few questions regarding standard possession

[abby14]

First off I am custodial parent located in the state of texas. we reside 100 miles or more apart.

The kids are about to go with the NCP, aka mom, for the summer. Papers say June 15th, 6pm. This falls on fathers day weekend. Both mom and I are in a disagreement about how the kids should get to her.  she says i have to drop them off at her house because the 15th falls on fathers day weekend. Papers state that on fathers day weekend I am suppose to pick them up from her and drop them back off, BUT the papers also say that during the start of her possession periods, she is to pick them up from me. I feel that she is still suppose to pick them up from me because the kids are already in my possession at that time even though it's the third weekend of the month, her weekend. I just wanted to get input as to whether i am right, or wrong? Because I am very confused.

Also I have another question:

Papers say that i get one weekend if i give notice by april 15th (which i didn't cause i was stupid and didn't pay attention) ... but then it does into detail that if she has extended summer visitation which she does cause of the 100 miles apart thing, than i get 2 weekends. Not sure if i still have to give written notice for the 2 weekends or not. Im just really concerned about this because i want to see my kids at least once over the summer. its 42 days ill go without them and its not like she never gets them. even though we still live over 100 miles apart, she still enforces 1, 3, and 5th weekends. Makes it really hard to travel to pick them up. She doesn't pay any CS and hasn't at all. she refuses and believes she doesnt have too even though its court ordered.  Shes over 12,500 in arrears and nothing is happening. Its like she can just get away with whatever she wants, but if i am a minute late or cant bring the kids to her or so something that she wants, its the end of the world.

Thanks everyone for your help.

[ocean]

Offer to meet half way?
Little confused because if you are primary parent, why would you pick up and drop off to mother if you have custody of them?

Send her an email/text/registered letter in mail (written proof so you can save it): "As per our court order, I have kids 2 weekends during your summer visitation. I would like to see them on xx and xx weekend. If these do not work for you, please send me alternate weekends that I can see them".   See what happens.

When this order was written, were you 100 miles apart? Are the kids school age yet? It seems a lot of travel every other weekend but if it works....

Child support- Go to your child support state unit and ask for enforcement. If they won't or drag their feet, go to family court house and ask to file: contempt of court papers for non-payment of child support. Does she have a job that can her check get be garnished? file taxes that can be garnished? Driver's license suspended? Non-payment that much in my state would land her a few days in jail. File and let her answer why she is not paying. It is up to her to modify the existing orders. If you are not with your state child support agency, go there and file to have them take over.

[abby14]

Yes cause it states that at the start of her possession periods, she is to pick them up from me and i am to pick them up from her at the end. BUT since this is the third weekend of the month and i have them cause it's fathers day weekend, but her summer doesn't start till the 15th, and i already have them in my possession, i didn't have to pick them up from her for fathers day ... she seems to think that i need to bring them to her which i don't agree. it can go both ways, but i almost want to refuse to bring them which is why i am asking opinions in here because i don't want to be in contempt.

The order was written 100 miles or less. we recently moved in december 212 miles and she absolutely is willing to drive all the way down here which sucks for me cause i have to drive back and my wife and i are struggling to make ends meet as it is.

yes she was ordered by court to pay child support BUT they aren't lifting a finger no matter how much i call. they just keep sending her letters, so they say.  And now i am out of that county so going down to the court house there where she is would be hard cause i work all day, unless i could do it in this county.

well if written notice isn't given my the 15th of april than even sending her something and asking her wont do any good. than she will tell me that she will let me have them for 2 weekends, but she wants make up time, is what she calls it. anytime she has to miss her days she wants make up time.

Offer to meet half way?
Little confused because if you are primary parent, why would you pick up and drop off to mother if you have custody of them?

Send her an email/text/registered letter in mail (written proof so you can save it): "As per our court order, I have kids 2 weekends during your summer visitation. I would like to see them on xx and xx weekend. If these do not work for you, please send me alternate weekends that I can see them".   See what happens.

When this order was written, were you 100 miles apart? Are the kids school age yet? It seems a lot of travel every other weekend but if it works....

Child support- Go to your child support state unit and ask for enforcement. If they won't or drag their feet, go to family court house and ask to file: contempt of court papers for non-payment of child support. Does she have a job that can her check get be garnished? file taxes that can be garnished? Driver's license suspended? Non-payment that much in my state would land her a few days in jail. File and let her answer why she is not paying. It is up to her to modify the existing orders. If you are not with your state child support agency, go there and file to have them take over.

[ocean]

Call child support and say:  "how do I get this case into your enforcement division"?
Call family court and ask if the filing papers are online or if they can send them to you. Here we can print them out online, fill them out and send them back in for court date. You are looking for "contempt of court for non-payment for child support".

You can hold your ground and tell her "it is father's day and want to spend the time with the kids, if you want them for your summer break either a. come get them at xx time from my house or b. come get them on Monday if that works better for you. I will not be driving them to you as that is not court ordered" Then ignore until she gives you an answer.

You can also ask for modification of visitation as you are now xx miles apart. Are kids school age? I would not start this paperwork until next school year starts so kids are in school by you. Maybe offer one long weekend a month according to school breaks instead of all that driving or if she stays in your area more time. Are the kids okay with the drive? I am thinking as soon as kids get a little older this will not work anyway and you will be back in court. You can say that you have not received child support and can not keep up with the travel costs until she starts to pay. If she does not start paying soon, and you are on top of child support they will go after her license. You sure she has a license? Ask child support if they suspended it yet? That is the first threat they use here.

[abby14]

her license is already suspended. her husband drives her down here.

But what I really care about the most is wanting to know if i can still legally have them for 2 weekends during her extended summer visit even though i didn't give notice by april 15th? cause it only says for one weekend and is there any where else in the papers that say about not giving written notice? i wanna know how yall interpret it as?

this is what it says...

If PRIMARY CUSTODIAN gives POSSESSORY CUSTODIAN written notice
by April 15 of each year, PRIMARY CUSTODIAN shall have possession of the
child on any one weekend beginning Friday at 6:00 o'clock p.m. and ending at
6:00 o'clock p.m. on the following Sunday during any one period of possession
by POSSESSORY CUSTODIAN under Subdivisions (e)(1) or (e)(2) provided
that if a period of possession by POSSESSORY CUSTODIAN exceedsthirty (30)
days, PRIMARY CUSTODIAN may have possession of the child under the terms
of this subdivision on any two (2) nonconsecutive weekends during that time
period, and further provided that PRIMARY CUSTODIAN picks up the child
from POSSESSORY CUSTODIAN and returnsthe child to thatsame place.

Call child support and say:  "how do I get this case into your enforcement division"?
Call family court and ask if the filing papers are online or if they can send them to you. Here we can print them out online, fill them out and send them back in for court date. You are looking for "contempt of court for non-payment for child support".

You can hold your ground and tell her "it is father's day and want to spend the time with the kids, if you want them for your summer break either a. come get them at xx time from my house or b. come get them on Monday if that works better for you. I will not be driving them to you as that is not court ordered" Then ignore until she gives you an answer.

You can also ask for modification of visitation as you are now xx miles apart. Are kids school age? I would not start this paperwork until next school year starts so kids are in school by you. Maybe offer one long weekend a month according to school breaks instead of all that driving or if she stays in your area more time. Are the kids okay with the drive? I am thinking as soon as kids get a little older this will not work anyway and you will be back in court. You can say that you have not received child support and can not keep up with the travel costs until she starts to pay. If she does not start paying soon, and you are on top of child support they will go after her license. You sure she has a license? Ask child support if they suspended it yet? That is the first threat they use here.

[ocean]

Should you have child, yes but you should have gave her notice too. Give notice now and see how ex reacts. She will have child so you will be at her mercy to give child to you without going back to court over it. If she says no, they you can either file with the courts this week and you should get in about 3-4 weeks which might be too late for this summer but you can get more detailed orders.
Ex: Mother will have child from the Monday after Father's day at 9AM until July xx at 8pm. Father will have parenting time on the 3 rd Friday with mother at xx time until sunday at xx. Very very detailed. That way there is no more writing letters in April. Then you both can plan vacations way in advance knowing what days you will have child.

[abby14]

what the funny thing is though, i JUST discovered that in the 100 MILES OR LESS order it states that i CAN GIVE 2 weeks notice if i want both weekends BUT in the 100 MILES OR MORE apart it doesn't say that. what's the difference! It doesnt make sense!

[Kitty C.]

In the '100 miles or more' part of the order, does it say anything that the same rules/orders apply?  Look for language that states that even with a change, the same criteria applies.  Read it carefully, as it's easy to miss.

[MixedBag]

Papers say June 15th, 6pm. This falls on fathers day weekend. Both mom and I are in a disagreement about how the kids should get to her.  she says i have to drop them off at her house because the 15th falls on fathers day weekend. Papers state that on fathers day weekend I am suppose to pick them up from her and drop them back off, BUT the papers also say that during the start of her possession periods, she is to pick them up from me.

Here's how I see this -- not that it makes logistical sense...ok?

She is to pick up the children on June 15th at 6 pm -- and she'll take them 200 miles back to her place.

You pick up the children on June 16th Father's Day -- spend the day with them and then return them that evening.

Does it give a start time for Father's Day?

Since she moved -- this year, it logistically doesn't make sense anymore.....

So I agree with the suggestion to offer to meet her half way on Father's Day -- since you all have been sticking to the normal 1/3/5 weekend plan.

ALSO -- I'm wondering -- in Texas, for a long distance plan, HOW does that change weekends every month?

[abby14]

well i further read it and it said that ONE weened can not interfere with her extended summer time. These papers make no sense. BUT however, my wife just showed me a facebook message where my kids mom told my wife that she said i could have them for one weekend in the summer even though i didn't give written notice. How legit could that be for me? So i could at least have ONE weekend because she is greedy and rude and ugly like that and no matter how many extra time i've given her just to be nice and keep the peace, she never does that in return. Reason i have custody is cause both of our kids were born with cocaine in their system and CPS took them away from her but not that they are 3...they've been having to go with her and its just been a nightmare.  I still fear for them when they are over there, not knowing what is happening.  She admits to paddling them when they are back and a few times they have come home with bruises on their side. But i can't afford a lawyer.  Im lost and i don't know what to do!!! very frustrated father ...

In the '100 miles or more' part of the order, does it say anything that the same rules/orders apply?  Look for language that states that even with a change, the same criteria applies.  Read it carefully, as it's easy to miss.

[abby14]

Well we were the ones that moved. not her and yes this really needs to get revised. But i suppose she is right, since i am to have them this weekend, being HER weekend and its fathers day weekend, i do have to bring them so i minus well just bring them in sunday because i don't want to spend fathers day without them.  Its me again, throwing in the towel just to make her happy.  Its all starting to make sense talking to yall.  Its been really helpful.  My wife has been boggling her mind going through the papers trying to get this worked out.

Papers say June 15th, 6pm. This falls on fathers day weekend. Both mom and I are in a disagreement about how the kids should get to her.  she says i have to drop them off at her house because the 15th falls on fathers day weekend. Papers state that on fathers day weekend I am suppose to pick them up from her and drop them back off, BUT the papers also say that during the start of her possession periods, she is to pick them up from me.

Here's how I see this -- not that it makes logistical sense...ok?

She is to pick up the children on June 15th at 6 pm -- and she'll take them 200 miles back to her place.

You pick up the children on June 16th Father's Day -- spend the day with them and then return them that evening.

Does it give a start time for Father's Day?

Since she moved -- this year, it logistically doesn't make sense anymore.....

So I agree with the suggestion to offer to meet her half way on Father's Day -- since you all have been sticking to the normal 1/3/5 weekend plan.

ALSO -- I'm wondering -- in Texas, for a long distance plan, HOW does that change weekends every month?

[MixedBag]

ok....many of us here are/were NCPs....

SO....as an NCP, you as the CP already have tons of time with the child so yep, I expect you to be the one to give "more" than the NCP.  Every time as the NCP, when I'm asked or the perception was created that I had to GIVE UP time with my son -- that stung.

NOW, I respect that you are the CP for a very valid reason....  I was also a CP for my two girls.  And once I became the NCP, In many senses I learned to be more flexible with my girls with their father where I was the CP....

There's some anger lingering still -- and be very careful about how that helps you make decisions for the kids.

Valid anger considering how they were born, but please be careful.

I had to learn that "Mother's Day" was just another day -- it wasn't even SPECIFIED in my order....nor was Father's Day....

I had to learn New Year's Day was just another day -- another Holiday not specified, Halloween, his birthday, my birthday....  so we adjusted and life went on.

If you moved -- you could get "stuck" with all the transportation -- yep, happened to me, but I managed to get a CS offset for many of those years (I was military, so moving was part of my career).   

Post away.....vent away....we'll do our best to help

[Kitty C.]

MB makes a point....is there anything in your order that specifies holidays and, if so, is Father's Day included?  If it does, does it say anything about holidays taking precedence over regular visitation or vacation time?  If it does, then technically you don't have to give the kids to her until Sunday evening.  As far as who drives (and there's no clear-cut answer), the standard rule of thumb is 'he who wants, fetches'...meaning if she wants them, she comes to get them and then you pick them up when it's your time.  And you're still splitting the cost of transportation that way.

[MixedBag]

Kitty...yes, BUT HE moved away and made the distance so much bigger....HE created the driving problem....KWIM? 

I also wonder if there's something in the TX State code that give guidance and directions about moving away over 100 miles...and did he follow that?

[MixedBag]

BTW -- not trying to start an argument....just a healthy discussion because you'd rather have the discussion here than with an EX who might explode in your face and then not be able to think clearly.

And I promise to be polite....you might not like my opinion, but it's just that -- an opinion and we all have one of those right?  Just like "butt holes!"  smile!!!!

[Kitty C.]

No argument here, MB!  Just having a 'senior moment', LOL!      If I had read a little more carefully, I would have known that!

But I think the issue of who has the children on Father's Day is still a legitimate issue.  I know that DH's order specified Mother's and Father's Day as holidays and holidays superceded regular visitation and vacation time.  Which is why I can't figure out why he wouldn't have the kids on Father's Day...unless his order is like yours and makes no mention of it.

[MixedBag]

I agree -- that he should have them on Father's day in this case -- since it seems the order mentions the holiday specifically.

That's why I said "logistically" though, it's a nightmare.

Mom gets them starting Saturday at 6 pm.....

Dad gets them for Father's day -- but does the order give starting and ending times for that day?

Father's day is THE next day.
Dad moved creating the logistical problem....

So....I think that's the meat of the important facts.

[Kitty C.]

Yup....certainly has spun my head sufficiently, LOL!!!  Unless one of them is willing to go the distance and do a lot of driving, I don't see any other way around it.

[MixedBag]

Well....what ended up happening?