Have to be honest, I have a problem with this board...

[Troubledmom]

What is different between Moms wiothout custody versus dads without custody?

** The societal view of each gender, and their role in raising the child/children of a marriage or relationship.**

Societal views of Mothers without custody is the FIRST AND BIGGEST DIFFERENCE!!!!!

**BUT, when we meet a CUSTODIAL Dad, our first thought, even by those of us that KNOW that Dads are just as good as Moms at raising the children, is "Wow, what did she do wrong?".**

WHAT TOTAL BIAS a NCP Mom must deal with!!!!! Does an NCP Dad hear "What did you do wrong?" Hell no... because we all "know" all he did wrong was be born male right?

What happens if she did nothing more wrong than attempt to make the best decision she could at the time for her children? Not all mothers without custody are like your Ex GR8... Some are wonderful mothers who attempt to make the best choices they can in the moment and spend the rest of their lives hearing what a piece of s*** they are because they did.

And that being said...

Thank-You to everyone who made this board possible and who provided what we can hope will be an oasis for the 10-15% of us who understand what it is like to be an NCP Mother.

Hopefully this will bring all our children one step closer to EQUAL Parenting Time :-)

TM

[olanna]

And you gave him far more of an answer than I would ever consider!

BRAVO!! BRAVO!!!

[Granny]

I work with a caseload of 1300 students.  Some live with their moms, some live with their dads.  What I see as a commonality is that the parents whether mother or father have the same problems with the kids so to me what is important is that there is a balance in the children's lives.

Many of you know my family's story...I have learned a lot through the school of hard knocks.  TM and Sly have been there through it all to walk along side to kick me when needed and comfort me when needed.

The courts have some changes that need to be made - we'd all agree with that.  I believe Judges are fallible just as the rest of us are.

Yes, the laws need to be changed, and in my state I'm working on that...  It's not just about my family..it's about all the kids out there.

The best gift imo that any parent in a separated setting can give to their child is to reinforce the other parent.  This means don't denigrate the other parent.

The biggest thing I see in kids I work with is that they have been deprived of one parent and it comes back to bite the cp during the teenage years.  It's wrong...Both parents are needed to raise up a child - even if one parent isn't what we consider to be a good parent.  What is important is that the children are given what is needed.

From my vantage point, were I do do GAL work at this point in time, I'd try to be fair and balanced, which means looking at which parent will be better at supporting the other parent's parenting of the child.

TCB is correct that it is usually the women here (many who are NCP's) who are the greatest support to the men on the boards.  I am a grandmother and I know the ladies here have helped me tons.

Rather than getting mad about stuff, we have to keep trying...  Get the laws changed if we're not happy with them.  Look at what is good for the kids.  

My experience is that gender doesn't determine which parent is best.

We've learned that you can have the best case in the world and think you have it in the bag...in the end you don't because things happen...

Let's support each other.  I think the idea of a mother's board is great.  Mothers are people too.  The issues are the same.  And..mothers feel the same when they are deprived of their children as father's do.

We need to have a little bit of heart for others.  Remember it's not about only us.

Granny

[Gecko]

[em]Please explain what is different about women without custody over men without custody.[/em]

Think about what you said...that society assumes that when a father has "custody", that the mother did something wrong.  

A man who fights for custody and loses...is a martyr.

A woman who fights for custody and loses...is obviously a "bad" mother.

A man who chooses to be a NCP because it's the best thing for the children...is a good father.

A woman who chooses to be a NCP because it's the best thing for the children...is a selfish mother.

JUST as society and the courts can be BIASED against fathers when it comes to divorce, they are JUDGMENTAL with regards to mothers.  

[Butterfly]

The ideal is that there would be parenting equality between the genders however reality is far from it.

It is prevalent right now that NCFathers endure the gender bias during the custody battle/divorce proceedings.

NCMothers endure the societal gender bias the moment AFTER becoming a non-custodial parent and forever more.  

For the most part, NCFathers are NOT considered societal lepers if they are the non-custodial parent.  It is NOT automatically assumed that the father is a unfit parent because he lost residential custody placement of his child(ren).


The majority of the NCMothers that are on this board truly believe in shared parenting.  They believe that both father and mother are what is best for a child.  Operative word, BOTH.

Whether you want to admit it or not (you wouldn't know, you do not have any experience being a non-custodial MOTHER), there are some experiences non-residential/custodial mothers endure that non-residential/custodial fathers are not subjected to because societal expectations on each familial role is DIFFERENT.  It isn't the same nor are the mainstream expectations of each parent so there is a disparity in how each gender is treated within the exact same parental category.

It is wonderful to meet other NCMothers who have similiar role experiences...I can relate to NCFathers on most NCP issues, but not all of them.  I suppose until I see NCFathers walk into a classroom and have it implied that he did something wrong to be a non-custodial parent...will their be equality as NCPs.  Just as I know that NCMothers cannot possibly know how it feels to begin a custody battle at a disadvantage due to gender bias BEFORE losing custody.

[Brent]

Well said!

[redhead]

"That is just my opinion, I could be wrong."


You are so wrong.   Thank you for acknowledging it.

[Meighan]

The stigma attached to non custodial moms has nothing to do with society or....gender roles or ANYTHING except maternal instinct. While in college I learned about the chemical/biological aspects of maternal instincts and was intrigued/fascinated and I stood in awe of of how we as humans are created.  The class was taught by a secular minded and pretty objective professor and honestly..the bottom line is that maternal instinct is fierce and incredibly powerful.  Men cannot identify with it.  It's hard to say that to a man b/c it seems to be construed as some sort of insult.  

However this is simply not the case.  Mothers and fathers compliment each other to form a complete puzzle if you will..for lack of a better term. When a woman is apart from her child there is an incredible tear in the fabric of the very depth of her being and nothing anyone can say will ever be able to change that.  That said..when a mother is away from her child people instinctively know what something is wrong.  Not wrong in the sense that the mother screwed up.  Wrong in the sense that we as humans recognize...even if it's subconsciously....that the maternal instinct and bond is real and if a mother and child are seperated the pain is unreal and both mother and child go through hell.  The same hell is experienced when a father is seperated with a child as well..but on a much different level.  We carry our babies inside of us.  

They know the sound of our heartbeat.  They have seen the inner part of us that even we will never know. We feel their first movements and bond with them before anyone else does.  We create food especially for them and our bodies will let us suffer before they will let the unborn ever go without.  This is fact.  It is real.  And even if we aren't aware of these things....our minds still know and this is why society wonders how a woman can be away from her child.  It is possible and it happens regularly in our society.  Keep in mind that only in American and less frequently in Europe is it viewed as acceptable for mothers to be away from their children.  The mother/child relationship is sacred in most other countries.  Anyways..my point is that this attitude will never go away. It can't.  And it doesn't detract from the role of the father at all.  Be secure in knowing that as a father you are the rock.  No one else can ever be that.  

-Meighan

[justme73]

I see no problem with SPARC, but in some ways you are absolutely right. When people meet a non-custodial Dad, they think nothing of it.... like the child's school for example. But say a non-custodial Mom shows up requesting a copy of progress reports for her child (this has happened to me many times)... immediately there is a prejudice against non-custodial Mom's because people believe that if that Mom lost custody she must have done something terrible. It doesn't occur to anyone that simply not having legal representation could lose a case for you right away. and non-custodial Mom's are faced with obstacles beyond experiences with her ex. School administrators are aprehensive and sometimes rude about request of records.  and suddenly we don't feel comfortable in our own children's school. like an outcast. i cannot say that this doesn't happen to non-custodial Dads, but that certainly they are overlooked (unjustly) and non-custodial Moms are judged (unjustly).
it is difficult to even answer questions, when at the doctor's office or registering my child for extra cirricular activities.... to tell someone that i am not 'primary residential parent'... i am embarrassed...... it begins to make me feel like i did something wrong, when i know i did not and i know, without hesitation that i am what is best for my children. you cannot expect to get justice in court... and to me that is sad.

[sweetnsad]

WOW....I just don't know what to say!!!  What a mess this has become....

Well, I guess, for me, the biggest thing is that we are all here for our children.  To do what is best for them.  And whether you are a CP or NCP,  it doesn't matter.  

Everyone is entitled to their opinions on various issues, but doesn't fighting about the name of a certain board take away from why we are all really here?