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Author Topic: An intresting and informative read  (Read 9047 times)

babyfat

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An intresting and informative read
« on: Nov 08, 2007, 08:24:28 AM »
http://www.nfja.org/positionstatement/childsupportbudgetcuts.shtml

This goes with the last topic but is just slightly different. Loaded with fact, stats, and valueble info.


reagantrooper

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RE: An intresting and informative read
« Reply #1 on: Nov 09, 2007, 10:03:07 AM »
Good read. Sunshine should give it a whirl.

mistoffolees

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RE: An intresting and informative read
« Reply #2 on: Nov 09, 2007, 12:54:50 PM »
Actually, there's very little information there that enlightens anything. It reads as a sensationalist story.

For example take one of the more volatile statements: "there are millions of dollars in child support that have been collected but not distributed to the children it was intended for". Sounds like an important statistic on the surface. But let's dig a little deeper:

- How many millions?
- How much is the total child support collected in this country (hint: it's BILLIONS, not millions). So what is the percentage that doesn't get where it's going?
- WHY did that child support not get to the designated place? Was a parent in hiding so that they could not be located? Was it an admin messup what was later resolved? Did someone steal the money?

There's nothing in there which addresses the fundamental issues:

- Are children in general benefiting from Child support?
- What percentage of children are not getting the benefit of child support?
- What percentage of the collected child support is actually spent for the child's benefit?
- And so on.

THOSE are the questions that matter - and none of them is addressed. Instead, this article provides more of the same fear-mongering that is so common and that I'm resisting in this board. Example? The repeat the story of someone who was handcuffed in front of his co-workers. That's a tragic story, no doubt. But unless they can show that it happens a significant amount of time, it's no more than a personal tragedy. They make absolutely no effort to show how common these tragedies are - and without that effort, it's nothing more than a fear-mongering exercise.

Add to that the regular statements with no backup "we believe the amount of undistributed child support is too high" or "we believe the $4.38 collected per dollar spent is incorrect" statements. They could be right. But until they provide SOMETHING to support their statements that the government figures are wrong, it's nothing more than whining.  If they have a real plan backed by real evidence, I'd be as happy as anyone to see it implemented. I do NOT, however, favor plans based purely on emotion coming from people who even admit in their paper that they don't understand financial issues ("We would like to see a financial expert "crunch" the numbers.")

This doesn't apply solely to this issue, btw. It applies to everything. People need to learn to think critically and look for evidence rather than accepting every emotional appeal thrown at them.

Accepting statements like "this figure is too high" without even wondering how they arrived at that conclusion doesn't do anyone any good.

reagantrooper

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RE: An intresting and informative read
« Reply #3 on: Nov 09, 2007, 01:37:30 PM »
What a piece of work Sunshine!

Ref

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POSITION statement
« Reply #4 on: Nov 09, 2007, 01:44:11 PM »
It is an interesting position statement. I happen to agree with their position but it goes beyond Child Support.

I guess it is a little off topic, but as a public accountant who has audited government agencies, I can tell you that there is a lot of waste. I think every dollar spend by goverment agencies should be scrutinized to make sure the public is getting everything they are paying for. I am a liberal person and believe in social services, but believing in them and believing in how many of them are run are two totally seperate things.

Very interesting babyfat. I wish there was a "take it outside" board where I could have stuck this OT comment but it aint here so....

Best wishes,
Ref


mistoffolees

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RE: An intresting and informative read
« Reply #5 on: Nov 09, 2007, 02:34:42 PM »
>What a piece of work Sunshine!

Is that supposed to be a reasoned, intelligent response?

MixedBag

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Two wrongs...
« Reply #6 on: Nov 09, 2007, 03:54:57 PM »
Don't make it right.

Davy

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RE: Two wrongs...
« Reply #7 on: Nov 09, 2007, 09:08:30 PM »

What in the world are you trying to say.

MixedBag

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RE: Two wrongs...
« Reply #8 on: Nov 10, 2007, 06:18:11 AM »
Mist should know and that's what matters.

babyfat

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RE: POSITION statement
« Reply #9 on: Nov 10, 2007, 08:31:27 AM »
>I guess it is a little off topic, but as a public accountant
>who has audited government agencies, I can tell you that there
>is a lot of waste. I think every dollar spend by goverment
>agencies should be scrutinized to make sure the public is
>getting everything they are paying for. I am a liberal person
>and believe in social services, but believing in them and
>believing in how many of them are run are two totally seperate
>things.


That was kinda the point I was trying to make. There is too much waste large portions of money intended to go to one place is going towards others. It is not that the system can't work, it can and in some situations does but not always. Your never going to get any social program or any other program for that matter to have a 100% success rate and there are always improvements to be made. Really on paper there is little wrong with the system it is in the process of trying to make it work that things don't get carried out as it should, mistakes are made, people get hurt and so do children. If they used all the money they wasted and pissed away to regulate the system the results would be better all the way around. The main problem with the system is human error, lazyness, and people trying to get one over on the system. I too hold your position of I "believe in social services, but believing in them and
believing in how many of them are run are two totally seperate
things."

 

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