Is this unreasonable?

[Wi-Mom]

My Fiance got custody of his 14 year old son in July 2003. His mother and sisters live over 5 hours away. Fiance has one daughter still living with his ex and she has two other daughters that are not his. They do come down for visits and have been treated as part of the family (ie: his parents are "Grandma & Grandpa" to all of them)

She was really resistant to giving up custody of the son, which is understandable, but she decided that she was going to be in complete control of everything. She would call her son to "talk" to him, and after a short conversation the son would hang up and announce, "By the way Dad, you're driving me 1/2 way to meet her this weekend, and the girls are coming back with you to stay."

We were both like, "EXCUSE ME??"

My fiance called her back and told her that if she wanted her son for the weekend, she was to call him directly, not make arrangements with the child. She was also not to dictate when he would see the girls. She tried to undermine him anyway, and continued to attempt to negotiate through their child. She would call when my fiance was not home and tell their son, "Ask your dad if it's ok to meet this weekend." The son was told that he was to tell her, "You have to talk to Dad. "

That pissed her off, and she refused to do so. Now she is telling him that he is interfering with her rights to see her son, because he simply wants her to talk to him not the kid. He's always friendly, and has been very willing to make the drive. He just wants her to stop making the child do all the negotiating, and she doesn't want to. So she wants to take him to court for interfering with her ability to see the child because she absolutely refuses to talk to his  Dad despite the fact that he is the one who has to do the driving.  

She's also pissed off because for the entire month of July she did not call once, and now that it is two weekends before school starts she wants the son to stay for a week. He can't. For the first time my fiance said no. He has to be at school for registration. It is required. The week after that he has gear up. She turned and blamed my fiance for not calling HER in July to make sure that she had an opportunity to have him over.  Again, she accused him of keeping her child from her. She didn't ASK!! Now HE"s supposed to do the asking?? Tonight she told him that she's going to sue for custody again because of these things. I don't get it.

Is it unreasonable to ask that she talk to him directly since he has to spend an entire day driving just to accomodate her?  He drives 3 hours to meet her and 3 hours to get home. During the school year, that's both Saturday and Sunday so he can stay for a weekend. Shouldn't the two of them negotiate what is the most convenient time to do so?

[Peanutsdad]

Not only is it reasonable that he expect her to deal with him and not but a child in the middle,, it's essential.


Without knowing what the co stips are,, its hard for  anyone to say whether or not she could take you back to court.


As far as visitation goes,, typically, if the ncp has not shown up for pick up, called to arrange pick up, or even called at all,,,,thats a voluntary skip,, not a denial.


Now,question,, this time that he did deny, did it contain court ordered time of hers?  If it did,, then yes she has a contempt on him.


See, thats the catch,, the ncp can skip all the time they want,, but if you deny once on their scheduled time,, its contempt.

[Wi-Mom]

There is no court ordered time. The visitation is only listed as what is worked out between the parents. Thanks!!

[Kitty C.]

Then let her try to take him back to court.  PD is right, it is IMPERATIVE that all arrangements be done ONLY betwen the parents.  If she does manage to get this in front of the judge, and it comes out that she only wants to go thru son, the judge will NOT be happy at all.

But that's if she can even get it in front of a judge.  She may have an atty. who tells her that she'll get screwed if she tries to pursue this.  But if you do end up in court, make DAMN sure that you demand she pay all your atty. fees and court costs, for filing a frivilous suit and wasting the court's time.

And remember that desperate people will threaten without basis and make you THINK they can put you over a barrel.  She can threaten all she wants to, ONLY the court has the final say.

[Peanutsdad]

Sounds like shes still pullin the same kind of crap that lost her custody to begin with.

[msme]

taking her to court first. But only if you have lots of well documented evidence of these behaviors. The basis of the case should be, the fact that there is no specific visitation established for her, is empowering her to insist on involving the child in adult matters, which is not good for his well being.

Then go on here & find the sample parenting plans. Take the one that is closest to your needs & modify it to fit exactly. Use your son's school calendar to plan the dates.

Make sure you put in language that prevents her from trying to involve the child. Also stipulate a reasonable rule for being late to pick up or return. My son's says that if she is 10 minutes late, she forfeits the visit.
But it also states that the parents should work together if there is a reason she will be late & calls him before he leaves to deliver them.

Since they exchange in the local police station parking lot, he just tells her to call when she knows for sure what time she will get there & he will run the kids over to her.

In the case of a forfeit. there is no make up time, unless she can provide proof of a varifiable emergency, such as a flat tire, auto accident, etc. A late return is a count of contempt & can be verified by going into the police station & asking them to document it.

You might want to think about changing the exchange spot to the police station parking lot, in the town where you meet. Those lots are videotaped & there is help there, if you should need it. If she is late, you can go inside & tell them that you would like them to verify that you were there & stayed the allotted time.

As far as the girls go, if they are coming to you when he goes to her, when are the kids supposed to be together? I would suggest that you have the girls visit you on an opposite weekend. That way your son gets to spend more time with them.

Good luck & God bless.

You never get a second chance to make a first impression!

[Wi-Mom]

Thanks everyone for such great suggestions. I think having a court ordered parenting plan might just keep her from continuing all of this non-sense. The only problem is, that from the beginning she has insisted on getting him every other weekend throughout the entire year.

With her over five hours away that means six hours of driving (1/2 way and back) on Saturday and six hours of driving on Sunday (through the school year) with KILLS every other weekend. There is no way we'd ever accomplish anything!  We told her that she is welcome to come all the way down and see her son every other weekend if she wishes but we will only drive 1/2 way once every three weeks.

The stupid thing is, she will go 1-3 months without even calling to ask to see him so she really doesn't want the every other weekend thing herself. But EVERYTIME we try to nail down a schedule with her that we can make legal she INSISTS that she wants us to drive him half way every other weekend. We're just not willing to do that, and due to the fact that he is very involved in sports during the school year.. this would prevent him from participating in many of those activities. I don't think that's in his best interest because basketball is his passion.  He would have to quit the team he's on at the YMCA to accomodate this.

I just see a total roadblock here because she will not agree to anything but what she wants. Is there a way to resolve this issue without expensive court proceedings?

[Kitty C.]

Who moved, her or you?  Cuz if it was here, it's VERy possible that, if taken to court, they can rule that if that's what BM wants, SHE will have to provide all ALL the transportation.  It happens quite often, kind of 'punishment' for the move-away parent for taking the child so far from the other parent.

And if she still wants to push this issue, and insists on taking this to court, get schedules of those activities admitted as well, to prove that she does NOT have her child's best interests in mind, or she'd find a way to work around his activity schedule.  

[Wi-Mom]

Boy, who moved? That is such a funny question! When they got divorced, SHE moved down to our area with the kids. He stayed up where she lives now because he had a job and had to continue the child support.

Then SHE decided to move back up there, but left the kids down here for a year and a half to live with HIS parents! She gave them legal custody. During that time HE tried to get back together with her and it seemed to be working so he sent for the kids to help make them a family again. BIG mistake.

SHE dumped him again, kept the kids up there with her and then he found a job that payed better down here, so he moved in with his parents, and has been living down here for like 9 years. She has been talking for years about moving back this way but has never done it.

So I guess technically.. eventually.. he was the last to move down here so it would be him.

I just laughed out loud at your question because it's my understanding that both of them had been moving back and forth for the first several years after their divorce. It was hard to nail down just who moved away from whom since at one time the kids were down here and BOTH the parents were up there!

[Kitty C.]

Definitely muddies the water!

[MixedBag]

EX#1 used to live 4 hours away and we exchanged the kids by meeting half way on Friday evening and on Sunday evening at 7 pm.  

This gave us each a chance to get off work and start driving by 5 pm and the girls would arrive at 9 pm on the other end.  

They got a full Saturday with dad and most of Sunday....

And yep, did that every other weekend.

Did I catch it right that she has the girls and he has the boy?

What about meeting EOW -- and one time it's to pick up the girls and the other time it's to drop off the boy -- and the weekend inbetween is just with the CP..?