just as hard as yourselves, and still not make quite enough to make ends meat. I see nothing wrong with them getting assistance. Should people be able to just pop out kids and get a free ride? No. But they also shouldn't be judged just because they DO receive some aid. Not saying that you WERE judging them. Just expressing my opinions on the subject.

Anyways, even if we don't agree on everything, thanks for taking the time to read and respond! It is always helpful to hear different opinions/perspectives... and I'm sure I will take away good things from it!

[lucky]

[em]Also some people DO just need extra need help. It IS possible to work, just as hard as yourselves, and still not make quite enough to make ends meat. I see nothing wrong with them getting assistance. [/em]
I did not post this info because I didn't really feel it pertained at the time, but:

1)  Both my dh and I were on medical assistance prior to our marriage (over 10 yrs ago - we both worked full-time, no bennies).

2)  My family was on medical assistance AFTER our marriage (we were both working full time and/or he worked full-time and I took out every student loan and other FA available to complete my degree in 2 yrs)

3)  My DD and my grandson are currently on medical assistance because grandson's dad is in construction, has no health insurance available and is laid off for the winter.  Come May/June, they will have to pay the sliding fee premium when dad goes back to work unless she can find a job earlier - then the sliding fee will start when she begins work.


I'm NOT against people who NEED help getting it.  I have issues with those who TAKE it but don't really need it.



[em]That's the same as you telling me to keep my emotions out of it and be objective.[/em]
I'm just telling you what the "high road" is.  It's hard (in my case damn near impossible), BUT, any case worker, FOC, GAL or judge will EXPECT you to be objective - if you aren't they'll use it against you.  Trust me.  It's happened to us in every case we've brought (we're a his/mine/ours family - three ex's) because one or both of us WEREN'T able to remain calm and objective.  Plus, you'll be very surprised at what the ex will remember and YOU won't (because it won't seem like a big deal to you).  And it WILL happen.

In any case, I wish you, your ex and your child good luck.
[em]Lucky

Lead your life so you wouldn't be ashamed to sell the family parrot to the town gossip.
- Will Rogers[em]

[lilywhite]

I used to do medical transcription at home.  I'm a scientist (and employed as one) but needed more income when my daughter was in college.  I worked for Medquist.  Medquist will hire you if you go to their classes.  Might want to look into that option.   I was pre-med prior to graduate school, so I already had the lingo down.  I didn't take their classes - just applied and got the job.  They basically pay by the line, and you can make an awful lot of money working at home at night - probably $40K if you work at it; maybe even more.  I was only working about 20 hours a week and made about $20K a year extra in addition to my real job.  

I just checked Medquist.  They have home-based opportunities, paid by the line, and offer all benefits including health insurance.

This man sounds unstable.  I don't think you will have to have any court activity until after the baby is born and he's proved paternity.  Stop worrying about it and start enjoying the rest of your pregnancy.