50/50 custody, night with mom day with dad???

[Savant]

First let me thank everyone here who has been giving advice.  This is my first post here, but when my XW filed for divorce a year ago this place was very helpful for me to read through for information.

Here is my question, I'm sorry it's a long one.  Right now we have a 3-4-4-3 split arrangement at the advice of a CFI.  At first I was skeptical that this would work since I was a full time SAHD before the divorce.  But the 3-4-4-3 split has been good for me- I'm starting to get a life outside the home again yet I still get to see my kids frequently and be a Dad to them.  It has taken me some time, but I have finally more or less adjusted to this schedule, and the kids seem to be doing as well as can be expected under the circumstances.

Well, now my X has told me that she wants to change to a new job, new shift and new schedule.  She said that the kids are telling her that they only want to have one home and not two, and she says that they have been telling her that they don't like being switched back and forth so much.  Strange that they haven't mentioned this to me, when I have a very open relationship with them both.  The "solution" my X has presented is this;

She suggests that I have the kids each day and she has them every night.  This way she can work during the day, and since I work from a home office I can pick the kids up at school and keep them until she picks them up after work and takes them to her house.  She said that even though child support is determined by overnights, that she would write up an agreement that this would not change child support as it is currently calculated.  She suggests that I would have the primary bonding time while they are awake, since she would mostly have them while they are sleeping.

Does anyone else see any huge red flags yet?  She wants me to believe that this will be for my kids' best interest.  Basically it seems to me that she wants me to be a day care and nothing more.  Tucking the kids in at night is a very special bonding time for me.  Home is where you lay your head at night.

I told her that I did not like this idea and she got quite angry.  She accused me of trying to stunt her career growth and forcing her to keep the schedule she currently has (swing shift working weekends).  She said that this is a very common arrangement for 50/50 custody situations.  I told her that I'd never heard of anyone doing this in a 50/50 custody situation before.  She said that I needed to do more research.  So here I am, doing more research.

Has anyone ever heard of this arrangement before in a 50/50 custody situation?  Besides the obvious fact that according to the state, custody is determined by overnights so I would in effect be giving her 100% custody of the kids, except for a piece of paper which is essentially meaningless, I would basically be allowing the precidence to be made that she is their primary (or even sole) caregiver, would I not?  Does this scream PAS to anyone besides myself?  Am I wrong to be so concerned by this suggestion?  I appreciate any and all thoughts on this.  Thanks!

[Jade]

>First let me thank everyone here who has been giving advice.
>This is my first post here, but when my XW filed for divorce a
>year ago this place was very helpful for me to read through
>for information.
>
>Here is my question, I'm sorry it's a long one.  Right now we
>have a 3-4-4-3 split arrangement at the advice of a CFI.  At
>first I was skeptical that this would work since I was a full
>time SAHD before the divorce.  But the 3-4-4-3 split has been
>good for me- I'm starting to get a life outside the home again
>yet I still get to see my kids frequently and be a Dad to
>them.  It has taken me some time, but I have finally more or
>less adjusted to this schedule, and the kids seem to be doing
>as well as can be expected under the circumstances.
>
>Well, now my X has told me that she wants to change to a new
>job, new shift and new schedule.  She said that the kids are
>telling her that they only want to have one home and not two,
>and she says that they have been telling her that they don't
>like being switched back and forth so much.  Strange that they
>haven't mentioned this to me, when I have a very open
>relationship with them both.  The "solution" my X has
>presented is this;
>
>She suggests that I have the kids each day and she has them
>every night.  This way she can work during the day, and since
>I work from a home office I can pick the kids up at school and
>keep them until she picks them up after work and takes them to
>her house.  She said that even though child support is
>determined by overnights, that she would write up an agreement
>that this would not change child support as it is currently
>calculated.  She suggests that I would have the primary
>bonding time while they are awake, since she would mostly have
>them while they are sleeping.
>
>Does anyone else see any huge red flags yet?  She wants me to
>believe that this will be for my kids' best interest.
>Basically it seems to me that she wants me to be a day care
>and nothing more.  Tucking the kids in at night is a very
>special bonding time for me.  Home is where you lay your head
>at night.
>
>I told her that I did not like this idea and she got quite
>angry.  She accused me of trying to stunt her career growth
>and forcing her to keep the schedule she currently has (swing
>shift working weekends).  She said that this is a very common
>arrangement for 50/50 custody situations.  I told her that I'd
>never heard of anyone doing this in a 50/50 custody situation
>before.  She said that I needed to do more research.  So here
>I am, doing more research.
>
>Has anyone ever heard of this arrangement before in a 50/50
>custody situation?  Besides the obvious fact that according to
>the state, custody is determined by overnights so I would in
>effect be giving her 100% custody of the kids, except for a
>piece of paper which is essentially meaningless, I would
>basically be allowing the precidence to be made that she is
>their primary (or even sole) caregiver, would I not?  Does
>this scream PAS to anyone besides myself?  Am I wrong to be so
>concerned by this suggestion?  I appreciate any and all
>thoughts on this.  Thanks!
>


The piece of paper wouldn't be meaningless because you will get a judge to sign off on it.  Keep in mind, that she can file for a modification at a later date.  If she does that, you can always file for a modification of parenting time.  

I don't have 50/50 custody nor would I have agreed to that at my kids' ages.  

Sometimes kids will tell one parent something that they won't tell the other parent.  I would ask them what they think of the possible new arrangement.  I know that my kids would have a hard time with 50/50, especially the youngest, she would probably handle the arrangement that your ex is proposing better.  You would get to see them most of their awake time.  You would be the one who was having more influence on them rather than a daycare worker or babysitter.  

If you do decide to do this, I would get child support modified as there will no longer be any child care costs.  

[Savant]

It's possible that they are telling her things they don't tell me; I know that they tell us what they think we want to hear.  For instance they tell her that my friends don't like her (friends they haven't even seen since the divorce), and they tell me that they like my house more than mommy's house.  They play to the band.  

Just to clarify, right now they are not in day care because their mom works four 10 hour days and has the kids the other 3; on the weeks she has them a fourth day she works at home that day with help from her mom watching the kids.  Since I work at home I manage to bend my hours around the kids' needs on the 3 or 4 days that I have them each week.

[FatherTime]

Moveaway or Child support reasons seem to be on the horizon.

http://www.spig.clara.net/  
Look for the parenting plans.  (although NONE of those 50/50 parenting plans would work for Jade, it's simply not in the best interest in her situation)

I don't have 50/50 custody nor would my daughter's mother have agreed to that at any age.

Overnights count.  Have you spoken to an attorney...because it sure sounds like she has spoken to a very smart one.  How did she know that Child Support is determined by overnights? No judge would allow an agreement to dictate to the state about how to determine child support for the children and how much the state could collect for child support.  REMEMBER: the states are paid $$$ for every dollar of child support that they collect through their system.  

You said that she became "angry"  when she didn't immediatly get the agreement that she wanted from you.  You said that she accused "YOU" of trying to stunt her career growth and "forcing" her to keep the schedule she currently has with you.  Some women blame the children for stunting their career growth.  

Why all of a sudden is best interests of children such an important issue when she wants it to be HER WAY.  Best interests are being served now.  Just because she SAYS that the children tell her that they WANT only ONE home.  

HOW WOULD HER NEW SUGGESTION RESOLVE THE CHILDREN'S ISSUE WITH being switched BACK and FORTH soooo MUCH?  Also, maybe the children are saying that they don't like being switched back and forth so much, because they want to get their parents back together in ONE home.


BIG RED FLAGS

p.s.  this just occurred to me...be careful.  Do you take witnesses on dropoffs and pickups?  I stated before that my daughter's mother would not agree to 50/50, but she actually did for a very short period of time, because another state's laws mandate 50/50. (something about it being in the childs best interest)  But she rectified her situation because she brought up false claims and changed her mind about what state she wanted to live in. A judge only has to believe her for an instant and your whole life can change.  Be aware of claims of child abuse, confrontations, and false claims.  Just be aware or beware.

[Jade]

>It's possible that they are telling her things they don't
>tell me; I know that they tell us what they think we want to
>hear.  For instance they tell her that my friends don't like
>her (friends they haven't even seen since the divorce), and
>they tell me that they like my house more than mommy's house.
>They play to the band.  
>
>Just to clarify, right now they are not in day care because
>their mom works four 10 hour days and has the kids the other
>3; on the weeks she has them a fourth day she works at home
>that day with help from her mom watching the kids.  Since I
>work at home I manage to bend my hours around the kids' needs
>on the 3 or 4 days that I have them each week.


Then I wouldn't agree to a change based on the above.  If she is really concerned about her career path, you could always offer to take them on the days she has them, she could pick them up.  And you would still have them for the full-time that you would normally have them.  This way, she doesn't have to worry about daycare costs, and you don't have to give up overnights.  

[Kitty C.]

Red Flag #1:

She 'claims' that the kids are complaining that they don't like to be switched from home to home so much, so she wants to change the current 1-2 times a week to SEVEN???  Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.  And if you ask her to explain that one, it'll probably just make her madder, thereby proving the point.

Red Flag #2:

If this is supposedly such a big deal with your kids, why haven't they said something to you?

Red Flad #3:

Regardless of what she says about the CS, it still has to be approved by the court.  Just remember one thing (which I bet she already knows, but is assuming you DON'T):  Custody is calculated by OVERNIGHTS.  Her 'plan' would essentially make her appear to have sole primary custody, at least on paper (court order).

Red Flag #4:

Ask her to 'prove' that this is a 'common' arrangement, as you've done a lot of research and can't find anything relating to it.  I bet you'll get the same response as #1 above.

Just me, but there's no way on this planet that I would agree to an arrangement like that.  If, and ONLY if switching back and forth so often is a concern for the kids, do week by week, allowing them to only have to switch once a week, instead of 2-3 times.  MUCH more stability for them.

[mistoffolees]

Don't do it. After 6 months of the new schedule, she'll be in court to say that she's been providing 100% of the overnights and she should therefore be awarded sole physical custody.

Note that her promise to write an agreement that you wouldn't have to pay child support is worthless. Unless you can get a judge to sign off on it (which is very unlikely), it's not binding. And even if you CAN get a judge to sign off on it, you'll have to worry about it changing if either of you has a change in circumstance. A new judge might not see it the same way.

What she's suggesting is NOT a common 50:50 arrangement. Ask for evidence.

I don't see any reason to change what you're doing.

[Savant]

Thank you Father Time for the link!  

She had an attourney, but her attourney asked to be withdrawn from her case.  I do have an attourney but haven't spoken with her since orders were set.  

She knows that overnights are used to calculate custody because this came up during deliberations.  I'm sure she's counting on me not thinking about it or remembering it because my memory isn't the best when it comes to certain things like numbers- but I don't forget important details like that.

She usually only acts angry when it's clear to her that I am not going to back down on an issue.  Until that point it's all smiles and sunshine.  Usually transfers are done on a drop-off at school/ pick-up by the other parent basis, although not always.  Transfers in person are usually very amicable (on the surface at least).  It's like a cold war or something where we are both very friendly, but behind the smile she is plotting her next scheme and setting traps while I am constantly bracing myself and staying on the alert for those traps.  I have made it clear that I won't discuss these things with her during transfers or in earshot of the kids.

As for increasing the transfer numbers to 7 times a week, when I asked her how this would be better for the kids, she countered with, "Are you saying you don't think it would be in the kids' best interest for them to be able to see both parents every day?"

I talked to my kids last night- my oldest is 6 going on 7 so she is capable of expressing her feelings pretty well.  We had just finished reading "Was It the Chocolate Pudding?" (a book for kids about how divorce is not the kids' fault) which is my youngest child's favorite book right now.  It spoke about how having two homes may not be the ideal situation but that sometimes we have to make the best of the arrangement that we have.   I point blank asked my kids if they felt that they were adjusting to our arrangement okay.  They said that they like the current arrangement very much.  They said that they like both mommy's house and daddy's house.  They did say that they wished we could all live together again, but when I told them that this was not an option and asked if there was anything else we could change about the current situation to make them happier, they said "no".  They actually seemed very happy (relieved even) to be able to discuss it, so I flat-out asked them if they would prefer to sleep at one home each night and spend each day at the other instead of sleeping at both homes during the week like they do now.  They did not like this idea at all and said that they really like things the way they are now.  I for one believe them because I was careful not to lead them or give them any bias one way or the other.  I really just want to know how they feel.

I have been searching for any reference to anyone who has a custody arrangement where one parent has the kids at night and the other during the day, but I haven't yet found any mention of this sort of plan anywhere.

[Savant]

Thank you for your thoughts on this.  It's very helpful to get feedback from others like this, it helps me to better weigh the validity of my own concerns.  I really do appreciate it.

[Kitty C.]

'As for increasing the transfer numbers to 7 times a week, when I asked her how this would be better for the kids, she countered with, "Are you saying you don't think it would be in the kids' best interest for them to be able to see both parents every day?" '

Talk about a contradiction in terms!!!  Remind her that switching once a week provides continuity and stability and for them to go back and forth every day would be extremely disruptive to them.  Obviously, she wants to play hardball for what SHE wants (regardless of what's best for the kids).........just keep in mind what's in their best interests and stick to your guns.  Just remember, if standing your ground just makes her madder, sooner or later she'll probably blow her stack and at the very least prove to the court she doesn't have the kids' best interests in mind.

Sure would be interesting to find out why her atty. withdrew.........;-)