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Author Topic: Possible child abuse  (Read 11845 times)

amymarie

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Possible child abuse
« on: Jun 09, 2009, 11:43:30 AM »
My DF (dear fiance) has joint legal and physical custody, 50/50 time split, with neither parent designated as primary.  He has had week on, week off schedule since dd was 10 Mos old (she will be 3 in August). 
 
In May of this year, he filed contempt against BM (birth mom) for denying visitations and for not consulting with him on medical decisions for dd.  A week after she was served the papers, he found out she was alleging that he sexually assaulted dd.  She had been sick with diarheaa and broke out really bad and BM was claiming it was an std.  Of course the std tests came back negative and DF was cleared of all allegations.
 
Now on to this year.  Things have gone relatively smoothly except we just had to file contempt charges against BM for not giving DF half of her tax refund that she received for dd.  When we picked up dd this Sunday, on the way home she was saying "Girls do it easy, boys do it hard".  We asked her what she was talking about and she pointed to her genitals.  We asked her who told her that and she said her momma.  DF pulled over to get gas and I proceeded to ask dd a couple more general questions (Who touches you down there - Daddy and Mommy, etc.)  I asked her if anyone had hurt her down there and she said yes, her papaw had (BM's grandfather, who they live with).  I asked her to show me how he hurt her and she took her pointer finger and said "This finger right here" and started rubbing her genitals up and down and said "That's not very nice".  I asked her if she told her mommy and she said yes and that momma said Papaw don't do that.
 
When we got home an hour and a half later, DF asked her similar questions and she told him the exact same thing and demonstrated it to him as well.  So we called CPS and the sent officers out and told us to take her to the hospital to get checked out.  There weren't any physical signs of abuse but the doctors said that doesn't mean it didn't happen.
 
So now we're having trouble because we live in a different state then BM.  Her state is the one with jurisdiction but they are not being very cooperative.  No one will call us back.  We're waiting to hear back from both CPS and the sheriff's office.  Our state wants to had dd evaluated by a forensic pyschiatrist, but they can't do anything until they get permission from her state since the abuse happened there.
 
We are supposed to take dd back on Sunday and we're worried that things won't be taken care of by then.  CPS here doesn't want dd to go back with BM because they are worried BM will try to convince her that what happened (if it did happen) didn't happen.  The doctor is going to write us a letter saying she thinks dd should stay here with us until the investigation is complete.  We can probably get a temporary protective order against the grandfather with that letter, but what about BM?  Is that letter enough to allow us to keep her or is there something else we need to do?  I don't think we'll be able to get a TPO against BM since she hasn't actually abused her.  But we don't trust her to keep dd away from the grandfather, especially since they live together.  She does have one other relative she could stay with (her mother), but that housing situation isn't any better since her mother has a history of drug abuse and always has random guys coming in and out of her house.
 
Does anyone have some advice for us? 


Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #1 on: Jun 09, 2009, 12:15:26 PM »
You CAN get a TPO on BM just for the reason you stated, that you cannot trust her to not put your DF's DD in that situation again.......AND she didn't do anything to protect her in the first place.  If you're looking at the g-father as the perpetrator, then you have to view BM as an accessory, because she may not have seen it happen but she didn't do anything about it once she did find out.
 
And if you have all those agencies involved, they ought to have a way to keep the child in your jurisdiction at least for the time being.  Talk to them and see what they suggest.......they have the power of the system behind them and they can get orders much quicker.  I would think they would be the ones requestiong the TRO's anyway, since they are the ones who want to keep her in your jurisdiction.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #2 on: Jun 09, 2009, 12:25:49 PM »
Kitty - thank you.  That's good to know and I hope you are right (we are in GA by the way).  DF is going to the courthouse on Thursday to file the TPO.  The doctor is off today so he can't get the letter from her until tomorrow.   If he gets in touch with the sheriff from her state then he may do it tomorrow afternoon, but right now he is thinking he'll probably take Thurs and Fri off and drive to her state to file the police report since so far they haven't let him do it over the phone. 

Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #3 on: Jun 09, 2009, 01:05:42 PM »
Yes, but what are the authorities in YOUR state doing?  I would think that if CPS in GA doesn't want her to go back, they should be the ones in contact with the other state.  Seems odd to me that they are saying she shouldn't leave until their investigation is over, but yet they aren't doing anything about it?  Regardless of what the other state says, if GA has an investigation ongoing, that should take precedence.  I would think that any GA agency involved with this would do any requests for orders and would do all the communicating with the other state.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #4 on: Jun 09, 2009, 01:45:08 PM »
Once we dealt with two states -- and it was totally confusing.
 
Neither side wanted to accept jurisdiction and they were both pointing the finger in the other direction.
 
The only way I got results and resolution was to be very very proactive and by telling them BOTH -- "YOU two agencies have got to make up your mind because you both can't be pointing the finger in the other direction."
 
In the end, Jurisdiction went to where the incident happened.
 
NOT to where the complaint was filed.
 
SO....GA needs to get on the ball and inform BM's home state and so do you and file a complaint there.
 
Sounds like you live near a state line -- otherwise 50/50 won't last too long considering all kids grow up and go to school.
 
Lastly, check out BM's state's kidnapping laws -- go search on the documents on this site for "parental kidnapping".  There's a chart and reference for every state and look up the law in BM's state and your own state and make sure you understand what THAT says.
 
 


Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #5 on: Jun 09, 2009, 02:02:09 PM »
MB, I think the difference here is that it crosses the line between civil and criminal.  Once that happens, it's a whole new set of rules.  I agree with you, often states will 'pass the buck' regarding civil proceedings and jurisdiction, but criminal is a completely different ballgame and that is the case here.  If CPS or any other agency is doing an investigation with the possible intention of prosecution, then they should be taking charge of this and should also have (or planning to have) LE involved.  Once that happens, and because this involves two different states, like depts. in either state should be working together on this (ie. CPS in both states, LE in both states, etc.).
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #6 on: Jun 09, 2009, 02:22:07 PM »
MB - Unfortunately, we are not near a state line. We are only able to keep 50/50 because dd is not yet in school. We have to go to mediation by May of next year to figure out where she will go to preschool next fall.

When BM filed abuse allegations against DF in May, GA CPS said it was not their jurisdiction and wouldn't even open a case. TN CPS opened a case and interviewed BM. DF didn't know about any of it and drove there to try to get dd and that's when he found out about it. So TN CPS interviewed him while he was there. They closed the case when the std tests came back negative but their final report did say there were jurisdictional issues which makes us believe that it really should have been GA CPS that should have taken care of it. Now the GA police did open an investigation but closed it when TN CPS closed theirs.

Now in the current situation, GA police and GA CPS are saying it is out of their jurisdiction. GA CPS did say that they would do all of the work for TN, but they have to get permission from TN first. Fortunately, TN CPS did say that it was in their jurisdiction, but they haven't called DF back (although they should call by the end of the day according to their protocal). DF has been trying to file a police report in TN over the phone but they kept giving him different numbers to call. Now they are telling him he has to speak to a specific police officer (it's a small town) and he can't get ahold of the guy. He keeps leaving messages but the guy hasn't called him back. If he doesn't call back by Thursday then DF is going to drive up there on Friday and file the report in person.

Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #7 on: Jun 09, 2009, 02:49:48 PM »
*chuckle*  If it's a small town, he may be the only cop on duty......give him a little bit to see if he does respond.  If not, I do agree that the report needs to be filed asap.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

gemini3

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #8 on: Jun 09, 2009, 02:58:26 PM »
You need to file an ex parte motion so that your SD doesn't have to go back to mom's until after this has all washed out.  If he doesn't, and doesn't return the child, he could be help in contempt.  He will need to file wherever the custody determination was made.

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #9 on: Jun 09, 2009, 04:23:36 PM »
IMHO, You should follow Kitty's and Gemini's wise counsel.  Under no circumstance should a parent return a child to a known abusive situation (sexual or otherwise).  I can't remember the statues but it applied to all states.  My case involved two states and subsequently I had criminal (interference with a child) charges or accusations in both states and found to be not guilty in both states.
 
 The beauty or should I say judicial abuse is that I did not even know of the the charges or hearings until some months later.  They did not want the testimony on public record. 

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #10 on: Jun 09, 2009, 06:46:16 PM »
The CPS guy still hasn't called DF back either - NO ONE is returning our calls. We're getting worried. It's the same guy that investigated the first case. Since it's a small town, we're also worried about them taking BM's family's side just for the fact that the people working on the case may know them personally.

Do we need a lawyer to file an ex parte motion? I've tried to find information about it but the only thing I can find is the temporary protection order. Is that the same thing?

ksmarks

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #11 on: Jun 09, 2009, 07:03:57 PM »
Can't dad file in Tennessee an order to show cause based on the supporting paperwork form your state?  I would think that your state would assist you in filling one there, as they have the same concerns.
 
Does the child have a Law Guardian?
 
 
I would attempt to get an order locally asap  (in the a.m), and if refused drive it to the county  ( and state) that has juristidition with supporting documentation.
KSMarks

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #12 on: Jun 09, 2009, 07:05:36 PM »
No not the same thing. You file in family court, can do it yourself, asking for emergency temporary custody due to abuse/allegations. State you have a dr letter and that CPS opened a case and child is due back to mom on Monday.
This will be several hours at the court house. Someone will type up the petition for you and you will then go before a judge and state your case, judge will then make a decision if you have enough for emergency custody. You can file the restraining order at the same time, naming both mother and grandfather. I would do it tomorrow since mothers small town cop may have her go get one on you first... The sheriff in her county I will serve her the RO.

You can get a lawyer to file for you and go with you.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #13 on: Jun 09, 2009, 07:14:07 PM »
Well fortunately the custody court order is through our county. DF is planning on going to the courthouse tomorrow as soon as he gets the letter from the doctor.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #14 on: Jun 09, 2009, 07:16:41 PM »
Oh and no, she does not have a GAL. She had one before after the first false allegations but the one we got was a piece of crap. We had to pay her $3000 to do absolutely nothing. She sided with mom before she even spoke with mom (she tried to get ahold of mom for three months and couldn't) and even told DF that most courts think that girls should go to moms and boys should go to dads (which was obviously her way of thinking). She said that even though DF was an awesome father she still though dd should go to BM.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #15 on: Jun 09, 2009, 07:25:18 PM »
Ocean - that sounds exactly like what a TPO is here. A restraining order is different though.

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #16 on: Jun 09, 2009, 08:24:07 PM »
Kitty -- we dealt with CPS, DHR, call them whatever, in BOTH states.
 
Each was passing the buck to the other state waiting for the other state to do something.
 
Alabama said "Child lives in WV, so WV has jurisdiction."
 
West Virginia said "Allegation happened in AL, so AL has jurisdiction"
 
and they sat tight waiting for the other state to do their thing.
 
It wasn't until I called and said WTF is going on, did the two states agree that the incident/allegation happened in AL, so AL had jurisdiction.  But WV interviewed our son because dad was withholding him there.  AL interviewed us because it happened in our home and we're here.
 
Point is that sometimes the parents have to get DHR's butt in gear otherwise you're left hanging and a child can be hurt.
 
(BTW -- Dad was found in contempt for withholding child.  SO -- before you withhold a child, you better make absolutely sure you can prove what you're going to accuse the other parent of doing.)
 
Civil stuff gets filed in the court that has jurisdiction -- which sounds like it's Georgia. 
 
But Dad needs to get smart on the criminal side of with holding a child from the other parent and whether or not GA state laws have a clause that says he can do so if he fears for the safety of the child.  And he better be able to prove his fears.
 
Sounds like they can do that.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #17 on: Jun 09, 2009, 08:40:44 PM »
You can file for the RO in family court if they were married. It can also be done in criminal court if you get a police report. Hmmm,,,did you/cps file a police report? Bring that to court with you also any paperwork or names and telephone numbers from cps. You can tell judge that the two states are seeing who has juristiction but in the meantime , time is running out for the child to go back.
Good luck!

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #18 on: Jun 09, 2009, 09:45:23 PM »
Yes, when we called CPS in GA they were closed so they just sent two officers over and we filed a report with them. So there is a police report here, but the detective in charge of it is the one who told us they would have to close the case soon since they don't have jurisdiction. We are trying desperately to file one in TN but the guy we have to file it with won't call us back (apparently only one cop in their town knows how to file a police report - WTF).

MB - so dad got held in contempt for holding the child? Did he not file a protective order or anything? The CPS doctor said that her letter would be enough for us to hold dd here, but I don't really believe her. Although we do have a clause in the custody order that says both parents "must follow all doctor's orders" so if the doctor orders dd to stay here, would we be in contempt? On one hand, we're violating the visitation agreement, but on the other hand, we're following the doctor's orders like the CO says we have to.

BM withheld dd from us last time before she got the TPO and our lawyer told us that even though she violated the court order and was in contempt, she probably wouldn't actually be held in contempt since she thought dd was being abused. So it would probably depend on the judge if we would actually be found in contempt. I have no idea what DF will do if we can't get a TPO.

You people have been so helpful. Thank you so much. DF and I are really stressed over this and it's hard when we have to keep a straight face on for dd's sake.

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #19 on: Jun 10, 2009, 06:26:09 AM »


MB - so dad got held in contempt for holding the child? Did he not file a protective order or anything? The CPS doctor said that her letter would be enough for us to hold dd here, but I don't really believe her. Although we do have a clause in the custody order that says both parents "must follow all doctor's orders" so if the doctor orders dd to stay here, would we be in contempt? On one hand, we're violating the visitation agreement, but on the other hand, we're following the doctor's orders like the CO says we have to.


On the day that our son was supposed to return south and come here, dad didn't send him and put him on a plane.  So I filed a "Motion for Contempt"and in it I said something like "Dad took the law into his own hands and failed to file a Motion with the court requesting that he not have to return the child."  Well, the day he got the Motion for Contempt, he filed an Emergency Motion which did just that.  The judge heard all of our motions together (along with two others) and said that his Emergency Motion was really an answer to my motion.    But the thing is that the Emergency Motion initially was handled separately and I had 30 days to answer.  In my answer I requested that the Emergency Motion be combined for a hearing along with the other three pending motions on XX date where there was already a hearing scheduled.    So even though he declared an emergency, I had 30 days to respond.  And nothing that came in the letter of instructions from the court said that Dad was allowed to hang on to the child even if his 30 days were up.


Quote
  BM withheld dd from us last time before she got the TPO and our lawyer told us that even though she violated the court order and was in contempt, she probably wouldn't actually be held in contempt since she thought dd was being abused. So it would probably depend on the judge if we would actually be found in contempt. I have no idea what DF will do if we can't get a TPO.


See that's just it.  If you can't prove that her keeping the child from you was malicious and that she willfully violated the order, there will be no contempt.  What there will be is missed time with targeted parent that can't be made up.

Go over to Soc's page -- even if he isn't there -- and search on elements of contempt and you'll find the post where the original soc outlined three key elements.

I don't know how many times EX#3's EX "got away with hiding" behind her concern that Dad was abusing her and her children and wasn't found in contempt when she kept the kids from him.

GA DHR Closed?  Keep after them.  And then you'll also be entering a whole 'nother world where even working with them leaves a bitter taste in your mouth sometimes.
 
BTW -- when you called CPS in GA, did you call the next day, and the next, and so on until you got a hold of a WARM body?  I'd be calling and knocking on their door until I got someone.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #20 on: Jun 10, 2009, 08:39:50 AM »
MB - When we called GA CPS they responded immediately.  We are not having an issue with them and they have still been in contact with us.  They just can't do anything else until they get the approval from TN.  It was the police office here that said they would have to close their case. 
 
This all happened on Sunday and we didn't realize we had to call TN CPS until Monday night, so that's when we did it.  DF called them again yesterday and found out that they did open a case, so he left a message with the caseworker.  He will call again later today if he still hasn't heard from them, but I think they are supposed to respond within 48 hours no matter what.  I guess maybe they don't see it as a high priority since she's not supposed to go back until Sunday.
 
The TN caseworker is the same one that dealt with the false allegations last time (I'm really sorry if I keep repeating myself - I've got a lot on my mind, as you can imagine!).  I asked DF how the guy treated him last time and he said he felt the guy was unbiased and professional.  So that makes me feel better.  If he was unbiased last time then he should be this time as well.
 
DF talked to the GA CPS doctor here and she is faxing him the letter saying dd needs to stay here in the jurisdiction of GA.  If he gets it in time then he will go to the courthouse today, otherwise he will go first thing in the morning.
 
 

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #21 on: Jun 10, 2009, 11:02:53 AM »
sounds like you two are on the right track.
 
Good luck for the sake of the child!

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #22 on: Jun 10, 2009, 02:27:46 PM »
You would be miles ahead in protecting your daughter if you got her out of the CPS system and relied on the judicial system and law enforcement systems to do their jobs.
 
What will you do if CPS says daughter goes back to mom ??
 
How did we as a society (and this board) come to the point of depending on an outfit like CPS to protect a child.  Their history is absolutely miserable.
 
Please think about it.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #23 on: Jun 10, 2009, 02:45:51 PM »
So we have to wait until tomorrow to try to file the TPO. DF talked to the sheriff in TN and he seemed helpful. He said great things about the caseworker in TN that was assigned to our case. However, when the caseworker finally called today he was like, "Okay, so what do you want to tell me?" DF said he kind of got the impression the guy had already talked to BM (which aren't the supposed to talk to the person who filed the complaint FIRST?). The guy really didn't ask that many questions but it seemed like he already had the information from GA CPS. Fortunately though, it looks like they are going to let GA CPS do the investigation so it doesn't really matter if TN believes us or not. GA has talked to dd and knows how verbal and communicative she is.

The lady at the TPO office today said that we need to bring dd to the courthouse tomorrow when we file the petition. Are they going to want to ask her questions about what happened? Because we're not supposed to talk to her about it and I don't want them asking questions to mess up the forensic interview. I don't mind bringing her so they can talk to her to see how verbal and aware she is, but I don't want them asking her about the incident when they're not trained to do so.

Davy - we aren't just relying on CPS. We are trying to work with the judicial system too but so far they have been less helpful than CPS has been. I swear the lady at the TPO office today was about to laugh when we told her our 3 year old said her great grandfather has been touching her. Fortunately, the lady that was there today isn't the lady that will be helping us tomorrow. But so far, CPS in GA has been absolutely wonderful and it has been a positive experience with them. It's TN that sucks.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #24 on: Jun 10, 2009, 03:17:54 PM »
No way...why does the 3 year old have to go? The only person I would allow to talk to daughter is the judge at the courthouse. (which I can not believe will want to do that)
Now that GA is taking case, cant GA CPS get the retraining order on behalf of the child and place daughter with you?
If you have someone else that can be on stand by near the courthouse with daughter, I would do that. Have a friend watch her and if needed you can have her there in 5 minutes. She does NOT need to be overhearing adults talk about this and you can say that. WHen you need child, she will be here but I dont want her overhearing adult conversations, she already spoke to a dr for her behalf and we have that documentation.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #25 on: Jun 10, 2009, 07:26:05 PM »
Well DF and I are both going so we figured I would wait outside with dd while he spoke with whoever.  I really think she didn't know what she was talking about because I can't imagine the judge talking to dd either.  But we will bring her just in case.

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #26 on: Jun 11, 2009, 06:31:30 AM »
I think you have to use all the tools that are out there to protect a child.
 
good luck and let us know how it goes.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #27 on: Jun 11, 2009, 08:34:16 AM »
DF called this morning and the lady in charge confirmed that no, we did not need to bring dd.  However, when we got there she said we have to file in TN.  The only way we could file here is if the abuse occurred here, which it didn't.  So we will be driving to TN tonight so that we can file a TPO tomorrow.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #28 on: Jun 11, 2009, 02:30:55 PM »
Is your state opening and keeping case? I cant believe how slow it is ... Why cant the DS lady file for you in behalf of the child?

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #29 on: Jun 11, 2009, 03:30:55 PM »
Our state has a case opened but they're only keeping it open in order to help out TN.  I don't think the TN caseworker really believes it yet because of the previous false allegations, so of course he's not going to offer to file for you.  And GA can't file one here.  I don't really know enough about CPS so maybe they aren't allowed to file for you in our state.  That may be different for different states.

I do know that BM had to come here last time and file herself, so they didn't file for her either.

The reason it is so slow is because of the two states.  It's like we were doing so well with progress but then had to start all over.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #30 on: Jun 11, 2009, 05:28:36 PM »
Does BM know? Has she called child and said anything? Did you get anywhere filing the police report on the phone? If not, maybe go real early, stop at police station, get report and go straight to court house...
GOOD LUCK!

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #31 on: Jun 11, 2009, 06:45:41 PM »
Currently GA has custody jurisdiction concerning this child and the child is a purported victim of a crime in TN.  If you file in TN the father is submitting to TN jurisdiction giving TN jurisdiction in all custody matters going forward.   TN has jurisdiction over the accused  where the crime occured and TN law enforcement should be filing this criminal matter with the TN prosecutors. 
 
Stay in GA and get a restraining order effecting the current custody order.
 
The info. you're getting from clerks, CPS , whoever is in error and this little girl needs legal representation in GA.  NOW !!  Pawpa may not use his finger next time.  Please listen and protect this little girl.
 
I'm speaking in honor of my own daughter.  You don't want your daughter to go there.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #32 on: Jun 11, 2009, 07:38:14 PM »
Davy- She tried to file a police report in her state...they refused since the crime happened in TN. We had this issue on a smaller level between counties in my state (not abuse but criminal crime). The police here would not file, we had to drive to where it happened and have them write a report then they called another police station to go make the arrest charge. We even went to the state troopers office who we thought had control over whole state and was told then dont go into that county. Everyone passed the buck that night and it took about 5 hours for a report and arrest.

I cant imagine what they are going through now dealing with so many agencies pointing fingers at the next one. CPS should be in control, take child away from mom and place with dad until the investigation is complete. Criminal charges should be started. Why it is taking days I dont know. Good thing that had a few days to deal with this but now it comes down to tomorrow then the weekend and child is supposed to go back to mom's house.

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #33 on: Jun 12, 2009, 06:40:54 AM »
I agree -- if the crime happened in TN, that's where jurisdiction for the crime happens.
 
I do not agree that it gives TN jurisdiction automatically or at all over the custodial stuff.  We had on-going litigation when my experience happened and the drawback was that the social worker here in AL was supposed to TESTIFY that that she wrote the letter I had saying nothing happened in AL.  WV interviewed our son and sent their recommendation back to AL.  But court was in WV.  And when I went to enter into evidence the letter AL sent, the judge did not allow it because the author/originator was not there to testify to the authenticity of the letter.
 
 

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #34 on: Jun 12, 2009, 10:36:07 AM »
This is not as complicated as everybody seems to be making it.
 
First we have a GA jurisdiction concerning custody matters,  GA is FAILING (thru CPS) to restrain the little girl from being placed back into an abusive environment with apparant evidence from a doctor's exam.  One has to ask why this little girl is wandering around TN being sexually abused ... what lead to this point.  Since the father has gone to TN to file a TPO that means to me it is a filing in TN civil court under the GA custody order and in so doing he would be relinquishing GA jurisdiction for all custody matters in the future in what appears to be a MORE mommy bias TN court.
 
From my best knowledge a criminal prosecution would follow a complaint and subsequent investigation by law enforcement as well as the prosceutor.  I may be wrong but I do not think an out-of-state citizen (daddy) in a criminal investigation can get a court order operating under criminal statues to restrict another citizen (little girl) in another state (ie GA)The jurisdiction of a TN criminal court would end at their state line.  The same reason GA LE can not take a complaint for a criminal matter in TN.
 
So father must be filing in Tn civil....a HUGE mistake.

Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #35 on: Jun 12, 2009, 12:14:10 PM »
Question, tho........
 
Are we talking about the difference between a criminal TPO or a civil TPO?  I agree, it depends on which type is being filed as to which state it needs to be filed in.  BUT a lot will also depend on if charges are eventually brought on the g-father, which has to be done in the state where the g-father lives.
 
There are so many 'ifs' in this case that it's hard to say which way is right.  About the only thing I could suggest is filing in BOTH states, just to c.y.a............
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #36 on: Jun 12, 2009, 01:45:42 PM »
NOPE !  Again. GA has jurisdiction over all custody matters based on UCCJA and PKPA interstate statues and filing in TN puts that jurisdiction at risk.
 
I really feel sorry for this little girl.  The deadline for restrain is practically over.  Since the father is in TN and the motion needs to be filed in GA then the only possible way is a phone call to GA CPS who have failed/refused to do so up until this point. 
 
The MAIN focus has / should be protecting this little girl  IMMEDIATELY not bringing criminal charges against the accused.  CPS and all it's fans should be ashamed.

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #37 on: Jun 12, 2009, 07:34:21 PM »
but Davy how does she MAKE GA take the case? They have the case open..but trying to pass it off to TN plcus the police wont take a report by them...
I dont understand why GA CPS wont take child from mom and place with dad until investigation is over and they should be handling the particulars...calling TN...getting RO in place, getting facts and filing police reports. SOunds like no one wants to do their job and passes it on...
Hope that got somewhere today...

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #38 on: Jun 12, 2009, 08:55:08 PM »
Ocean;  I don't have an answer.  What I do know is that it is a national disgrace that  has been going on forever and a day.  At risk Children are not protected by the system.  Here we have two states apparently finding feeble excuses not to protect the child.  It appears from what has been posted...doctors report and all, that at very least the child could be removed from both environments until more facts are known.
 
... more later

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #39 on: Jun 13, 2009, 09:12:22 PM »
Wow - I'm sorry that I didn't get on here sooner to post an update.

TN judge did sign an ex parte order of protection against both BM and great-grandfather.  The hearing is until June 22nd (which we will NOT be bringing her to), which means that we will have her until at least the following Sunday, June 28th (normal pick-up/drop-off day).  So she is safe for now!

The TPO specifically says that it is only giving TN TEMPORARY jurisdiction over the custody, so we are not handing everything over to them.

BM called a bunch of times on Thursday trying to talk to DSD but we ignored most of the calls.  After about 20, we finally sent her a text message saying DSD was not with us (which she wasn't, since we had already dropped her off with my aunt).  She sent us one more message on Friday and hasn't contacted us since, so we're pretty sure she's already been served since they said they would try to do it that day.

I'm a little worried about pp who said their letter was thrown out since that person wasn't there to testify.  I don't anticipate anyone from GA driving up there to testify so I guess our main focus will be on trying to get the TN CPS caseworker to believe us and get on our side so that he can testify on our behalf.  I am hoping that the forensic interview will be enough to convince him as I am POSITIVE DSD will confirm the abuse during their report.  She mentioned it again that "Papaw put his finger inside me and hurt me" so I know it is still fresh in her mind, the poor girl.

Kitty C.

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #40 on: Jun 13, 2009, 10:01:40 PM »
THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!
 
I just want you to know that, regardless of what can be done or what should be done and all the bureaucratic BS between the states involved, you and Dad are doing the right thing in doing all YOU can to protect her.  I wish you the best in this struggle and I pray that, if it is determined by law that a crime has been committed, the guilty party is charged and convicted so that this precious girl never will suffer at their hands again.  Please keep us informed on what is going on........there are many here who are just as concerned and praying for the best, I am sure.
Handle every stressful situation like a dog........if you can't play with it or eat it, pee on it and walk away.......

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #41 on: Jun 13, 2009, 11:20:26 PM »
Well SAID KITTY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
and wisper to her  "we love you" along with gentle hugs and kisses .........

MixedBag

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #42 on: Jun 14, 2009, 06:20:35 AM »
ditto!

ocean

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #43 on: Jun 14, 2009, 08:01:01 AM »
Thanks for letting us know...thinking about it all week how the courts just take their time and dont protect the child.

Did you say anything to her about why she is staying with you and not going back to mom's? Can you get a therapist this week to see you guys and help you say the right things to her (plus one more person to help your case). Make sure it is a child psychologist and meet them first and feel them out. See if you like them, if not move on to the next one. Took us 3 tries to get one that we liked.

Do you have to get a lawyer for this or does CPS take it to court?
I am so happy that TN did the right thing, did they let you file a police report too? Then the criminal investigation should start too.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #44 on: Jun 14, 2009, 10:54:54 AM »
I'm pretty sure that GA CPS will pick the psychiatrist that will do the interview with DSD, not us.  They were waiting on TN CPS to give them okay, and on Thursday TN CPS said they were 'taking care of it' so I hope that means they are working with GA to get everything set up. 

Thank you for the encouragement.  We were starting to doubt ourselves but then DSD brought it up two more times this past weekend.  I have no doubt in my mind that it happened and I have no doubt that she will talk about it when they interview her.  She is very specific about what she says.  We are making sure that we acknowledge what she says but we are not asking her any more questions because we don't want to unintentionally put any ideas in her head.

We have not really brought up the fact that she is staying with us longer.  She has not asked to call her mommy or see her or anything, so we are just waiting for her to bring it up. 

Davy

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #45 on: Jun 14, 2009, 01:53:00 PM »
Just curious.  Did the PO include no phone contact by both BM and whats-his-name ?
 
One might assume but ........
 
Just for your consideration in future dealings .... It is known and documented, mosty found from studies concerning "false accusations" like daddy just defeated.  IT goes some like this : it is NOT at all surprising (ie common) to find previous false accusations by the actual or real abuser, in other words the false accuser is the real abuser.
 
Unfortunately, many discover this too late.  In my beginning,  I always maintained that there was no way their mother would ever allow anything bad to happen to her children ... not in a 1000 years.  I nearly lost it upon discovering just the tip of the iceberg.

amymarie

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Re: Possible child abuse
« Reply #46 on: Jun 14, 2009, 04:00:26 PM »
Yes, neither BM nor the grandfather are allowed to call either. 

So it is common in false accusations that the child IS being abused, just not by the person being accused?  That is interesting.  As soon as my family found out, they made the comment that they wondered if BM knew about this when she made the false accusations (they were actually last year, not this year, so at the time dd was too young to either confirm or deny it).  Like maybe she knew there was something going on so she wanted to try to pin it on DF so that she could get full custody (ever since they split she has done nothing but try to push him out of his daughter's life).

 

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