Introduction

[Giggles]

Every case?  Even ones that involve violence?  Sorry, but I think that the status quo should remain.  If one parent has been primary, to change that abruptly on top of the parents splitting will only add more problems.  Obviously, the older the child the less likely this is.  If the parents want to try 50/50 physical, it would be better to work up to it rather than thrust a child into it.  Especially if the child(ren) are really young. 

I know that for my kids, had that happened, they would not have done well at all.  Even now, they would have a problem with it.  Not to the extent that they would have 4 years ago, but they would still have issues with it.  It would work well for me as it would give me more time to concentrate on rebuilding my career. 

In my kids case, if they were thrust into a week on week off situation, they would be the losers. 

Not every case involves violence.  So you would rather cut one parent down to a "visitor" in children's lives rather than them be a parent?  If you've never been in a 50/50 situation how would you know how it works?  How the children would react?  My daughter was 18 months old and did GREAT!!  Now she's nearly an adult...and is far more adjusted than many adults out there.  She has had both her parents in her life...not a primary and a visitor...she had PARENTS!!!

It seems to me from reading your posts...that you would've been the reason for your children not doing well.  Children do better with equal access to their parents....you don't think that should be and that is sad.,...I feel sorry for your children!!

[CuriousMom]

Giggles -

We were court ordered to take the co-parenting class, I think my area is starting to mandate it from the way my attorney spoke.  They actually asked when you registered the opposite parents name and if you were ever convicted of a crime/domestic violence/abuse - they made a point to seperate parents into different classes so they would feel comfortable sharing and contributing to the class.  I thought the instructor was great and kept my list of "I words" handy...still do :-)

[gemini3]

Every case?  Even ones that involve violence?  Sorry, but I think that the status quo should remain.  If one parent has been primary, to change that abruptly on top of the parents splitting will only add more problems.  Obviously, the older the child the less likely this is.  If the parents want to try 50/50 physical, it would be better to work up to it rather than thrust a child into it.  Especially if the child(ren) are really young. 

I know that for my kids, had that happened, they would not have done well at all.  Even now, they would have a problem with it.  Not to the extent that they would have 4 years ago, but they would still have issues with it.  It would work well for me as it would give me more time to concentrate on rebuilding my career. 

In my kids case, if they were thrust into a week on week off situation, they would be the losers. 

The status quo should not be based on a small percentage of cases - and cases that involve real domestic violence are a small percentage.  (Of course, all the false allegations skew the numbers.)

There should never be any talk of one parent being "primary".  Both parents are equally important in a child's life.  One parent staying at home while the other one provided enough income so that said parent could stay at home does not make the working parent "secondary".

An intact family is a shared parenting arrangement - so NOT doing that because of divorce (or other split if the couple isn't married) is something for the child to get used to, not the other way around.

It's a shame that you think your kids would be losers if they had a more equal parenting time arrangement.  I agree with giggles - maybe you're thinking has something to do with how well your kids adjusted to your divorce.  The parents are equally responsible for the child's adjustment post-divorce - and especially fostering a positive relationship with the other parent.

[Giggles]

Giggles -

We were court ordered to take the co-parenting class, I think my area is starting to mandate it from the way my attorney spoke.  They actually asked when you registered the opposite parents name and if you were ever convicted of a crime/domestic violence/abuse - they made a point to seperate parents into different classes so they would feel comfortable sharing and contributing to the class.  I thought the instructor was great and kept my list of "I words" handy...still do :-)

I'm glad to hear this!!  My X and I actually took it at different times.  He was reluctant at first...but afterwards we compared notes.  We agreed that is what helped us become better parents for our daughters sake!  Of course now my daughter at times gets miffed because her father and I are on the same page where she is concerned...hehehe

[Kitty C.]

Every case?  Even ones that involve violence?  Sorry, but I think that the status quo should remain.  If one parent has been primary, to change that abruptly on top of the parents splitting will only add more problems.  Obviously, the older the child the less likely this is.  If the parents want to try 50/50 physical, it would be better to work up to it rather than thrust a child into it.  Especially if the child(ren) are really young. 

I know that for my kids, had that happened, they would not have done well at all.  Even now, they would have a problem with it.  Not to the extent that they would have 4 years ago, but they would still have issues with it.  It would work well for me as it would give me more time to concentrate on rebuilding my career. 

In my kids case, if they were thrust into a week on week off situation, they would be the losers. 

Yes, EVERY case.........and you work from there.  Look at it like a point system:  you start with 50/50 and start deducting points for anything negative that would affect the child.  For example, if a parent has a criminal history that would have a severe detrimental affect on the child, that would severely limit the amount of parenting time to the child.  BUT....if that parent is able to clean up their act, make whatever amends needed (classes, fines, jail, etc.), and proves that they are ready and willing to co-parent, then a gradually increased parenting time should be considered.

I feel sorry for your kids, too.  Obviously you weren't or aren't willing to make the sacrifices necessary to make it work.  DS's dad and I had severe problems and he also was an alcoholic.  He ended up moving back to CA, but I told DS a long time ago that if he would have stayed in the area, I would have made sure DS saw his dad just as much as he saw me.  DS was surprised when I said it, as he knew we didn't get along personally, even tho we learned to effectively co-parent LD.  It would have been a huge sacrifice for me, considering I could have very easily had A&B charges filed against the ex when he tried to break my neck a few years before that.  It doesn't change the fact that we both love DS and DS loves us.  But if my ex would have proven that he could not handle it or it was detrimentally affecting DS, we would have had to make other arrangements.

As we're all fond of saying:  it's ALL about the kids and nothing about us.

[Davy]

Gemini,

Beautiful.  Your stated agenda is refreshing and uplifting.

Perhaps you should re-post it weekly so we can all be mindful of the many reasons we are lured to SPARC and the wealth of like-minded people that chimed in with still more valued input.    We all benefit and I am thankful to you and for you.   Your children and that lucky dog husband are blessed !

Maybe it is true that curiosity kills the cat.   I'm curious also.

[Momfortwo]

I feel sorry for your kids, too.  Obviously you weren't or aren't willing to make the sacrifices necessary to make it work. 

Feel more sorry for your kids.  It must be tough to have a mom who jumps to conclusions without knowing the full story.   I am not willing to risk my children's emotional well-being because some internet stranger thinks she knows my kids better than me.  You don't.  Nor do you know what is best for them.  You don't know their personalities.  You don't know anything about them.  The only kids that you would know what is best for are yours.

My kids are fortunate enough to have parents who DO get along for the most part.  And who put them first.  I know that is foreign concept for you because you simply refuse to see how a presumption of 50/50 physical can actually do harm to a child.  Fortunately for my kids, my ex and I aren't that blinded. 

BTW, all of the problems that everybody is posting here about with their ex's, I don't have with my ex.  Why?  Because what is in the kids' best interest is more important than what our rights are.  An example, my ex wouldn't show up at a game for the kids if he knew that the kids would not be able to participate as a result of his actions.  Another example, I suck it up and deal with the fact that my ex is there.  I even have him over to my house for the kids' bday parties.  Again, it's about putting the kid first.  Even if it means our rights get trampled.   

[Momfortwo]

It's a shame that you think your kids would be losers if they had a more equal parenting time arrangement.  I agree with giggles - maybe you're thinking has something to do with how well your kids adjusted to your divorce.  The parents are equally responsible for the child's adjustment post-divorce - and especially fostering a positive relationship with the other parent.

Uh, I don't recall stating that my kids' had a bad relationship with my ex.  They don't.  And the reason for that is because they weren't thrust into something that they couldn't handle.   

They could probably handle it better now that they are OLDER.  Because kids mature emotionally as they get older.  My ex, otoh, has a work schedule that simply does not allow more time with the kids, he doesn't even take them for an extended period in the summer (his choice).   As it is, when he sees them during the week depends on when he can get home at a reasonable hour.  I am the primary parent, it doesn't really matter if you like that terminology or not.  It simply is.   

BTW, parenting is rarely equal.  Even in intact families.   

[mdegol]

I really enjoy seeing the posts and the reasons that people are for joint physical. I have been reading a lot about shared parenting. To be honest, I was kind of put off by the idea at first. I see what you mean about starting at 50/50 and then working from there, depending on situation.  In my case, bf lives far away, but the more I hear of the reasoning, the more logical it sounds. And teacher's point is excellent. In today's world, so many actually caretake for kids, makes the argument about having two homes difficult on child moot. Also, hearing that it is working so well for so many people makes me feel more comfortable about it as well. I think Kitty is right, since a lot of arguing in court is about expectations, and what people think they are entitled to. Actually, in a married relationship it would be more of an adjustment for kids to only see one parent every other weekend. A great loss really. Parents have to make the commitment to live close together though (within same school district or other reasonable distance). But anyway, people who are able to do this right put their kids needs in front of their own, so that wouldn't be much of a sacrifice to be a major part of your kids life.

I guess the problem is that one bad apple spoils the bunch. In other words, everyone has to cooperate for it to be good. But parenting classes and other support, if it were put in place, would definitely help many people behave in a way that is in the best interest of their children. I really think one should have to take classes like this upon filing for divorce with children. That way you get introduced to the options early, before tons of harm has been done in the court system itself. And maybe give you a chance to rethink the relationship and whether or not it can be salvaged. Because, in the end, I think most parents want to do what is best for their kids, they just haven't been taught by society about shared parenting and how to do it. Mostly we just see the models of the fighting...the problems ect that we read about on here everyday.

[Momfortwo]

Not every case involves violence.  So you would rather cut one parent down to a "visitor" in children's lives rather than them be a parent?  If you've never been in a 50/50 situation how would you know how it works?  How the children would react?  My daughter was 18 months old and did GREAT!!  Now she's nearly an adult...and is far more adjusted than many adults out there.  She has had both her parents in her life...not a primary and a visitor...she had PARENTS!!!

It seems to me from reading your posts...that you would've been the reason for your children not doing well.  Children do better with equal access to their parents....you don't think that should be and that is sad.,...I feel sorry for your children!!

But you said every case.  BTW, feel more sorry for your kids.  They have a father who thinks that children are robots and act the same.   

Believe it or not, some parents do know their kids well enough to know how they would react to a schedule.   

Plus, there's the fact that my youngest became a completely different child personality wise when she was away from me for a whole week-end.  She was three at the time.  While your 18 month old may have done great, MY three year old couldn't even handle a whole week-end.  She's almost 8 now and is doing much better.   

I wouldn't jump to conclusions about how well my kids are doing.  Because they are doing very well.  They are happy and well-adjusted kids.  Your assumption that my kids aren't doing well simply because they weren't thrust into something that they couldn't handle really is off-base.   

I used to think that 50/50 physical was not good in any case.  I have since learned that kids are individuals.  One can't make a claim that kids' do better with equal access to their parents and have it be accurate 100% of the time.  Just like one can't make a claim that children do better when it isn't equal and have it be accurate 100% of the time.   

Your kid and my kid are perfect examples of that.  You had a child who handled it well.  I have a child who wouldn't have been able to.  Maybe, if my ex's schedule improves, that may change in the future.  But right now, 50/50 is not in MY kid's best interest.  And not because of my ex's schedule, but because of my kid's personality and emotional maturity.  Which is improving as she gets older.