parenting plan

[daddyjoe]

Hello,
In the parenting plan it states (the box next to religion is checked for her not joint) that the mother of my children chooses the religion. There are no previsions that are defined just the box is checked. She admits she has no preference for religion at this time. At the time religion was of no concern to me but now it is. I have been taking the children to church with me on Sundays (Sunday school/day care/preschool) and she has called me and demanded that I not take them anymore. I feel as long as I don't baptize them there should be no reason for them not to be with me when I go, and because of that I haven't chosen a religion for them. I think what she does on her time is her business as long as the children are safe from harm. She is quite determined to have them not go to the point that she will pick them up early from my visitation. I really don't think this is about them going to church but is just another way to cause some kind of conflict. What are my legal rights can she file contempt of court charges on me or is this all BS and I can do what ever I want with the children during my time?

[DecentDad]

If the court orders don't preclude you specifically from taking them to church, then do it.  I agree that you're safe as long as you don't proclaim them to be Christian (e.g., in public or through baptism), as that's obviously her right.

She has no authority to pick them up early.

Just ask her in writing, "What religion do you choose for the kids?"

If her answer is "None", that doesn't follow the orders (i.e., stating that she CHOOSES the religion).  If her answer is in writing, you've got it to show the court.

It depends upon the exact language of the orders, the terminology next to the box checked.  If it includes "religious activity" then you're screwed.  But if it's "Choice of religion", then you're probably okay.

If she were to file contempt on you, the court is going to have to find that you're in contempt of court for exposing your kids to a Christian religion and order that you cease.

That has constitutional implications that no court would ever touch with a ten foot pole.

DD

[daddyjoe]

Hey,
The box said "choice of religion" mother, father, joint, I checked mother. it was a basic disolution of mariage, a uncontested divorce. No court just filed...90 days later it was finished. As long as they can go with me then Im fine with what ever harpens, i just want to be sure that if she files contempt of court Im not going to look like the bad guy. One month ago she denied me visitation on one of my weekends I had a lawyer look at the parenting plan then write me a letter stating it was not her right to choose when the children get to visit. That my weekends are to be fallowed as the PP states and that there are no previssions stating detailed circumstances. I should have filed contempt of court but I would really like to keep things as nice as possible for the kids, but she took the letter just as bad as if i were to file contempt of court charges. I really think this is just another control boundry we are setting I just want to be legal. I did figure as long as they go but arent baptized im not really choosing a religeon they are just attending a fun event with other children.

Thank you for your speedy response I greatly appreciate it.

[DecentDad]

Ok, you're fine.

Contempt is a very technical thing.  If there's any room for interpretation, then you're not going to be found in contempt.  I think your position is a plausible one-- while you're engaged in faith-based activity with the kids, you're not declaring them to be of a certain religion in the eyes of the public nor in the eyes of God (baptism).

On the other hand, the parenting schedule outlined is very clear... if she doesn't comply with it, she's in contempt.

"Being nice" is only good if it's not at the sacrifice of resolving conflict.  It's much less traumatic for the kids to experience temporary anxiety over the parents' apparent conflict resulting from a contempt hearing than to experience years of arguing over whether or not the kids will be going to their father's home, based upon the mother's whim.

If she threatens to withhold the kids again, advise her in writing (with delivery confirmation via USPS or via certified mail) that she'll force you to file contempt if she is not willing to stick to the court ordered parenting schedule-- an action that you won't be happy about but must pursue as the only option available to you.

You may also want to advise her (in writing) that you welcome her choice of religion, and you'd be willing to raise the kids in whatever religion she chooses.  But absent her choice, you'll be exposing them to XXX beliefs per the common background the two of you share.

If need be, that letter will show the court that you were trying to respect her authority to pick a religion, but she refused to communicate such choice to you.  Very reasonable position for you.

DD

[littlebit]

Not to be argumentative, but I have a completly different take on this.

What you are presuming is that a religion must be chosen by BM or she loses her right to make religious decisions.  That is wrong.  She is well within her right to decide that the children will be raised agnostic; complety void of anything relating to religion.  With that in mind, I view your bringing them to church against her will as defying the parenting plan.

In addition, there is no time limit on her making her decisions.  If she is "soul-searching" for the next 10 years, you still cannot expose the kids to a religion without her approval or changing the current court order.  

Whether or not you make a formal showing of your beliefs, such as baptism, is irrelevant.  Taking the children to any type of religious function that BM disagrees with is contempt.  Especially since she has made her wishes very clear and you continue to defy them.  Trying to say that a church function is just a fun get-together for the kids will not hold water.  

On a positive note though, it will probably be pretty easy to get the current order modified.  Unless she can come up with a darn good reason that the kids should have no religion instead of yours.  Judges, GAL's, etc are highly favorable to church involvement.  It's just a good invironment for families.  

So my advice is to get the plan changed ASAP.  It will be almost impossible to do later if BM decides to join a church and get the kids involved.  Very unlikely you'll be able to change it after the fact.

[spinner]

Personaly I agree with the others thinking that "contempt" is really hard to prove.
A check box doesn't describe the boundaries.
She can choose the religion, it doesn't say you can't either.
Technicaly she has the final say BUT that doesn't mean you can't choose either.

Bottom line is you are bringing to the kids family values and no judges will go against that.

I'd be you, I'd even baptise them.
How old are them?
Do they understand what religion is and why they go to church?

If yes then explain them what being baptised mean and ask them to decide. (have a tape recorder in the room recording) and if the kids want it and they are old enough to understand religion (7 is called "reason age").
Anyway, she can decide their religions after that and even file contempt, who cares. It won't fly in any court if the kids made the decision.

[ocean]

I do not think that he is our of bounce with taking his children to church. He is being respectful to her choices but the children are being exposed but not going to relgious education. If they go to public school, they will be learning about Hannauka, Christmas, and Kwannza. My children are learning to be respectful of every culture/religion. The school is not teaching to one but just exposing them which is what I think he is doing. Of course, BM can bring him back to court (for anything).

[daddyjoe]

Well the children are 4 and the twins are almost 2, I have an appt with a family law laywer tuesday at 1pm. I will post what she has to say for future reference....Thank you all for all the input it is greatly appreciated.

[daddyjoe]

I would like to say thank you all for your input on this...it is greatly appreciated!!!!

The lawyer quoted from some court cases in the state of Washington and it said:
In a marriage dissolution decree, restriction on a parents constitutional right to the free exercise of religion in regard to making decisions as to a Childs religious upbringing must be based on a substantial probability of actual harm to the child from exposure to the parents conflicting religious beliefs. Any restriction may be no broader than nececary to prevent harm to the child.

She also stated that the court wouldn't grant her the "contempt" unless there was undeniable truth of the children being harmed, and that the court tries to stay away from any and all religious conflicts. So I basically see it as long as I am not in some cult I am perfectly in my right to bring them up as Christian.

[wendl]

Are you in WA as well??

**These are my opinions, they are not legal advice**