What can actually happen in an appeal?

[dipper]

Hi all, we are considering if we would even have a chance at an appeal....I dont know what takes place.

DH went to court yesterday - he proved change in circumstances.  The judge stated that and that ss had said he wanted to live with dh.  But, after only being with ss for about five minutes, the judge said that ss manipulates his parents and the court system.  SS' behavior is to the point that criminal charges were filed last fall.  He will probably get probation.  

Court order states there is to be no negative talk in front of ss about the other parent.  BM admitted to cursing dh repeatedly in front of ss.  Then her lawyer asked dh if he does this and he said no...and the lawyer said - is that just because of the court order.  DH said the court order does forbid it and he doesnt do it...doesnt really remember ever cursing her..........But, the lawyer persisted that dh had at some point and this was the pot calling the kettle black (or vice versa)..and the judge found this to be amusing.  

BM wants dh to pay her for bandages that she purchased for ss and never used.....and donated.  She had stopped using them when she bought them.......The judge thought it was wonderful of her to have donated the bandages.  DH isnt responsible for her donations!!!

Well, bm brought up past issues on the stand...things that have been discussed in prior court hearings - which custody orders were issued at those times.  Both lawyers were new and hers may have not known this......She lied and lied - claiming she takes ss to church every weekend he is home (she has went once in ss' lifetime), she never leaves him home alone, Shriner's will only allow the PCP to travel free....  DH's lawyer did not do a good job of catching this though he had the proof in his folder......

IN the end, the judge said that dh had proved his burden of change in circumstances and ss does want to live with us...but he is not going to give him what he wants................He will probably get in trouble if he lived here............and after saying that he believes ss will get into serious trouble as he gets older told dh that he doesnt even know WHY dh would want ss to live here...........

Now, I think because of the fact that she lied and brought up past issues to bias the judge.........I think the burden of dh being the best parent going forward may not have been met.

In an appeal, would we be able to present her perjury and facts that were not presented during the hearing itself?   CAn we fight the fact that she knowingly presented issues already dealt with in past cases?

[stk_agn]

I just got my opinion from the Appeals Court and I lost because my lawyer let me run out of time for filing the Notice of Appeal. Don't let this happen to you.

I know if my lawyer had done what we told her to do I would have won because the decision from circuit court was biased and I proved emotional abuse on my child from my mother.

You can argue any points that you want to argue but the judges in the appeals court don't have to address them. We did our appeal pro se because my lawyer quit (Which we got her saying that she quit on tape from the court house.) and we argued 4 points but they only addressed one of them.

It took almost a year from the time we filed our appeal to the time we got the opinion/decision from the appeals court. It takes a long time.

Another thing you should think about is that the appeals court could also dismiss your case if they feel like you don't have a case or if they feel like you are waisting your time and theirs.

But anyways, good luck on your case, I hope it turns out better for you that it did for me.

You should talk to your lawyer and see what he/she has to say about it.

[dipper]

Thanks for your input.  Unfortunately, I am worried about our lawyer.   I flawed in one essential element of picking a lawyer - I got one who got a flat fee.  He didnt nearly put in the time to justify that fee - didnt subpoena any information or summons anyone to court...and he had postponed for just that reason......

My dh's ex got away with a lot of lies in court because the lawyer just wasnt that aware of all the information we had given him.

Today, I took off of work just to see the lawyer.  Time is running out...they gave me an appt. this afternoon, so I took that off.  Then they called back and asked to come in this AM so I took all day off .  This morning they call and cancel completely.....so, I lost a day of work for nothing.  My dh cant keep missing work as he doesnt get personal or sick days.

How do you find caselaw and codes and statutes to support your claims?

Do you file the brief with your appeal request?


If it takes that long for an appeal, it may be better to just wait and refile...which we have told ss that we will next year if he still wants to come here to live.....he will be 15 then.

I just think its awful for someone to force their chidl to live with them..knowing we are just as capable.........she just wants to hurt dh and take his money.......its all about control.....

[hagatha]

Dipper,

I think the Judge made his decision based on more than you think. You may not want to hear this, but I think in some ways the Judge was right about what will probably happen with son.

You guys have to really think about the possibility of son manipulating the situation. All kids play their parents off each other, and in divorce situations it can be done so well the parents doen't even see it happening. You don't know what was said by son to the Judge. And you don't know what other information the Judge had available, like info from the criminal court. The son is acting out and I think the Judge believes it will get worse. If you had custody, you would be responsible for any/all criminal charges. Right now his mother can be held responsible for his actions. Some criminal courts force the custodial parent to pay all the fines etc for the children.

Personally, I think the Judge decided mommy dearest created this monster and he wants her to deal with the consequences of her and sons actions. Kind of like sparing you the heartache of dealing with the aftermath of her destruction. That is what a Judge told my DH during the last court hearing.

Hopefully son will grow a brain and realize what he is doing will effect the rest of his life. But untill that time, someone has to hold him responsible for HIS actions. HE is more than old enough to know right from wrong. No matter how permissive his mother may be, he still knows what acceptable behavior is, and must make a choice on his own to be responsible for his actions.

The Witch

Remember . . . KARMA is a Wonderful Thing!!!!!

[stk_agn]

>>>How do you find caselaw and codes and statutes to support your claims? Search the internet with keywords as "Case Law (your state) or (your state) custody laws,

I used sites such as Findlaw,,,, Codes (or Statutes) in my state are names "KRS" (Kentucky Revised Statutes)


>>>Do you file the brief with your appeal request?

No you need to file the Notice of Appeal first and then you file the brief. You can go to your local courthouse and ask what the procedures are for your state. They will help give you information or answer your questions. If you appeal pro se the courthouse cannot give you legal advice.

Search the internet for your states Appellate Court rules and procedures. You may also beable to fine the rules and procedures at the courthouse or law library.

[dipper]

I agree that he is old enough, but there is just something wrong....he has ADHD and his mom decided to stop meds....and when we demanded counseling, she said if he didnt want to go, he didnt have to.  And even after all the trouble at school, she held to that.  The judge has ordered that she get him counseling.  By the way, he was diagnosed with conduct disorder.....but, the counselor billed it as adjustment disorder with a disturbance in conduct so that he wouldnt be labeled.  He got worse with the counselor, so we found a psychologist, and that is when the mother refused anything further.  

It has hurt tremendously as I know my stepson will be in major trouble if there is no change in households.  SHE is responsible for some of his behavior by not disciplining.  Why should he behave?  There are no consequences....she curses dh in front of him, she rules with an iron hand when it comes to dh saying anything, she lies (for example, last year she told ss she was going on a business trip....five days later when she returned she told him she had been with her ex-lover several states away.)   She ignores court orders and even her family doesnt want to take a check from her.

But, I had told dh too that maybe the judge feels she messed him up...let her deal with it.  I know one thing....I have a daughter the same age and had I forced her to stay with me through lies and force in court...my daughter would be unbearable to live with.  For him, he went on like it hadnt happened.  He is not unhappy where he is.  Will he be in drugs at some point?  Yes...probably sooner than later.  Will he be caught shop lifting....definitely.  

When she moved two hours away, I told my dh that ss would be in jail before he was 17.  Within a year, ss had been kicked out of school, burned requiring a two week stay in the hospital and surgery, and now has two criminal charges facing him.  He is only 14.