Refusing visitation - please help with the opposite side of the coin

[snowrose]

I noted with interest this link below in a discussion where someone was being denied visitation due to the child being "sick" all the time.

http://www.deltabravo.net/custody/sickvisit.php (http://www.deltabravo.net/custody/sickvisit.php)

The article is quite adamant about a child's right to see their non-custodial parent and also that both parents should share custody during illness to show support.  My question is: what if anything do you do about a non-custodial parent that is constantly cancelling visitation due to "illness"?

For example, what do you do when the child has no fever, no cough, no runny nose but is simply cranky because she's been allowed to stay up late and she has a stuffy nose - but the BM brings the child back at 10PM at night - basically because the BM a) doesn't know how to parent and b) because the BM doesn't want to put up with a cranky child?

Today, SD visited with BM and BM told SD that she (BM) was angry with my DH because he allowed SD to go to BM's when she had a stuffy nose!  I mean, come on!  A stuffy nose!!    

What do you think?  Do we need to put a modified version of the above link into our parenting plan so BM knows that it is considered proper for the child to go to a parent's home when they have a very minor childhood illness?

[Kitty C.]

......Because like the old saying goes:  'You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.'  You can give her all the visitation possible, but if she doesn't want to parent, for any reason whatsoever, you can't force her to do it.

'Do we need to put a modified version of the above link into our parenting plan so BM knows that it is considered proper for the child to go to a parent's home when they have a very minor childhood illness?'

Don't waste your time...........it's obvious that the child is an 'inconvenience' to her, so no matter what you do, she won't change her ways unless SHE wants to............

[snowrose]

Don't waste your time...........it's obvious that the child is an 'inconvenience' to her, so no matter what you do, she won't change her ways unless SHE wants to............

Agreed, she won't change her ways unless she wants to.   

The reason for my interest in doing this, or emailing the information to her, is to disspell what appears to be her belief that she is correct in thinking that we are being bad parents by sending SD to her when SD has a stuffy nose.   

What I want BM to see is that basically the courts do not feel we're bad parents for doing this, that the courts feel that both sides should be taking care of a sick child and that a mildly sick child that can still go to school can be sent to the non-custodial parent.

I want BM to see that she would have no support from the courts and no support from CPS for her attitude.

[gemini3]

I think it's an error to assume that people like that will respond to logic or reason.  They won't.  You'll just frustrate yourself.

[MixedBag]

ditto. 

[snowrose]

I think it's an error to assume that people like that will respond to logic or reason.  They won't.  You'll just frustrate yourself.

I'm not so sure it would frustrate me.  I don't expect her to change her actions - she's a nutbar.  I just want to challenge her assumptions.

I've already decided it would be best not to email it until after Thursday, until after her last visit this week with SD.  But still haven't made up my mind if I'll actually send it.  Time will tell...

[Kitty C.]

'What I want BM to see is that basically the courts do not feel we're bad parents for doing this, that the courts feel that both sides should be taking care of a sick child and that a mildly sick child that can still go to school can be sent to the non-custodial parent.

I want BM to see that she would have no support from the courts and no support from CPS for her attitude.'

Don't waste your time, because she won't listen to you.  And if she tries to take this to CPS, they'll think she's nuts and tell you it's unfounded.  If she tries to take it to court, tell the court she has filed a frivilous lawsuit and she should be required to pay ALL atty. and court fees.  The ONLY way you might get her to understand this concept is if it comes from a position of authority that she cannot dispute.

As long as you continue to respond to her complaints in the way she expects, things will stay the same.

What she's telling you is just a bunch of hot air....to hide the fact that the child is a nuisance to her and claiming that sending the child to her when she has the sniffles makes you bad parents so that you'll keep the child.  It's nothing but a cover-up and a way of deflecting her ineptness as a parent.  When you peel the layers away and see why she's doing what she's doing, it should make it easier to understand and deal with, so that the next time she tries to pull it, you can tell her that if she's incapable of being a parent to a mildly sick child, no problem.........or say nothing at all, shrug your shoulders, and walk away, leaving HER to deal with her reflection in the mirror.

I'm quite fond of that...........when someone tries to deflect their responsibilities on me, I just bounce it right back at them....leaving them no one to blame but themselves!

[snowrose]

As long as you continue to respond to her complaints in the way she expects, things will stay the same.

She hasn't complained to us.  She's told SD9 that she's mad at us because we sent SD to her "sick".  She uses this to try to deflect how SD see her (BM) and color how SD sees us.

or say nothing at all, shrug your shoulders, and walk away, leaving HER to deal with her reflection in the mirror.

I'm quite fond of that...........when someone tries to deflect their responsibilities on me, I just bounce it right back at them....leaving them no one to blame but themselves!

I think her mirror is air brushed.  When she sees her reflection she only sees it through her own eyes as her being the victim, she needs to be shown how authorities would view her.  Authorities will hold some weight.  What we believe will not.

[gemini3]

Unfortunately the only person who can show her what "authorities" will think/do are thosr authorities.  She won't hear it coming from you.  She's not going to hear it from this website either, because she'll see it as a father's rights group and discount everything that is written here.

You're obviously frustrated with her, or you wouldn't be considering this route.  I said that because sometimes it helps to consider why you're doing something and what you hope to get out of it.  If you want to protect the kids, goading her is not the way to do it.  That will just make her more angry, and more likely to say things to them.  Concentrate your efforts on the kids.  You can't do anything about the crazy.

[Fatherforever]

My Ex wife is the same way when it comes to our two boys.

She has played every trick in her twisted book to find reasons not to have them when they're sick. She constantly complains to me that "they are always sick when they are with me!" and threatens me with legal action or calling the CPS for neglect, because I don't take them to the doctor for every cough or stuffy nose.

Taking it a step farther, according to our divorce decree we are both to provide separate health insurance for both our boys. She doesn't hold any insurance for them, so without fail she calls me at least once on her weekends claiming that the children our sick and I need to take them to the doctor. I refuse everytime. She throws a fit, leaves horrible voicemails and threatening text messages and by the end of the weekend when she drops them off to me, the children our just fine and she doesn't utter a single word about it.

She has started a new habit now, of refusing to have the children for her time, when she is sick... claiming she doesn't want to get them sick. But quite honestly she doesn't want to have to take care of her children when she is a bit under the weather.

To help out, my girlfriend writes out each event that my Ex pulls, soif she did try to actually take this to court, we would have all hercrazy accusations, outburst etc. to show the judge.

She only wants the children when they are happy and healthy, if they are sick or ornery... I will always be guaranteed a phone call from her to tell me what a horrible father I am.