Lawyer letting BM take kids out of state despite court order keeping them here!

[KathyNY]

Court is at 2:00, my FH just called to say the law guardian wants to meet with us at 1:00- apparently my suspicions about the kids saying (separetely) that "only mom talked to that man" were not unfounded, because the LG said he had a chance to talk to BM and wants a few minutes w/ FH now.  

We think maybe BM thinks getting married in Illinois (if that's really what is happening, but we're trying to trust what we were told) will help here, maybe by establishing residency or something?  Who knows.  And she can say they moved for her "husband's" job all she wants- it can be proven that he put in for the transfer before they even got engaged, and that they got married less than six weeks later.  I know other people have gotten married immediately after having gotten divorced, so that may not be as relevant as the rushed time frame, but the main point our lawyer will make is that it's not BM's job that they're moving for.  Even if they were already married before he took the transfer, some courts will consider a move for a husband's job a valid reason, but they still take the other factors into consideration, which she meets none of (it's not increasing their economic stability, she's not moving them closer to family, etc).

Like I said, I'm sure all we'll get out of today is the trial start date, but I'm hoping we'll get something in writing about this "wedding" trip and then FH will request that passport alert.  It certainly can't hurt.  

[Mamacass]

I know how you feel!  My husband hates confrontation, and avoids bringing anything up that may rock the boat where BM is concerned.  In the past I think he has been scared to make her mad, b/c she is unstable and when she's mad we only get to see my SS for standard visitation.  As it is we have an arrangement outside the courts to get him way more.  
It's been really tough though, b/c many times I have told husband to stand up for himself and quit letting her make all the decisions.  Sometimes he listens and sometimes he doesn't.  Many times, we have talked about going for custody, but then she "Straightens up" and starts acting like a reasonable person.  Its like she senses when she's pushed us to our limits.  And each time my husband backs off, only to have her started acting up 6-12 mos. later.  And everytime he kicks himself for being back in the same situation and not going for custody the last time.  I have to bite my tongue from saying "I told you so."  But at the same time, my husband understands that SS needs his mom, and when she can be stable my husband doesn't want to be the dad that takes the kid away from his mom.
Also, many times I've given my husband advice, just to have him ignore it until our lawyer tells him the SAME THING.  It drives me nuts.  
We are finally going for custody now.  In a way I'm glad that she finally pushed too far.  But at the same time I hate what this is going to do to SS.  He will either end up in antoher state with his mom, or he will live fulltime with us and have to visit his mom in her new state.  Etiher way, he's in for some changes.  And for no reason other than she wants to move closer to the boyfrined of the month.  I'll just be glad to know that when we have custody we make choices for SS that are in his best interest.  It's been too long that choices for his life have been based on her whims and moods.  
I don't know if this helps, but I've learned alot over the past 6 yrs as far as dealing w/ my husband.  When my husband is upset b/c she's pulling something new, I let him talk when he's ready.  If I push him, it just stresses him out.  I take his cues too, as to when the conversation is over.  And if I still need to talk, he knows that I'll call my mom to vent.  I don't always agree with the decisions he makes, but I've learned to give him my two cents, and trust him.  Sometimes he's right, sometimes he's not.  A lot of times, I want to push him to say something to BM.  But he knows her better than me, and I have to trust that he will deal with her best.  Other times, he will hand the phone to me to speak with her, b/c he knows I can be calmer when he may be tempted to get more upset.  
Its not a perfect situation, but you do the best you can.  We still argue sometimes, but we refuse to let her ruin our evening/day/weekend.  

By the way, you mentioned a stepmom website, what is it? Y'all make it sound like a really great support.  

[KathyNY]

The stepmom website is //www.smoms.org.  Its SMOMS- stands for Stepmoms on a mission, founded by this awesome woman who is a motivational speaker.  There's a bulletin board like this one but it's temporarily down.  SMOMS like us go there to vent about our SO's and kids, and sometimes outside issue, and a few times lately a smom who is also a BM has given a POV from the BM side, which has angered and upset the smom posting.  So most of the smoms try wearing just their smom "hat" when online and leave their "BM" hat aside.  Who knows if there's a website for BM's- there probably is, and they're probably writing about us too!  

It was one of the girls from SMOMS that sent me here, and I added this website and a few others to the "tips" section of SMOMS, for people like me who first came to the site in a panic, looking for help at the beginning of this situation, not only for my sanity, but for my FH- and I found both.  

Good luck, and welcome!

[ocean]

How did it go today??

[KathyNY]

Neither my FH nor BM were allowed in, it was just the lawyers, the legal guardian and the Court Attorney Referee (CAR).  Before the conference we met w/ the law guardian, at his request.  He didn't ask my FH how he feels about the kids, or what he wants, or what their relationship is like- he sat us down, told us their divorce is final so BM is taking the kids w/ her to get married this weekend and would be back for our visit next weekend (he must not've known we already knew this).  I asked if we could get this in writing and he gave me a dirty look, said the courts have jurisdiction, they'll handle it.

He asked my FH why there's no order of support in their divorce and my FH explained that in their sep. agreement they waived the typical 25%, which came out to about $200/wk and he agreed to pay her $250 since she wasn't working, to help cover her own expenses, until she got settled, w/ the understanding that would be dropped to $200 when she did.  That was 4 years ago.  She finally reduced it in writing in the divorce decree this May.  The LG asked FH how much he made last year, said if BM has to stay here, she'll put the kids in day care and FH will have to pay for 1/2 so he figures he'll be paying atleast $300/wk- and asked us if it's WORTH it to us to pay any extra money!  I looked at FH and said $100 extra/wk?  That's worth it to me to keep the kids here!  LG tried pushing that if BM goes CS will be reduced and we'll have that much more $ to spend on the kids when they're here.  We said it's not about the $, its about them spending time with their dad.  He kept saying "you'll have them for the summers and school breaks...or, whoever does, and vice versa" after catching himself.  

He was OBviously on her side, didn't even want to hear what FH's idea of what he felt the children's best interests were, or asked us what we might suggest, just threatened us, basically, with charging us more $ in CS and made it clear that his position is that it's in the best interest of the kids to go with their mom and not have this court battle continue.  

At one point he started to say, "When you have them for the summer and school breaks you'll actually have them more than you do now..." and I started shaking my head.  He pointed at me, said "Why are you shaking your head?  Why don't you just excuse yourself?  This isn't even your issue!"  So I left the room, but not before I told FH to explain why I was shaking my head- because we added up the days and we have them more days now w/ EOW & 1 day/wk than her proposed 8 wk summer and 4 wks school breaks.  After I left the LG told FH what he meant was that during the 8 wk summer, since the kids won't be in school, we'll have them all day long, instead of just at night.  Um, excuse me?  WE don't get to take the 8 wks off of work, too!  So we won't get them any extra- they'll be w/ family members during the day or day care until we get out of work.  But FH didn't mention that.  He did, however, tell our attorney-stand-in that he got a bad vibe from the LG.  The attorney said that we're wrong, that the LG is neutral and comes across gruff cuz he's an ex-cop.  Exactly- that's the other problem- BM's stepdad is a cop so we bet they know each other and it's that whole "blue wall" thing going on.  If we can prove they ever worked together at any point, it will be a total conflict of interest, though I don't know how we'll be able to do that.  

So, as it stands, we're supposed to go back on the 18th, the same day as BM's 1st appearance in court for her older daughter's dad.  Then our trial is set to begin on the 29th (unless our lawyer, who wasn't there today, has to reschedule, cuz the dates were picked based on everyone else's schedules).  BM's not pleased because w/ our trial starting the 29th, the other trial won't start until after that, and the kids will obviously have to start school here after Labor Day, and not in Illinois on the 23rd.   Hope that Catholic school she enrolled them in didn't charge her a non-refundable deposit!

When we were leaving the court house, FH asked BM when she was leaving.  She said "I don't know."  He said he'd like to talk to the kids on the phone tonight, and told her if she doesn't have free long distance on her phone in IL that we do on ours, so we don't mind making the calls.  She said "Is that it?" all nasty like and I stepped in and said "Yes, but we were told you were leaving RIGHT after court."  She said "I AM leaving today, but OBviously I'm not home yet so I don't know what TIME I'm leaving yet."  exCUse us!  You just told us you don't know when you're leaving, when all we meant was today or tomorrow!  She can be so nasty!  And we're worried for the kids because it's a 12 hr. drive and if she's not waiting until the morning to leave, she'll be driving all night after being up all day.  With 3 kids in the car.  Nice.  

[Genie]

special occasion to the judge etc and that is why it is being agreed that the children can go with her this time.  She is getting married.  How would it look for you guys if you are trying to deny the children to participate in their BM's wedding.  I don't think that would look good in the judge's eyes at all.

And you can't guarantee that the judge will agree that you can't trust her. He doesn't know her and will make his/her own assumptions.  And judges have taken sides and made assumptions that have really thrown people for a loop and are way off base. So never assume the judge will think as you do. That could backfire on you guys.

NY police won't go to IL to serve her if she doesn't return but you could go to IL police and try to get it enforced. Being in IL I know that is 50/50 chance there.

What County/Town is she moving too?  I can give you insight on the area and how the police are there if you let me know. I live in IL and know many all over the state and have dealt with many counties since my X's BM moved many times around the state.

You have to pull back from the situation a little or it will ruin your relationship with FH.  These are his kids and ultimately it is his decision what is done about this and any other situation. You can't force him to do what you want. What he decides you will have to live with.  If you don't then it will be a constant source of argument and stress for you and him.  Take it from me I know very well.  

Keep us posted and let us know how it goes.  What does her other X feel about her taking them to IL?  Is he agreeing as well?

[KathyNY]

They moved to Rockford, because he transfered to a plant in Belvedere with Daimler Chrysler/New Venture Gear.  

We can only trust that she'll be back next week.  If she isn't, both she & her lawyer are idiots and it works in our favor.  

I told FH last night and again today that I'm stepping back.  They're his kids and from now on he's going to have to decide what he wants.  Unfortunately, he doesn't even make decisions like what clothes to put on them, but I'm truly taking a backseat here, all around.  I have to- for my sake more than anyones.

We're now considering getting married, quitely, w/out telling anyone, to save us $ on my insurance premiums (I pay $120/month at work for single coverage- he's paying $80/month for FULL family coverage- and that won't change cuz we can take BM off and add me).  BUT, he & BM got married at City Hall cuz BM's daughter didn't have insurance, then had their reception a year later and never told anyone they were already married.  We've been planning our wedding and I'd hate 1) to do the same thing they did just because BM did it, and 2) to be deceptive like that.  But not only could we use the $ but our being married might help us if it's helping her.

Now, here's a question- the other dad's wife, the other stepmom involved here, was agreeing with me about how much it sucks when situations occur like today.  When the LG asked me to leave the room, said "It's not your issue."  Whether we're married or not, the only ones considered "involved" are the biological parents and the kids, right?  So, if I'm not a "factor" because I'm just the soon-to-be stepmom, why is BM's soon-to-be husband a factor?!  This whole issue is because of his move!  If we're not to be considered, us "stepparents" then why not just consider the move as BM moving to Illinois, and don't look at it as her moving for him?  That's bringing him into it and making him a factor, especially now that he's going to be the "husband" involved.  Yet I'm still not even allowed in on the conferences?!

[ocean]

Only the bio-parents are allowed in the conferences and in the court room. You may be called in as a witness. I remember once that our BM asked to have her new husband in and they said he was not one the parties to this case so no.
I am sorry to say but things will not get better with his ex. Either way this turns out she will always play her games. Have you ever read the disengage essay? I do not have it saved on this computer but maybe someone else can post it for you? It kept my sanity in the early years. You were a lot like me. Wanting to do the right thing and keeping your DH on track but really it made me nuts! LOL You should still make joint decisions on big things but when it comes to talking to BM, let him take care of that.
I am hoping that NY courts will do the right thing!
Keep us updated!

[KathyNY]

What is that?  I've never heard of it.  But if it helps with sanity, I'd love to check it out!  LOL

Our trial is set to begin 8/29.  Our lawyer hasn't said yet that I can't be in the courtroom- so far me & BM's mom have been allowed in for the pre-stuff, and I was told that if BM requests that I be kept out, then I'll have to stay out, but then FH can ask her mom or others on her side be kept out too.

I will keep you updated.  Thank you (all) for being so encouraging, and kind, and supportive.

[ocean]

Here is part of it that I saved:

In order to successfully disengage, you have to accept some realities. They are:

1. Your SKs are not your children.
2. You are not responsible for overcoming their previous "raising."
3. You are not responsible for what kind of people they are.
4. You are not responsible for what kind of people they become.
5. You are not obligated to become an abused member of the household just because you married their dad.
6. You are not responsible for raising your SKs.
7. All the responsibility belongs to your DH.
8. Your DH is not a mother.
9. Your DH is not going to raise his children the way you want him to.
10. Your SKs are not going to turn out the way they would if DH supported you.