Have tricky situation..experts needed!!

[mistoffolees]

>Mist,
>
>It is medically necessary, per the original post, to map the
>child's future (the genetic mapping of the disease will
>indicate what is most likely to happen later in life such as
>secondary conditions, etc.). It could also provide an
>indicator of a more effective treatment to utilize.

Sorry, but that doesn't meet any standard of 'medically necessary' I've ever seen. You might try, for example, http://www.spannj.org/Family2Family/medically_necessary_services.htm.
The original post admitted that it might not make any difference but MIGHT help to map future treatments. But since no one knows whether it would be beneficial, it's not going to meet the standard.

Furthermore, even if it WERE medically necessary, I'm not convinced that the courts have the authority to require someone else to submit to testing. For example, if you have kidney failure, do the courts have the right to order your sister to give you her kidney? Of course not. Different magnitude, but same rule. The courts have a very high regard to respect for privacy and personal rights.

Don't let what you THINK should be done confuse the matter of what the courts have the right to order.

[notnew]

He's still a piece of shit in my opinion. I know that doesn't go far in the court's eyes, but if he doesn't do what is right for the child - he will get his in the end. Karma has a way of biting you in the ass one day.

Thanks for your objective view. It is good to have someone who can keep the emotional aspect of things separate. It's just hard to swallow sometimes.

[mistoffolees]

>He's still a piece of shit in my opinion. I know that doesn't
>go far in the court's eyes, but if he doesn't do what is right
>for the child - he will get his in the end. Karma has a way of
>biting you in the ass one day.
>

Before labelling someone, it's worth remembering that you're only hearing one side if the story. I've been around enough to know that he would undoubtedly tell a very different tale.  Don't jump to conclusions based on one side - especially when that side is clearly very emotional about the whole thing.

While I agree that it would be reasonable for him to give the blood samples - BASED ON THE INFORMATION PROVIDED, that doesn't guarantee that we know the whole story.

[Kitty C.]

But the courts DO order testing all the time.......psychological testing.  And to be honest, there's no difference in the eyes of the law.  Testing is testing, whether it's physical or mental.  So if the courts can order a psych eval. AND technically hold someone in contempt if they refuse, then they have the capacity to order tests like this also.

[MixedBag]

And everyone is making good arguments or points -- there is no clear cut answer.

Kitty makes a good point down below -- but so do the others.

Is dad gonna be on the hook for child support "forever" since the child is (more than likely) be a dependent adult?

No, planning for a future is not unrealistic even if its down the road.  You know best as to what you and your child are facing.

I would keep asking dad to provide the sample and yes, I would be trying to get the court to support ordering dad to provide the sample until the court told me nope.

It's about helping the child who is already facing tough challenges....

[Sunshine1]

Misto-  Normally I never agree with you, but you are correct, to a degree, I can't force him to submit to testing, but the bulb isn't too bright and I can scare him into thinking he has to by drawing up a motion and filing it.  In all likelyhood he will go after that.

Notnew- yes he is a piece of shit.  His own family agrees completely.  He forces me to speak to his wife and his wife only of which I do not agree with and something I do not do to my current husband.  I had children with him, not her, and my current husband had kids with his ex, you deal with her.  (to ease Mistos one sided story- I have oodles and oodles of emails and voicemails and letters stating that his wife comes first and I will never come between them, therefore since they are married she has ever right to speak to me about the children and or be involved in everything we talk about.  I believe he should discuss things with her like scheduling and visits and the like,but HE should discuss it with HER NOT ME.  He believes I should be forced to deal with her directly and WAY too much has happened for me to have a civilized conversation with her.  I would like to deal with him, not her, and he will not allow that.  If I call there, I am put on speaker and she gets to say whatever she likes to me.  So therefore I do not speak to her and since I don't, he will not speak to me. No amount of counseling on the planet will fix this.  I have NO problems dealing with him.  If I could get him into a room alone, we would be fine.  She has some kind of spell or control issue over him like I have never seen before.   2 judges told her to keep her nose out of it, and that we should never have any reason to speak, and one final point is she is bi-polar NOT medicated, and has tried to kill herself at least 35 times in one year.  She is ordered to never be alone with our children, because she tried while they were in her care.  Plenty of police reports filed by my ex on HER to back up my side of the story.


Kitty- I think your right too, they order testing for child support too and hold you in contempt if someone points a finger at you and says "your my baby's daddy", so maybe this will be one for the record books??  They order DNA testing, Drug testing, Random UA's, treatment, psychological testing, counseling etc...how is this different from any of that?

All I am really looking for here is what I should call my motion? Like I said he hates court, so if he sees I am serious about this, he will more than likely go do it.

[mistoffolees]

>But the courts DO order testing all the
>time.......psychological testing.  And to be honest, there's
>no difference in the eyes of the law.  Testing is testing,
>whether it's physical or mental.  So if the courts can order a
>psych eval. AND technically hold someone in contempt if they
>refuse, then they have the capacity to order tests like this
>also.

Actually, they almost never do in a case like this. In this case, the father has nothing to do with the son. The only time I've ever seen psychological testing ordered is if it's there to determine whether the child is safe with a parent - and even in that case the parent is free to decline (although they're not going to get to see the kid, then).

I can't imagine a scenario where a court would order psychological testing for an absent parent.

[mistoffolees]

>Misto-  Normally I never agree with you, but you are correct,
>to a degree, I can't force him to submit to testing, but the
>bulb isn't too bright and I can scare him into thinking he has
>to by drawing up a motion and filing it.  In all likelyhood he
>will go after that.
>
>
[snip]
>
>All I am really looking for here is what I should call my
>motion? Like I said he hates court, so if he sees I am serious
>about this, he will more than likely go do it.
>

Sorry, but I happen to be a person that believes that the ends don't justify the means. You admit that your motion is invalid, but you're going to submit it anyway to blackmail him into doing what you want - even though you admit that the court would never agree.

In fact, if by some odd chance he were to find your post here and submit it to the court, you could technically be in contempt.

I'd find it pretty hard to sleep at night if I resorted to unethical behavior like that.

I've already given my suggestion that doesn't involve any unethical behavior. If you prefer underhanded actions, I guess that's your privilege.

[Sunshine1]

Blackmail?  I don't believe I would call it blackmail, and I have every intention of trying to ask the court for help.

I think the court will agree using supportive arguments that this will make his life more fruitful and with any substantial findings could make him a candidate for gene therapy.

Unless you have a special needs child you will never know what a parent will do or try to help their child.

If I gotta blackmail him, threaten him, hog tie him and duct tape him and bring him to the dr's office to get him to submit to 3 viles, yes all that is required is THREE viles of blood and he can be on his merry way, I will do it.

I am absolutely positive you would do the same if you were in my position and had a chance at a "cure" or half a cure, you would do everything in your power to make the other parent submit to the testing.

If I have to be underhanded, and unethical, that isn't what doesn't let me sleep at night, its knowing that my kid has a father that has dumped him and doesn't give a rip if he lives or dies.


BTW, we have a "normal" child together too of which is the ONLY recipent of Birthday cards and Christmas cards, and Easter cards.  So if you are trying to convince me to not be deceiving to get him to do what his child needs...your barking up the wrong tree.  I am way beyond that point.

[mistoffolees]

Whether you like it or not, 'blackmail' is the word for what you're doing. You admitted that the court would not order him to give the blood, yet you're going to file, anyway, in the hopes that he'll give in to avoid court. That's blackmail.

Yes, I'm sure that you think this is important. It may even be as important as you claim. But until you've exhausted legitimate methods, I think resorting to blackmail makes you every bit as bad as him.