Support order appears to only be medical?

[Liz]

I will attempt to make this brief, no promises. Case is in MD.

Went to court in April of last year. No mention of the amount in the support order, or arrears were brought up during the hearing. We only discussed medical insurance during the hearing.

The findings of the facts of the hearing master does not state arrears, when they started ect. It is completely left blank.

Order is sent to an old employer and I discovered that they were taking arrears from Jan of 2005, via this paper. The 2 page court order arrives with NO mention of either support payments or arrearages.

I sent a Motion for Clarification and 8 months later its still not been dealt with.

The CSE agency sent the IRS a withholding order on tax refund, ect. However I do not have a copy of the arrearages, amount to be paid, or anything with the length I should pay the extra they say I need to pay towards arrearages. (I hope that all makes sense).

I have attempted to contact the office several times and no one returns my phone calls, and obviously writing things doesnt do much good as it is still not being dealt with at present.

The paperwork that they have sent me stating I have an arrearage is just a computer generated paper. I have nothing with these figures signed by a judge. NOTHING.

Questions:

1. Should the order clearly state the amount I am to pay each month for the "basic" support payment?

2. Should I have a detailed order that says from when the arrearages started, how much extra I am to pay, and for how long those payments are to continue?

3. Any suggestions on what I should do next?

[socrateaser]

>Questions:
>
>1. Should the order clearly state the amount I am to pay each
>month for the "basic" support payment?

Depends on whether it's the court order of support or the wage assignment order sent to the employer. They are two different things -- one is the actual order stating you owe support and/or arrears and how much, and the other is an order to the employer to take part of your wages to satisfy the court's support and arrears orders.

>2. Should I have a detailed order that says from when the
>arrearages started, how much extra I am to pay, and for how
>long those payments are to continue?

You should have an order stating the support and arrearrage, and the terms of repayment. However, as to how it was calculated, that would be a findings and conclusions of law, which you may or may not get in writing, depending up whether you asked for it at the time when the findings and conclusions were made verbally by the court.

Obviously you didn't ask, because you didn't know you were entitled to ask. That's why people have attorneys represent their interests -- so that the government doesn't trample them into the ground.

>3. Any suggestions on what I should do next?

Generally, when there is an error in an order, the person who is having his/her money garnished, pays enough attention to make sure that no more money than required is being taken.

A child support wage assignment is confirmed by operation of law if not objected to within 10 days of receipt by the employee. This has been going on for over a year, based on your facts, so you will have a lot of trouble explaining to the court how it is you just now noticed that the employer has been taking more of your money than lawfully allowed.

In short. You're probably SOL.

But, there must be an order in existence somewhere, in order for CSE to garnish your wages. The order may be an administrative order instead of a court order, but it must exist, and there must have been some sort of hearing during which the order was issued.

You may not have been present, and you have almost certainly lost your opportunity to object to the order. So, the order is either at the county courthouse, if that's where your original support action was heard, or it's at CSE if the order was produced by an administrative hearing officer. Either way, you should be able to obtain a copy from one or the other location.

You can file a motion to modify support, and then obtain a calculation of your arrears already paid and remaining, as well as a new calculation of ongoing support.

But, you need to hunt down all of your orders, so that you know what the heck your modifying, or the court will be as confused as you currently are.

[Liz]

>Depends on whether it's the court order of support or the wage
>assignment order sent to the employer. They are two different
>things -- one is the actual order stating you owe support
>and/or arrears and how much, and the other is an order to the
>employer to take part of your wages to satisfy the court's
>support and arrears orders.

It was the wage assignment order, that was sent to my employer.




>>2. Should I have a detailed order that says from when the
>>arrearages started, how much extra I am to pay, and for how
>>long those payments are to continue?
>
>You should have an order stating the support and arrearrage,
>and the terms of repayment. However, as to how it was
>calculated, that would be a findings and conclusions of law,
>which you may or may not get in writing, depending up whether
>you asked for it at the time when the findings and conclusions
>were made verbally by the court.
>
>Obviously you didn't ask, because you didn't know you were
>entitled to ask. That's why people have attorneys represent
>their interests -- so that the government doesn't trample them
>into the ground.

As far as the amount, I am not really required to pay that much even tho currently, my employment leaves me with 91.00 for the month. It sounds like a lot but, its not. I baby sit one child on a part time basis to make the money for the "unknown" support order.

What I have a problem with, is the lack of an order with amounts, arrearages calculated, and repayment spelled out, and signed by a judge. I am afraid in the end I am going to be royally screwed.

>>3. Any suggestions on what I should do next?
>
>Generally, when there is an error in an order, the person who
>is having his/her money garnished, pays enough attention to
>make sure that no more money than required is being taken.
>
>A child support wage assignment is confirmed by operation of
>law if not objected to within 10 days of receipt by the
>employee. This has been going on for over a year, based on
>your facts, so you will have a lot of trouble explaining to
>the court how it is you just now noticed that the employer has
>been taking more of your money than lawfully allowed.
>
>In short. You're probably SOL.
>
>But, there must be an order in existence somewhere, in order
>for CSE to garnish your wages. The order may be an
>administrative order instead of a court order, but it must
>exist, and there must have been some sort of hearing during
>which the order was issued.
>
>You may not have been present, and you have almost certainly
>lost your opportunity to object to the order. So, the order is
>either at the county courthouse, if that's where your original
>support action was heard, or it's at CSE if the order was
>produced by an administrative hearing officer. Either way, you
>should be able to obtain a copy from one or the other
>location.
>
>You can file a motion to modify support, and then obtain a
>calculation of your arrears already paid and remaining, as
>well as a new calculation of ongoing support.
>
>But, you need to hunt down all of your orders, so that you
>know what the heck your modifying, or the court will be as
>confused as you currently are.

I have checked all records and there is no record of another hearing, unless that was what they did for 10 minutes after they asked me to leave the court room, saying we were "finished". My ex stayed.

That is why I sent the Motion for Clarification that they are sitting on, and have been sitting on  for 9 months now. They insist they are working on it but I dont believe this for a second. Everyone who needed to be served has been served.

I called 2 Fridays ago and requested ALL orders signed by a judge, as that will clear up the "confusion". To date I have heard nothing from my case worker by phone or in writing.

1. Can I attempt to get a rehearing based on the fact that I do NOT have an order with amounts anywhere? Only on the paperwork that the CSE office is printing out for employers.

*Remember the 2 page order is signed by a judge but ONLY discusses medical issues, no amounts are listed anywhere.*

Thank you for your time.

[socrateaser]

>I called 2 Fridays ago and requested ALL orders signed by a
>judge, as that will clear up the "confusion". To date I have
>heard nothing from my case worker by phone or in writing.
>
>Thank you for your time.

You keep referring to a motion for clarification that you "sent." I don't know what that means exactly, or to whom you "sent" your motion, but if I were representing you, I would file a motion to modify support and for clarification of your existing arrearages with the COURT, not with CSE, and I would serve CSE, and the other parent to appear. Then we could sort it all out with the judge who would then make appropriate orders and that would be the end of it.

If you keep dealing with the CSE "case workers" you will never get anywhere. Their interest is in maximizing the collection of child support. You are asking for help from your opponent, and that is a supreme waste of time.

[Liz]

I guess I wasnt clear and I am sorry for that.


The motion for clarification was to clarify the orders in the beginning after I recieved them. Its been filed with the court, they have a copy on file, the CSE and the other parent has been served.

No one seems to know whats going on with it. Its just sitting in limbo.

Problem is an attorney is gonna cost me more, to get this mess straightened out than actually just paying the amount.

The other problem is I am afraid that since they have set the amount, they would decide that I am impoverishing myself because I have had 3 other children with my new dh. Getting a full time position doesnt make any sense when you have to pay for child care for 3 children under 5.

1. Do you think I could get a modification despite this?

Thank you again for your time :)

[socrateaser]

>I guess I wasnt clear and I am sorry for that.
>
>
>The motion for clarification was to clarify the orders in the
>beginning after I recieved them. Its been filed with the
>court, they have a copy on file, the CSE and the other parent
>has been served.
>
>No one seems to know whats going on with it. Its just sitting
>in limbo.
>
>Problem is an attorney is gonna cost me more, to get this mess
>straightened out than actually just paying the amount.
>
>The other problem is I am afraid that since they have set the
>amount, they would decide that I am impoverishing myself
>because I have had 3 other children with my new dh. Getting a
>full time position doesnt make any sense when you have to pay
>for child care for 3 children under 5.
>
>1. Do you think I could get a modification despite this?

I have no idea if you can get a mod or not. CSE rarely attempts to prove earning capacity so as to impute income -- they just ask for an order based on minimum wage. If a parent wants to prove a higher earning capacity, that means hiring vocational evaluator expert witness, or having some other pretty credible evidence of earning capacity, like last year, you made 100K and this year nothing, because you voluntarily quit working so you didn't have to pay daycare. lol.

But, if you have a clarificaiton motion before the court, and you haven't received any discovery from CSE, and you formally requested it, then I would send a letter requesting production within 5 days or you will move for an order to compel and for sanctions.

You have to keep the ball moving, or they will just sit on you forever.

[Liz]

Well technically I never volutarily quit anything! I only worked for 1 year, the rest of the time (from age 17) I have been a stay at home mom. The most I have made in that year was just under 12,000.00. Affording 455.00 for day care on that pay just doesnt work so well.

Anyway thats kind of beside the point! lol


I will definetely keep on them.

Thank you again.

[Giggles]

CSE has a website where you can see your case, what is owed and how much is in arrears:

http://www.dhr.state.md.us/csea/

You will have to register for an account, but since your case is with CSE, it shouldn't be difficult.

Click on E-support.
Register for the site and you should be able to see what is going on...

Hope this helps some.